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Obama Fomenting A Constitutional Crisis: Constitutional Lawyer Discusses Ramifications
The Bulletin ^ | 12/1/08 | John Connolly

Posted on 12/01/2008 6:04:32 AM PST by pissant

Controversy continues to surround President-elect Barack Obama's eligibility to serve as president, and a case involving his birth certificate waits for its day before the U.S. Supreme Court. A constitutional lawyer said were it to be discovered that Mr. Obama is not a natural-born U.S. citizen, it would have grave consequences for the nation.

According to the Constitution, a president must be a natural born citizen of the U.S. Mr. Obama's critics have failed to force him legally to produce his original birth certificate, and Mr. Obama has resisted any attempt to make him do so. Currently, only Hawaii Department of Health officials have access to Mr. Obama's original records.

Some of Mr. Obama's critics have said he was born in Kenya and have claimed he is a citizen of Kenya, Indonesia, or even a British subject.

Edwin Vieira, a constitutional lawyer who has practiced for 30 years and holds four degrees from Harvard, said if it were to be discovered Mr. Obama were not eligible for the presidency, it would cause many problems. They would be compounded if his ineligibility were discovered after he had been in office for a period of time.

"Let's assume he wasn't born in the U.S.," Mr. Vieira told The Bulletin. "What's the consequence? He will not be eligible. That means he cannot be elected validly. The people and the Electoral College cannot overcome this and the House of Representatives can't make him president. So what's the next step? He takes the oath of office, and assuming he's aware he's not a citizen, then it's a perjured oath."

Any appointments made by an ineligible president would have to be recalled, and their decisions would be invalidated.

(Excerpt) Read more at thebulletin.us ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Extended News; Front Page News; Government; US: Hawaii
KEYWORDS: bcrepository; birthcertificate; certifgate; certifigate; democrats; larrysinclairslover; obama; obamatransitionfile; obamatruthfile; repository; stbc; vieira
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To: Non-Sequitur

“One of the reasons why I don’t believe the Court will find Donofrio’s arguements persuasive. For them to agree with Donofrio, or you, would mean Obama and McCain are both ineligible, and could make it hard for any candidate to establish credentials. Giuliani, for example, would have to prove that his grandparents on both sides were naturalized citizens before his mother and father were both born, otherwise they are not U.S. citizens. And if they are not U.S. citizens then Giuliani is not a U.S. citizen. The arguements would be endless.

If Rudy’s parents were born in the US, Rudy is a natural born citizen and would qualify for the Office of President.
So even if Rudy’s grandparents were nationalized citizens, and were born outside the US, Rudy’s parents born on US soil would be citizens of the US. Their children would then be natural born citizens, as Rudy is.


181 posted on 12/01/2008 9:26:25 AM PST by seekthetruth
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To: dpa5923
Instead, the electors would likely vote for either Biden (God help us) or Hillary. They are not bound by law (except in a few states) to vote for the popular vote winner in their state. They can legally vote for whom they want, but being party loyalists, they are not going to vote for the opposition.

Yup, good post. Totally agree with your conclusions. They will vote for Hillary. As bad as that would be at LEAST it would be constitutional.

182 posted on 12/01/2008 9:28:27 AM PST by DouglasKC
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To: hoagy62
If custody of that document is lost to anyone who opposes Obama, the document will be questioned as being a replacement brought by the people who siezed it.

Not an option, I am afraid.

183 posted on 12/01/2008 9:28:57 AM PST by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly.)
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To: couchpotatoxxx12
Who do we get then? Biden? Pelosi? Hillary? We lose either way.

All three are natural-born U.S. citizens and would do slightly less damage than Obama.

184 posted on 12/01/2008 9:32:34 AM PST by Extremely Extreme Extremist
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To: MHGinTN
I don't think the U.S. Supreme Court would be satisfied just accepting Fukino’s word, even under oath (when a official document exists). It would be considered by most (true patriots) as dodging the issue completely and having no creditability. I hope for better than this from the court (at least 4 justices, possibly 5).
Just hoping, guessing and praying.
185 posted on 12/01/2008 9:32:37 AM PST by The Cajun (Mind numbed robot , ditto-head, Hannitized, Levinite)
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To: AU72
It would not be the SCOTUS making him ineligible—if they rule that anyone who runs must show proof of citizenship.
It would be Obama causing it by not being able to submit such proof.

If this is ignored, the real Osama bin Laden could run and at least win in Detroit.

186 posted on 12/01/2008 9:34:59 AM PST by nclaurel
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To: sickoflibs

I think we should go after this. It is time that the conservatives stop rolling over.


187 posted on 12/01/2008 9:35:15 AM PST by Chickensoup (we owe HUSSEIN & Democrats the exact kind respect & loyalty that they showed us, Bush & Reagan)
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To: Sacajaweau

“I have to think like a lib...And say that “then Hillary” would have been the “legitimate” candidate and libs would scream that since their vote “didn’t count” for Obama, they would have voted for Hillary...and therefore, Hillary should be President.

IMHO, Obama will someday be called “The Illegitimate President”.”

Yeah - but then again, SOME voters (prolly the GOP that voted DEM) would have said that they would NOT have voted for Obama if they KNEW he was ineligible AND they would have NEVER voted for Hillary ...

How do you quantify the ones that WOULD have voted DEM in a different election (for Hillary) and those who would have voted GOP?

Obviously, a new election NOW would be fair, but it is NOT provided for in the Constitution ...

A sticky wicket for SCOTUS ...

IF SCOTUS does anything, I think they would toss Obama (Biden maybe - maybe not) and let the 12th Amendment take care of the mess ...


188 posted on 12/01/2008 9:36:08 AM PST by Lmo56
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To: mel; All

I look for the Hall of Records housing his long form birth certificate to burn to the ground before it would ever be produced.


189 posted on 12/01/2008 9:36:36 AM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: Centurion2000

“Actually if he is disqualified the next highest Presidential candidate to collect electoral votes would become President.”

I disagree in part.

What happens if the electoral college goes ahead and gives the electoral nod to Obama since he won the popular vote as well?

We are looking at a Marxist scheme that will completely delegitimize our election process. Bush won in 2000 on a “technicality” as interpreted by the SCOTUS, however it was law and the Democrats tried to change the law after the fact.

I don’t know if our Constitutional law process has ever had to deal with this kind of election challenge. The only fair way, in my mind, to legitimize the election would be to take Hillary Clinton, who was a close 2nd in the Primary’s and enter her in a 30 day runoff election with McCain. The deeper Obama gets into the cabinet nomination process only muddies the waters deeper.

Who knows? I am not a lawyer nor a Constitutional Scholar. And I doubt if peon citizens opinions will ever matter anyhow.


190 posted on 12/01/2008 9:39:25 AM PST by o_zarkman44 (Since when is paying more, but getting less, considered Patriotic?)
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To: Non-Sequitur

This information came from his mother in all likelihood and even Obama said in his book he didn’t believe what she or his grandparents told him.


191 posted on 12/01/2008 9:40:21 AM PST by nclaurel
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To: so_real

“He takes the oath of office, and assuming he’s aware he’s not a citizen, then it’s a perjured oath.”

Would not a “Perjured” Oath of Office for the office of the President of the United States be treason? It is a willful undermining of the highest government office in the nation, not to mention the same of our military. Barry Soetoro would be wise to consider his actions carefully. He’s playing poker all-in and bluffing with a soft hand. He might win the pot, or it might cost him everything.

IF OBAMA IS INELIGIBLE, he MAY have ALREADY committed perjury.

I have seen the South Carolina Election application that he signed stating that he was eligible for the office ...


192 posted on 12/01/2008 9:40:50 AM PST by Lmo56
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To: Non-Sequitur

Biden was chosen by Obama and if he is proven a fraud why would this choice of Biden hold up any better than any other thing he signs or does.


193 posted on 12/01/2008 9:42:46 AM PST by nclaurel
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To: Chickensoup

RE : I think we should go after this

Be my guest. Just dont expected elected republicans to get involved. Pelosi won two elections big with a ‘keep the Impeach Bush crowd, including Sheenan, locked up”. WE Cant have our elected look like sore losers, remember “Sore Looserman” ?

Otherwise see what the courts do. I am curious.


194 posted on 12/01/2008 9:48:59 AM PST by sickoflibs (McCain asks: "Did you stupid conservatives really believe me? HA-HA-HA, wait til 09")
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To: pissant

I’ll hand over the crowbar.


195 posted on 12/01/2008 9:51:41 AM PST by Chickensoup (we owe HUSSEIN & Democrats the exact kind respect & loyalty that they showed us, Bush & Reagan)
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To: cpdiii

“Per Congressman Billy Bob if he were declared inelgible before the Electoral College votes Dec. 15th, the electoral college could elect anybody they want.”

I disagree - although CBB is the constitutional lawyer ...

Reason?

Fruit of the Poisonous Tree doctrine.

Just like a bad warrant tosses all evidence seized subsequent to it, so would Obama’s electoral votes be tossed.

The States would have to re-certify with new electors (without Obama’s).

People don’t seem to realize that there are MORE potential electors than a state has votes.

FOR EXAMPLE:

MD (where I live) there are 10 electoral votes ...

HOWEVER: Between the DEMS and GOP, there are 20 possible electors (20 different individuals).

Obama “won” MD, so HIS 10 electors are being certified.

However, IF he is ruled ineligible, THEN HIS electors will be ruled ineligible.

When MD re-certifies, they will base it on the popular vote (without Obama) and McCain’s electors will be certified.

Electoral voters CANNOT be certified by a state when the election was based upon the perpetration of a fraud ...


196 posted on 12/01/2008 9:53:42 AM PST by Lmo56
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To: sickoflibs

There is a big difference bwteen soreloserman and perjury and lying. This doesnt look like sore loser. This looks like enforcing the Constitution.


197 posted on 12/01/2008 9:53:58 AM PST by Chickensoup (we owe HUSSEIN & Democrats the exact kind respect & loyalty that they showed us, Bush & Reagan)
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To: Tatze
What happens to ‘natural born citizen’ status when one becomes a citizen of a nation that does not allow dual citizenship?

Nothing, unless you actively renounce your US citizenship.

198 posted on 12/01/2008 9:55:36 AM PST by Citizen Blade (What would Ronald Reagan do?)
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To: pissant
One FReeper admitted in another thread to voting for him, so I extrapolated.

LLS

199 posted on 12/01/2008 9:56:11 AM PST by LibLieSlayer (GOD, Country, Family... except when it comes to dims! I am an UMA-unity my a$$)
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"Silence can only be equated with fraud when there is a legal and moral duty to speak or when an inquiry left unanswered would be intentionally misleading," the ruling reads.
200 posted on 12/01/2008 9:57:20 AM PST by llevrok (Feral Conservative)
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