Will we have guns on campus? (Editorial: Boise State University paper)

The Arbiter ^ | 2/14/08 | Gabe Murphy

[Domandred]

On Feb. 6 a new piece of state legislation was introduced which would further our Second Amendment right. Senate bill 1381 would allow individuals with a concealed weapons permit to carry a gun on campus.

Utah is currently the only state in which the state board of education is not allowed to set rules or provisions which would be contrary to the rules set forth by state legislation concerning firearm regulation. Idaho is about to be the next.

We live in a time where there is always that threat of having another Columbine, Virginia Tech or something equally horrifying, and due to university policies we don't have the ability to defend ourselves.

Boise State University policy 5017-a clearly forbids the possession of firearms on any university-controlled property regardless of a state issued license. This doesn't make sense to me. What gives the university the right to prohibit the carrying of firearms when the state has issued a license to do so? It just seems that if we are in a gun-free zone, only the law abiding citizens will leave their weapons at home; not the criminals. Criminals could care less about whether or not we are in a gun-free zone, and it's the criminals I'm afraid of.

An argument I heard is the fear of knowing that 10 other students in the classroom could have a gun on them. In a sense, wouldn't that make you feel safer? If I knew that there were 10 students in my classroom carrying guns, my fears would be considerably less than if there was a possibility of only one student possessing a gun.

Statistics show that concealed weapon laws actually reduce crime rates. Violent crime has dropped 4.9 percent, rape has dropped 5.3 percent, aggravated-assault has dropped 7.01 percent and murder by 7.7 percent with the implementation of concealed weapon laws. Even at a state level, violent crimes decrease up to 10 percent after the adoption of concealed weapon laws.

Do you really think our school will be more dangerous if students are allowed to carry concealed weapons? I think if we truly analyze the facts we can come to the understanding that this would be better for our school community.

The people that take the time to obtain a concealed weapons permit do so because they are respectful law abiding citizens. There is a process that you must go through to obtain a permit, which is not as easy as most people think. First of all, you must pass a thorough background check and be 21 years of age. To obtain a concealed weapons permit you must complete a firearms training course. You also may not obtain a permit if you are convicted of a felony or if you have been incarcerated for a year or more. You cannot obtain a permit if you lack the mental capacity or have a history of mental illness. If you have ever been convicted of certain violent crimes, again, you may not carry a weapon on your person.

I completed a firearms training course when I was 14-years-old. I have it instilled in me that guns are to receive the highest respect. To be honest, nothing scares me more than a loaded weapon, and you learn that with having the proper training. I do not like the idea of having a bunch of weapons on campus and it is highly discomforting. I understand how discomforting that can be to other students as well. However, this world is a very dangerous and unpredictable place, and sometimes you have to settle for a little discomfort in order to realize the greater good. It's more unsettling to know that at any moment someone could break into my classroom and start taking innocent lives. From my perspective, it seems that at least soon we will be able to have the chance to defend ourselves.

[Domandred]

Keeping up with Idaho news with SB1381 (to allow students with CCW to carry on campus) and new shooting at NIU, one of the opinion writers over at Boise State University's The Arbiter published this editorial yesterday.

[Puppage]

We live in a time where there is always that threat of having another Columbine, Virginia Tech or something equally horrifying

FYI...we've ALWAYS lived in that time.

[GOPJ]

If I knew that there were 10 students in my classroom carrying guns, my fears would be considerably less than if there was a possibility of only one student possessing a gun.

Statistics show that concealed weapon laws actually reduce crime rates. Violent crime has dropped 4.9 percent, rape has dropped 5.3 percent, aggravated-assault has dropped 7.01 percent and murder by 7.7 percent with the implementation of concealed weapon laws. Even at a state level, violent crimes decrease up to 10 percent after the adoption of concealed weapon laws.

Here's the one thing we know for sure - a man hell bent on killing his fellow students isn't going to care about "gun laws" or "college rules". Yeah, I'd feel safer with the "10". It gives me a fighting chance.

[bigbob]

I don’t see how this could be a deterrent to the homocidal attacks like we had at NIU yesterday. That shooter concealed his weapons in a guitar case, snuck in to the building through an exit door and wreaked his destruction in a matter of a minute or two before killing himself. For general security and as a deterrent against mugging, rapes, etc I think CCW on campus makes sense. But not when a nutbag shows up with the intention of dying anyhow.

[Resolute Conservative]

There was always at least one when I was there.

[Belasarius]

Assuming the shooter having knowlege of the liklihood of encountering armed students didn’t deter him from carrying out his crime the idea of ten people of the 150 or so in that auditorium returning fire seems to be a desirable outcome of allowing legally carried weapons on campus.

[rednesss]

"Utah is currently the only state in which the state board of education is not allowed to set rules or provisions which would be contrary to the rules set forth by state legislation concerning firearm regulation."

I don't think that's true. I believe it is OK to carry concealed on state campuses in Oregon for the same reason, the legislature is the only elected body permitted to make gun laws.

[pgkdan]

For general security and as a deterrent against mugging, rapes, etc I think CCW on campus makes sense. But not when a nutbag shows up with the intention of dying anyhow.

So CCW on campus won't deter the next nutbag who bursts into a classroom with a gun...but an armed student in that classroom can limit the harm he does. Tremendously.

[CodeToad]

These idiots think a guy who busts into a room and starts shooting people will be stopped by a rent-a-cop 10 minutes away with a nightstick. A student or teacher with a gun can stop the perp in seconds.

We all have the right to self-defense no matter how much having the maturity to do so scares the little 7-year-old-minded liberals.

[RetiredArmy]

I suspect the shooting at NIU will only lead to more and more anti gun crap, especially with Osama Obama being from Illinois.

[CodeToad]

“For general security and as a deterrent against mugging, rapes, etc I think CCW on campus makes sense. But not when a nutbag shows up with the intention of dying anyhow.
“

Could have read it wrong but that statement doesn’t seem to make any sense. CCW means having the IMMEDIATE ability to grant him his death wish and prevent your murder.

[Wildbill22]

Perhaps not a deterrent, but a “lesser evil” whenever it does happen again. God knows, we tried the No Gun Zone idea and has been pretty much determined not to work.
Lets try the other way, and require a class in firearms as a requirement, freshman year. School, and College is suppose to prepare you for life, why not require fire arms training, and CCW certification even? Like it or not, guns are part of our American history, culture, politics and even founding documents of our country. Why not prepare and train our students to be good citizens and Americans? It might not convince someone not to do something like this tragedy, but it would make certain that his desired results would be less likely to be successful, and he just might die after the first shot he fires. OF course, then the culprit might decide he could just play the suicide bomber thing..

[edcoil]

An armed society is a polite society.

[mr_hammer]

Needs repeating..

The people that take the time to obtain a concealed weapons permit do so because they are respectful law abiding citizens

[Wildbill22]

Agreed. FBI check, fingerprinting, gun registered in County Sheriffs office (MI), you would be crazy after going through the trouble of getting one to do anything out of line. I bet when you are pulled over for speeding that the officer will know you have the CCW before he even talks to you

[Western Phil]

“I don’t see how this could be a deterrent to the homocidal attacks like we had at NIU yesterday.”

These attacks occur only because the perpetrator knows that he will be able to accomplish his goal with no opposition. Concealed carry is like missile defense. It may not always work, but more often than not it will prevent the attack.

[Wildbill22]

As a matter of fact, isn’t it a little humorous to think a criminal intent on using a gun in a gun crime would bother to get a CCW? CCW permit holders are not only patriots, but probably our most outstanding citizens in general.

[TexasRepublic]

Isn’t it odd that we never hear of massacres at shooting ranges, but often at gun-free places? I think I see a trend developing. /sarcasm. Yes, it is certain that a gunman can pop off a few shots before someone with a CC can respond, but the gunman won’t have free rein to shoot “fish in a barrel” for as long as he likes.

[Lurker]

That shooter concealed his weapons in a guitar case, snuck in to the building through an exit door and wreaked his destruction in a matter of a minute or two before killing himself

It takes about 3 seconds to draw from a concealed carry and bring ones weapon to bear on an assailant. It must have taken considerably longer to remove a shotgun from a guitar case and bring it to bear.

If even one or two of those people in that classrom had been armed chances are this piece of crap wouldn't have been able to wound over 20 and kill 6.

I submit as evidence the incident in Colorado a few weeks ago.

L

[Rick.Donaldson]

I don’t see how this could be a deterrent to the homocidal attacks like we had at NIU yesterday. That shooter concealed his weapons in a guitar case, snuck in to the building through an exit door and wreaked his destruction in a matter of a minute or two before killing himself. For general security and as a deterrent against mugging, rapes, etc I think CCW on campus makes sense. But not when a nutbag shows up with the intention of dying anyhow.

So you think that folks carrying a concealed weapon are trying to prevent their own rape or mugging - which is true. And it works, as shown almost every day now in the news.

The difference here is, had there been 5 or 6 students sitting in that auditorium when he opened fire, 4 or 5 of them when would have taken him down. They were THERE, and thus, had there been students carrying concealed weapons, they could have stopped him faster than any cop could have. Sorry, your assessment of this is incorrect.