Posted on 09/22/2008 3:33:32 AM PDT by HAL9000
Excerpt -
The Northern Fleet heading to Venezuela
Order warships Northern Fleet went to the ocean trip, which will take place ships in ports of entry of Venezuela. The military stressed that this action was not politically motivated
Moscow. September 22. INTERFAX.RU - Russia is determined to step up military cooperation with Caracas: Monday detachment of Russian Northern Fleet warships went to the ocean trip, which will take place ships in ports of entry and Venezuela held in conjunction with a fleet of the country's teachings. "The squad is to ship nuclear missile cruiser" Pyotr Veliky ", a large anti-submarine ship" Admiral Chebanenko and escort ships. All of them on Monday left the item based Northern Fleet - Severomorsk, "- told Interfax-AVN" Assistant glavkoma Navy Captain Russia First Rank Igor Dygalo.
The joint Russian-Venezuelan naval exercises are expected to take place from 10 to 14 November in the Caribbean Sea. The ships of the two countries is done a number of joint tasks, including joint maneuvers, search and rescue at sea, as well as conduct exercises on communications. The holding of joint exercises with the Navy Venezuela planned during the year. The principal decision on its conduct was taken during a meeting between the presidents of Russia and Venezuela in July Prior glavkom Russia Navy, Admiral Vladimir Vysotsky personally checked the readiness of ships for a hike. He went to board the cruiser "Pyotr Veliky" and heard a report from the Northern Fleet commander Vice-Admiral Nikolai Maximov's willingness order to achieve this goal. As reported by Interfax-AVN "Deputy glavkoma Navy for military aircraft and air defense, Lieutenant-General Valery Uvarov, anti-Ka-27 helicopters, which are armed ships destined for a hike, ready to carry out tasks in all climates. "Helicopters are technically good condition. Pilots have received the necessary flight training" - Uvarov said. At the Army detachment of ships is four helicopters Ka-27.
As stressed Dygalo, "the upcoming naval exercises in Russia and Venezuela is not directed against third countries and does not bear any burden aggressive." "In these exercises should not seek any political implication. The exercises were planned long ago and for its scheme. They are like exercises that the Navy Russia conducts with the naval forces of other states - said Dygalo. - Return Andreevskogo flag in the global ocean is becoming a sustainable trend. "
Meanwhile, former commander of the Black Sea Fleet (CHF) Admiral Eduard Baltin believes the holding of joint with Venezuela naval exercises indication that Russia back its position in the world. "This step means that Russia is returned to the stage of its capabilities and international relations, which she unfortunately lost at the end of the last century" - Baltin told Interfax-AVN. " According to the admiral, "military and political presence, which demonstrated the Russian warships, is expensive." He recalled that in Soviet times a year to 70 thousand Soviet military seamen ashore in foreign ports around the globe. Navy ships of the Soviet Union, according to the admiral, saw friendship. "Demonstration of the flag is an element of political influence, also created favorable conditions for the development of economic relations", - said Baltin, who commanded the Black Sea Fleet during 1993-1996. "No one likes weak. So weak nations, no one wants to have a relationship - neither economic nor political-military, because it is not appropriate" - said the expert. He noted that the same U.S. remains a huge network of naval bases around the world. "Only in Japan, in Okinawa, which is the fifth largest island country, located 34 item deployment of American troops, the largest naval, air and base" - admiral said.
In his view, the decision to send to the coast of Venezuela Russian warships should not be interpreted as a response to tough U.S. rhetoric against Russia after the events in Georgia. "Such activities planned in advance, annual plans, involving numerous harmonization through the Ministry of Foreign Affairs ", - underlined the admiral.
The Russian military also stress and lack of any connection the recent flight of two strategic bombers Tu-160 to Venezuela to developments in South Ossetia. "We prepared for this problem a long time. Only it was not clear what country would fly. In the end, Venezuela invited us to cooperate. That fateful convergence (flying bombers in Venezuela and conflict in South Ossetia - IF) - nothing more," -- told reporters division commander Maj. Gen. Alexander Blazhenko.
U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice saw politically motivated in the Russian aviation flights, said last week in Washington: "But we are confident that our ties with our neighbors, who seek a better education system to better jobs and better housing will not be undermined several aging bombers, visiting one of the few Latin American authoritarian regimes. " That statement clearly advance the Russian military. Ex-Air Force glavkom Russia, Hero of Russia, Army General Peter Deynekin remarked in an interview with the Interfax-AVN: "otherwise our" partners "to fight terrorism and not to be expected." "As a man who as a pilot involved in government tests Tu-160, I can responsibly say that this is a modern percussion Aviation Complex, which is constantly being improved and developed in terms of its board of precision weapons, including bombs and cruise missiles with a variety of homing systems. If you want these weapons first shock "- said Deynekin.
In any case, Venezuelan leader Hugo Chávez our bombers liked, and he even expressed a desire to fly. He believes that "we now need friends like Russia. I not only Venezuela but also throughout Latin America. For economic development, support throughout Latin America. For the life of the peoples of our continent. For the world. Russia - is a friend of peace" - President of Venezuela, fragments of an interview which handed channel Vesti-24.
Recently, the general director goskorporatsii "Rostehnologii" Sergei Chemezov has reported on military-technical cooperation of Russia with Venezuela. According to him, over the past three years Russia has signed contracts with Venezuela, totaling nearly $ 4.4 billion, and almost all of them have already been implemented. It is recalled S. Chemezov, on the supply of multipurpose Su-30MKV, transport helicopters, Mi -17, A Kalashnikov AK-103 models and AK-104, signed a contract for the construction of a plant for licensed production and bullets to the him.
According to the head "Rostehnology", "Civilization of the plant is ready, started to excavate under the foundation." He added that the signed contract for the establishment of a technical center for the repair of military aircraft and Technical Center to repair helicopters and training for pilots. On the prospect of continued Chemezov, "negotiations on deliveries to Venezuela air-defense systems, modern armored vehicles, including BMP-3. According to him, bearing in mind that in 2009 completed tests Su-35, and 2010-meters will begin its serial production, Venezuelan side expressed interest in this machine.
“more cheaper and more easily “
That’s gotta be some kind of massive grammatical error. Need more coffee.
I took it you were talking about *future* Admins.
This crap is happening now. Where’s Bush?
Spot on. With a very few exceptions, there has been a consistent pattern of failure and/or refusal by Bush to support allies and friends who have come under fire from the media and his political enemies, and an absolutely mind-boggling pattern of failure and refusal to stand up to them and defend himself.
For all of President Bush's good qualities, and they are many, especially compared to his predecessor, this aspect of his persona indicates a major, fundamental character flaw that history will show has cost him, our country, and many of our nation's friends and allies around the world dearly.
You both are right; however, that is not the way it would be spun, though. It would not be spun that we haven’t supported our friends: it would be spun that Bush’s aggressive policies in the M.E. made poor-little Vlad feel threatened.
That’s what I meant by “Bush’s fault”
I agree with you, but I don’t like the optics. Also, their presence does tie up Israel/Allied resources that could be deployed elsewhere.
Yes, it will be spun the way Hugo wants it to be spun, that is, he’s just defending himself from the eeeevil US and the eeeevil Bush.
The thing that is truly sad, though, is that just the opposite is true: if Bush had actually been more confident and aggressive, none of this would be happening. I think it is really, as tarheelswamprat pointed out, that Bush is defeated by a personal flaw, the lack of will to fight back combined with a certain tendency to reserve and self-distancing which has always prevented him from appealing directly to the American people for support. Granted, he was subjected to incredible and outrageously unfair attacks, probably far more than any other president than Lincoln. And while it may be more saintly to simply suck it up and not respond, for a leader, this is not a good characteristic, and a little (or a lot of) fight wouldn’t have been out of place and would have given people something to rally around to support him.
Now it’s really too late to do anything. I guess we’ve just resigned ourselves to having Russia take up residence in the Caribbean.
Not to worry my friends Obama will disArm America and leave the front door open. How will a community organizer posing as the president of the free world going to cope with this? ARE YOU AS COMFORTABLE WITH THIS AS I AM? I THOUGHT SO! WE KNOW WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, THE CHOICE IS CLEAR. MCCAIN/PALIN.
Who is the translator, Master Yoda?
Yup. Monroe doctrine be damned.
Chavez is a fool. The Russian fleet is more of a threat to itself and its hosts. If his intention is to intimidate his neighbors, he may scare them into the arms of his enemies.
1. Lame duck Republican presidency.
2. Democrat controlled Congress.
3. Nearly over-extended U.S. Military.
4. High probability of a Marxist-Socialist mentored Democrat being elected in November.
5. An American public susceptible to “stardom” influenced method of electing leaders.
6. An American electorate with enough gullibility to make someone like Obama garner high poll ratings.
7. 1960s type thinking oozing out of American colleges and Universities.
To people like Putin this jars loose the weather stripping around the window sash for cold war air to seep in. They will play it soft and gentle until November. They don't have much time to wait to begin using crow bars on that window — between November and January.
The window will swing open to them in January, as they see it, but they do not have the nature to wait before flexing muscle. But they will flex in such a way that the American people think they are merely advertising a new designer muscle shirt.
If Obama loses, then they have not damaged the window casing — they just back off for another opportunity.
John McCain realizes the dangers, and I believe that Obama, too, knows exactly what is happening — and welcomes it.
If President Bush knows of nukes or other WMDs being delivered to the Western Hemisphere by Russia, then he certainly should and could act. I don't know that a nuclear-powered war ship itself can be regarded in the same way.
Having spent a couple of years in the Russian Far East, and having actually walked around in several nearly-abandomed arms manufacturing plants there (mid 90’s), I am wondering if these are still laying vacant and still, or if the Russians are re-starting arms production in that region.
The chess pieces are moving around the board, something big is in the offing...what is it. Perception of a weak US embroiled in 2 wars and possibly a 3rd, a Commie Presidential candidate, something is going on.
I understand your point, but you seem to be forgetting that that's already the "spin" that's being put out. The brutal reality that everyone needs to face, from President Bush all the way down to those of us on these boards and at the grass-roots level, is that "spin" (and we really should get back to using its proper name - propaganda) is always going to be a constant.
In fact, it's going to be a "negative" constant because its real purpose has nothing to do with objectively analyzing and critiquing issues and policies in order to solve problems or to honestly assess the success or failure of policies. The primary purpose of "spin" is as a PR and propaganda weapon for vying factions to bludgeon each other with in order to either maintain their own or acquire their enemies' power.
Thus, once you honestly face the fact that playing the spin game is a waste of time and ultimately self-defeating, the logical thing to do from a genuine leadership perspective is to say to hell with the spin and just do the right thing. The best counter to the constant spin storm is simply success "on the ground", as they say, accompanied by a forceful, forthright, clear and unambiguous explanation to the American people of what was done, why it was done, and asking them directly for their support.
President Bush's regrettable inability and/or refusal to stand up and take the fight directly to the media and his political enemies by going over their heads directly to the American people has been disastrous, and has in large measure allowed the Left to come within a hair of putting us in the nightmare grasp of an Obama presidency.
John McCain, on the other hand, has shown that he does have a spark of that fighting spirit to stand up to these forces. His problem, however, is that's he's still absolutely nuts, flat-out wrong on certain issues which have the potential to destroy this country, and can't seem to shake his compulsion to "reach across the aisle". Thus we have the surreal situation where the elites and the media are in the tank for Obama, they really want him to win, but, they'd also settle for a "McCain/bland Establishment VP of your choice" one-term administration which would still enact most of their agenda, to set-up a return for Hillary.
Sarah Palin is a genuine outsider, however, and has blown that scenario away. And that is why she must not be allowed to be in a position for a shot at the White House in the future. She has that same spark and fighting spirit as McCain, without his baggage, and represents an existential threat to the long-term goals and agenda of the elites. And she doesn't speak "spin" - she speaks directly to and connects with the American people, and that is why the elites are terrified of her and hate her viscerally.
Agreed. I agree on McCain and Palin, too. McCain, whatever his many faults are, does always stand up and fight back. I think he's also toughening up on many issues he was weak on at the start of the campaign, which is promising. But I do think, in general, that one of McCain's best - and simultaneously worst, in the past - points is that he really doesn't care what anybody thinks or says once he has decided on something, and he does stand up and defend his positions.
That's a sort of diplomatic answer to the Polish ABM base, probable Georgia's, or Ukraine's joining NATO or to all of them combined.
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