Posted on 05/01/2008 4:44:54 PM PDT by Politicalmom
SAN ANTONIO — A judge ordered that the baby boy born to a girl taken from a polygamist sect's ranch in West Texas be placed in state custody, according to documents released Thursday.
Texas District Judge Barbara Walther signed the order Wednesday giving the state custody of the 1-day-old infant born to a teen believed to be 15 or 16 years old.
The girl has claimed to be 18, according to an affidavit signed by Ruby Gutierrez, a Child Protective Services caseworker, but officials believe she is younger and placed her in foster care with other children taken from the ranch.
The newborn is the teen's second child; the first is a 20-month-old boy. The father of both children was identified as Jackson Jessop, 22, but state officials say they don't know his whereabouts.
Child welfare officials now have 464 children in their custody, swept from the Yearning For Zion Ranch in Eldorado because authorities believe underage girls were forced into marriages and sex with older men. Authorities are also now investigating possible sexual abuse of boys.
Church members have vehemently denied there was any abuse, and civil liberties groups have raised concerns at the sweeping nature of the removals.
Individual custody hearings are set to be completed by June 5.
CPS and law enforcement raided the ranch on April 3 after a girl who was purportedly 16 called a domestic abuse hotline to complain of abuse at the hands her much older husband. Authorities are investigating whether the calls were a hoax.
Regardless, child welfare authorities say 31 of the 53 girls aged 14-17 have children or are pregnant.
Under Texas law, children under the age of 17 generally cannot consent to sex with an adult. A girl can get married with parental permission at 16, but the girls who belong to the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints are not believed to have legal marriages.
FLDS is a breakaway sect of the mainline Mormon church, which disavowed polygamy a century ago.
From the tour of the flds compound, above each beds (even the kids’ bunks) were pictures of Warren Jeffs (in all his glory...pre-mug shot pose). So I guess the ladies were ‘reminded’ what think of....
You do know that in Texas, questioning of children is done by child advocacy centers and both the questioner and the child are recorded on video with multiple copies made for the court, the center's records, the potential prosecution and the potential defense right? You wouldn't just be speculating with no knowledge of the procedures here would you?
As for my reading these threads, I am mostly interested in the sentiments I see expressed here. The outrage at the accusations butts against the necessary exercise of restraint in order to preserve the civil liberties we all rely on to ensure out fundamental freedoms. I am interested in the tension between the two threads of discourse insofar as they represent components of "the conservative coalition."
the808bass: “Anything they (the government interrogators) say is automatically false to you.”
Please don’t misinterpret my post. I wrote I didn’t trust them. I’m suspicious of anything they say or claim. That’s not the same thing, by a long shot, as writing everything they say is false.
I’ll believe them when they prove something to be true, not before.
Polygamy is illegal everywhere. Shacking up with multiple partners is OK though. IF the partners are of legal age to consent.
However polygamy may not apply if she is his first and/or only wife and they were legally married. A big IF to be sure. Even polygamists can have one legal wife. Since he's only supposed to be 22 (and why say that, since saying 21 would make all the sex legal, (3 years or less separation, and the younger at least 14). marriage aside, or at least non prosecutable. If these folks are as devious as some here say, surely they'd have thought of that.)
There was no invalid search warrant. The people at findlaw who have examined the state’s case were likely hoping for that with glee.
I have read as much as the forum rules require and have enough facts to make my argument for a fair trial by evidence, not accusation. But you can polish the paste jewels in your crown if you like.
I would claw my eyes out!
The whole reason the FLDS cult exists is because these guys couldn’t get laid at a nympho convention...they had to create a religion or they knew their DNA would end with them. (Humor)
Really, the I would slit my wrists if that was handed to me as my ‘husband’.
When I view the testimony of former cultists from years before this particular raid, when I read the facts of how many of these cultists have admitted to taking multiple underage wives, when I read the facts of multiple members of this cult having been convicted in courts of law of child molestation, when I read the statements of the prophet on their preferred practices and see that all these things line up with what the state is alleging, I find it more compelling to agree with the current position of the state given what we currently know.
Could that change for me? Yes. If evidence presented in this case becomes contradictory to the government's claims, the former cultist's claims, and the statements of their own teachings.
Could your opinion change for you? I have my doubts.
I have very real jewels, thankyouverymuch. Bought them myself :)
Yeah, that’s it. Blame the 15 year old girls that the men can’t control themselves.
Sounds like the old argument about rape; that the girl was asking for it.
You ought to be ashamed of yourself.
Thanks for an interesting debate and I do listen to your views on this subject.
If everyone agreed with me, I would talk to my cat instead.
I am biased on this subject and have explained why.
When fathers are falsely accused of criminal sexual abuse of their children, they better have darn good proof!
If my daughters had been honest, and not falsely charged their husbands of criminal sexual abuse, they would have retained custody of their children.
Instead, they attempted to abuse the law, and they received the justice which they deserved.
Darn right this is personal!
Almost exactly like this, for “marrying” a 19 y/o to a 14 y/o. (IIRC) Only this case it would have been a 19 y/o to a 15 y/o) Not for raping young girls, except as an accessory to statutory rape, (not called that in Texas if you are looking it up) by virtue of performing the “marriage”. He’s accused of other things, but that’s what he’s in jail for.
They couldn't get laid at a Dell convention. I kid, I kid.
I can yell too.
Your honesty is refreshing. All arguments we make are, to some extent, personal. We cannot separate ourselves from our biases and presuppositions when we take positions. Those who can admit those presuppositions are at a far greater advantage over those who think they have none. Take care and God bless.
What has your comment to do with puddleglum’s comment in post 215 that you’re linking back to? Why address it to the808bass?
Even if she is 18 as she claimed, she was 15 when she got pregnant the first time.
_______________________________________
now, now...
no fair, counting....
BYW, are those “rights” groups there for the under-age girls, or the old pedophiles ????:
Nite sweet one.
Honest...w/o reading the succession of ‘daily threads’ (greyfoxx39 has compiled them—great job!!!) you lose alot of the background. There are so many twists and turns and nuances of the beliefs of this group that you need the background knowledge to be able to discern the events at hand and know why TX authorities have done what they have done.
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