Posted on 02/24/2008 3:50:09 PM PST by kronos77
History has been a harsh critic of Neville Chamberlain's decision in 1938 to allow Adolf Hitler to trash the WWI Versailles peace treaty to seize control of and change the borders Europe, first France in the Rhineland, then Czechoslovakia and Poland. President George W. Bush's quick acceptance of the efforts of the Albanians in Kosovo to change the borders of Serbia will also be viewed in history as an appeasement that did not work.
World War II actually began when Adolf Hitler marched a mere 14,500 troops into the Rhineland on March 7, 1936, in violation of the Treaty of Versailles that ended World War I and the Locarno Treaty which was signed in 1925 that included the "Rhineland Pact" between Germany, France, Belgium, Britain and Italy. The Rhineland Pact's main provision was an agreement among Germany, France and Belgium end border raids, with Britain and Italy agreeing to guarantee the borders in the event of aggression by any of the other states. ... Kosovo is for Serbia a land somewhat similar to what Pennsylvania is to Americans. Kosovo is the cradle of Serbian liberty and the center of their Serbian culture. There are hundreds of structures, churches, monuments, monasteries, that attest to that history. What has happened in Kosovo, with America's help, would be similar to a large group of Islamic fundamentalists, whose hero and mentor is Osama Bin Laden, moving into Pennsylvania over the next 50 years, as Albanians did in Kosovo in the 20th Century, and then voting to become an Independent State with membership in the United Nations, as they burned down the Christian churches, Independence Hall and the Liberty Bell while driving out and seizing the property of the remaining Christians, Jews and non-Churched homeowners.
(Excerpt) Read more at renewamerica.us ...
qifsha nonen
Serbian Policy like that of the English Crown’s American Colony policy, could lead to war.
Don’t worry my friend. There are many on FR with more common sense than idiots like Jason C. I know several brave Americans who have served in Kosovo and they all thought quite simply - “The Serbs got screwed on that Kosovo deal.” And this was years ago before Kosovo declared independence.
Are you serious? You can't be serious. "Rampant alcoholism"? LOL! You missed the "bayonetting of Albanian babies" part. The only places in the Balkans approaching a failed state are the ones run by NATO/UN: Bosnia & Kosovo. Serbia has had a 6%-7% growth per year since 2004, unemployment is falling, FDI stood at $5B last quarter, the Belgrade Stock Exchange is white hot and tourism is booming again. Meanwhile, Albanians in Kosovo can't even take care of the garbage collection duties. The fact that the Radicals are in the Parliament is proof that Serbia's democracy works. You win the votes - you get the seats.
Oh, btw, the electricity and half the water needs in Kosovo for the past 9 years have been provided by Serbia. Free of charge.
About your hate for the Serbian people - you need some education obviously:
The Serbian cultural identity has a deep affinity for and derives very directly not only from Christian civilization, but that other twin pillar of western civilization - Hellenism.
I laugh when the likes of Solana and Kouchner - exemplary atheistic, marxist murderers - lament whether Serbia will ever become a part of “Europe”.
Serbia is more “Europe” than just about any country in the EU at present and Serbs should join those few other traditional societies and avoid the grotesque self-hating and self-destructive circus of secular eurabia!
Alcoholism is a major factor in the violence in the Balkans, on all sides. The videos of the violence in Belgrade last week show that most of the mob is staggering drunk. Alcoholism is rampant in Belgrade’s government too. If Serbia had sobered up after Slobo was deposed, it would have improved their prospects of regaining control of Kosovo. But it’s too late now.
Gerbil.
Russians have to plan as if that were going to happen.
The Serbs are NOT the right side. You may have a case to make if you claimed that we should not be on either side of this conflict, but to claim that we are on the wrong side is completely false. We are on OUR side. The only “right” side is America’s side. Anyone who sides against America is a traitor or an enemy, no matter what their reasons.
About your hate for the Serbian people - you need some education obviously:
Patrioti, the only people I hate are turks!
King Lazar-—
I was reponding to the stupidity posted by Tailgunner Joe...you did not differentiate and I thought it was you.
Turks suck big time - for sure.
ZHTO H ELEFTHERIA!
I believe President Bush is still running Clinton’s failed, dishonest, unethical and illegal policy in Kosovo.
now that was funny.
"give us just a little more time...." as the song says, it's not over 'til the fat lady (or Obama) sings...
Indeed it is a foreign policy circus. The hypocrisy of our nation has reached new heights in both militaristic and economic fronts and the world isn’t buying it. But I say hell to the world, start at the top of the creators of such problems and clean house. This of course is easier said then done and something that will likely take another couple of elections and truly accountable faces running the nation. The American people have just begun whispering for blood and asking who is to blame. Over the next five years this whisper for blood will become screams.
I agree who caused the current situation in Kosovo (Clinton) why he did it (Wag the Dog) and who is now supporting it (Bush kissing collective Islam’s *ss).
This needs to stop but it won’t, because this administration has had a bad habit of avoiding historical research and effective counter-measures. Methinks it’s time to build 3,000 advanced drones, a dozen more B-2’s and a lot more submarines.
Then, let’s get out of no-win-for-the American-people areas of the globe such as Kosovo, Germany and South Korea. We should redeploy along the Afghanistan border and have National Guard being used to beef up our own northern and southern borders for training, intel collection and further border patrol protection.
“Maybe if Clinton had bombed your capital into rubble and turned part of the USA over to muslim nutjobs you would have a different opinion”
I second your motion. Serbia was one nation amoungst dozens of nations whom we viewed as abusive to their own populations. But to assume we have the right to bomb to change who rules the country on the ground is beyond despicable and that is Bill Clinton.
I’ll also add providing on-site access to the Chinese of our nuclear and ballistic secrets in exchange for campaign contributions is outright treason. You can safely say I won’t be visiting the Clinton Library anytime soon.
“this has nothing to do with the old cold war and the get those commies, we have moved on and are now fighting another enemy who wears no uniform and they are binladens cronies”
On your other comments, I agree that we are on the wrong side of this conflict and furthmore, see no real strategic value in being involved in the Balkans at all for America.
It may be an energy problem at the end of the day we are trying to solve for our allies but that is Europe’s problem, NOT OURS. We have our hands more then full.
But one thing you may or not be aware of is the source of Bin Laden and terrorism in general. The main source is proxy nation puppets like North Korea and Iran that China and Russia fund directly and indirectly. The second or just as equal source of terror is Saudi Arabia, whom funds Whabbaism jihad crap all over the globe. Now it appears to me from a top-level that our Administration’s policy is to kiss the behind of Saudi Arabia and collective Islam as a whole. This puts us at odds with true freedom and promotion of global justice that America once stood for. Until Saudi Arabia and Iran stop promoting global terror, you will simply see escalated attacks with higher mass casualties, until the wig finally comes off the Dragon and the Bear and we stop buying Saudi oil (or we are forced off it because they WILL eventually uncouple the crumpling dollar from them).
The true solution for our nation is to have the political will to become energy independant. This would all but guarantee our nation’s survival under the current political infrastructure. But I don’t see this happening, I only see more extreme plays into the ME and EU for the last few decades worth of oil while our citizens go bankrupt.
War for this precious resource and on a global scale will result if we do not stop feeding the oil machine allowing our enemies to become stronger while we are fiscally (and no doubt militarily) drained. I feel bad for the Serbian people whom held off the Islamic hoardes in the past but the play is much bigger and severe then just Serbia itself.
“I view Kosovo independence as a tentative win for world-wide democracy and freedom. I think more people should be excited at the positive changes that could stem from this, but success really depends on how people choose to react to this on both an individual and national level. I find it amazing that the same groups of people are still fighting over the past some 800 years later; in America this mentality by and large doesn’t exist, we learn to move on and bring positive change after conflict. One of the most detrimental aspects of human nature is the natural resistance against forgiveness, reconciliation, and moving on.”
The real issue in this line of thinking is that nations with hundreds of years of hatred can suddenly be brought to focus on true economic liberty. It certainly requires an American presence but not necessarily a military presence.
While my belief is that we should reach out to those crying to us for justice in this world, we cannot possibly fight all battles simaltaneously. In this information age, we should attempt to educate the population of the benefits of a better, well run-government of-the-people rather than enforce what we as a collective people know is the right way to live.
On the flip side of the coin, nations such as Iran must be held to account. We should be making energy independance at home a first priority (as important to our economic and national security interests as say the Manhatten Project) and Islam our second priority. That we Americans will sustain casualties in this ongoing conflict is without a doubt. That we will be able to continue and win this conflict is what is now in question.
Reading history of the decline of the Roman (or especially) the English & French empires provides great insight into the reasons behind the rise and decline of great empires. It also provides a general road-map of what can be done to diminish the pain of an over-extended, over-stimulated & receeding empire. This appears to be the phase America seems to have just entered and changing course is not too late to do. Americans are a solid people, but the leadership must submit the will to the people that live within. Advanced geopolitical posturing that is 40 years ahead of it’s time (let information of a better life spread to the globe) has in the past, is and will be a recipe for very large disaster.
The point he seemed to miss is that their are good Christians in Serbia that know and love Christ. However, Jason C is dead on with how their government acts. They act like Russian mafia because they are Russian mafia. Russian mafia and the FSB are one and the same and our good buddy Vlad is the head vampire. Communists are communists and act like communists. Capitalists act like capitalists. The two major idealogies are not compatible in this big wide world and the Serbs are in general of the communist ideology. This is sad for those decent Serbian Christians that once defended liberty itself and valiantly held off Islam in the past but right now a duck is a duck!
Now that said, I do not believe we should have gotten involved in the entire affair. It is a giant trap with nothing but lives lost and for what? To defend our European allies against Russian energy strong-arming?!?!?
Most of what you write is VERY simplistic and off mark.
Here read this a bit and think before you spout.
http://www.takimag.com/site/article/putin_beyond_the_propoganda/
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