Posted on 01/21/2008 11:32:31 PM PST by maui_hawaii
I hear of the tag 'flip flop' being assigned to Mitt Romney by certain groups of people.
What I want to do is pick one (for this example) of where these people who make this charge are incorrect. In doing so, I will respond to that caller who called in to Rush yesterday and wanted Rush to tell her 'where is the record of Mitt's conservatism'.
I will answer her and all others in the process.
Now for facts. Mitt was running in a very liberal state that is friendly to gays and in fact is the hotbed of gay activism.
In the course of the several elections these gay activists were openly hostile to Republicans, and in particular a Mormon Republican.
For those who are unfamiliar with the background, the LDS Church, in one of the few times ever in history to do so, came out publicly and campaigned against gay marriage. In gay politics, Mormons are despised because they enrolled so many people and bankrolled and fought against the redefinition of family.
I remember even going door to door asking people to fight for traditional families.
Gay political extremists knew the LDS position on the matter and in their deluded kind of way tried to paint Mitt as a proactive gay hater. They did the same with the LDS church as a whole.
They got so extreme in their accusations that they were making claims that Mitt and Mormons advocated violence against gays and things like that.
So, what resulted was Mitt took a position that has never changed. He took a classy approach and did not lose his cool under fire.
What was that approach? Love the sinner but not the sin.
He said gays should not be persecuted, or have violence directed at them. He said gays had the right to live in peace. Life Liberty and the Pursuit of happiness.
If they are two consenting adults and they happen to be gay, a public position cannot be to advocate extreme behavior against them. That being said, Mitt also said, while they can be gay all they want in their own homes, they are not, and should not have special treatment as the gay lobby was hoping for. The gay group wanted to redefine marriage so they are 'equal'...
Mitt gave a classy, but firm answer. Live in peace and do your thing if you must, but we are not redefining marriage--- and you (meaning the gay lobby) cannot accuse him of being an extreme right wing gay hater. That position is simply not true.
Mitt's position in a nutshell was, "no we do not approve of your lifestyle, but we will not do two things. 1. Persecute IE advocate violence against gays (as was the accusations) 2. Give them special rights and redefine marriage.
Can you see where he drew the line? I can.
While all this was going on, court cases were in the works and the gay lobby had summarily been put on their collective butts by Mitt Romney. Basically he inferred in no unqualified terms that they should grow up and that their extreme politics don't work.
"You won't let us be gay and be married so that means you are going to send the troops to bash us all in the head like a bunch of baby seals!"....stuff like that... Mitt exposed that for what it was. Hysterical politics aimed squarely at conservative values.
This group then got a victory in that a court case was unilaterally decided to redefine marriage. The gay lobby could not win in the legislature and they definitely couldn't win with the governor... so they got a fiat win in court as to how marriage is defined.
In short order not only was Mitt fighting this group, but he was in fact a leader in the fight for a constitutional ammendment for traditional marriage.
Look at the record. He was testifying for such from the get go and even in front of the Senate.
Mitt tried to disarm a hostile lobbying group, and the result was they got more hostile. You want to know why the MSM hates Mitt? Because he smoothly told them to screw off with their BS extreme politics. Because Mitt was standing his ground, the gay lobby went around him---and everyone else--- to get to their desired outcome.
People here are trying to make the case that Mitt is pro gay--- not so. His position has been clear and consistent. He recognizes that gays are going to exist and that there should not be violence against them. At the same time, their lifestyle should not be enshrined in law. Alternative lifestyle it is, and alternative lifestyle it will remain.
Where is the flip? There is none. Problem is you have people wanting to cherry pick what they want to selectively hear.
oooops sorry - thought you were a Mitt basher.
A few times when I’ve argued for Mitt, some all or nothing Freepers went running to Jim.
Yawn....
About the border, about guns, about government spending, about socialized medicine, about the phoney baloney ethanol fuel, about the ridiculous CAFE, etc. This has been the Republican motto toward true conservatives for decades
Former Republican National Committee Chair, Lee Atwater expressed it bluntly during George H. W. Bush’s reelection campaign when he asked, “Where else are they going to go?”when referring to gun owners after the senior Bush's sell out. Well they didn't go to him did they?
Ralph Nader is a dedicated socialist, but he is very astute politically. His unsuccessful white house run forced the Democratic party far more to the left that before. If the Republicans lose, we can tolerate another Clinton (after all little Bush has outspent Clinton be wild amounts and has betrayed gun owners with his justice department's amicus brief), but we will never shift to conservatism if the republicans keep offering the (slightly) lesser of two evils and get away with it
LOL....ok
Seriously though...it is surely possible to get along with someone whilst still disagreeing with them. I do that with the wife all the time :)
I agree with you. Didn't he have a veto pen?
Being a "conservative" governor in a liberal state is the most lame excuse I have ever heard.
It’s bad enough he’s gotta go up against the f-en media, that’s doing all they can to push McCain...he’s also gotta deal with these extremist nuts on our side... He’s got a huge uphill battle, and if we get McCain as our nominee, I can’t wait for these same nuts to whine about him... I’ll be hounding them non-stop as they helped defeat the only guy that can stop him- Romney
These Romney haters are so dishonest in their cherry picking it's embarrassing.
The main thing Romney constantly said was that "all people will be afforded their civil rights" ....
... which Romney haters twist and contort into.... "Look, he's promoting homos, he's promoting homo's."
It's disgusting in the extreme that a man with such an exemplary, honest lifestyle is being targeted by a bunch of hateful conservatives.
If it was liberal Dems doing the smarmy accusations, I could understand.
But I thought conservatives were a less hateful, more honest bunch.
Wow. Have I been wrong all these years!
“Mitt was running in a very liberal state that is friendly to gays and in fact is the hotbed of gay activism.”
Mitt won because they couldn’t help but vote for the *pretty* candidate. LOL!
Yes, with 'accused' being the operative word.
As a conservative man of faith who ran for Governor in an uber-liberal state like Massachusetts, Romney has been remarkably consistant over the years.
Yes, he switched on one issue -- abortion -- and yet I have MUCH more respect for a man who admits his mistake, and works to change it....
than I do a man who never admits to making a mistaken, and wants everyone to think they are always perfect.
Romney is the best thing to happen to the ProLife movement in a looong time because he is proof positive that people CAN change and see the light and goodness in the ProLife positions.
Thanx. I don't get much agreement with my positions on this forum any more.
Now now, you know better than to screw up a “Mitt Love Fest” thread with facts.
You are just mean...
First off, Mitt Romney never said HE marched alongside MLK.. he said his father did.
I know what he meant, and everyone with half a brain knows what he meant... which is that his father marched IN SUPPORT of civil rights in the early 60s.
It is how we speak... like saying "I marched with Gen. Patton all across Germany on the way to Berlin."
It doesn't mean holding hands and rubbing shoulders!!!
It means "supported" or "on the same side"
Mitt Romney haters had really better check their hatred levels. Their blood pressure might get the best of them.
Actually, I am enthusiastic about Romney (guess it shows with all the supporting posts).
He not only lives an exemplary conservative lifestyle, Romney is the smartest and most energetic of the entire GOP bunch.
The most business saavy, the most well-spoken.
There are reasons why Hugh Hewitt, Judge Bork, Ann Coulter, Paul Weyrich, Jay Sekulow, Tom Tancredo!!!!, Jeb Bush!!, Rush Limbaugh -- and dozens of other very conservative people are so supportive of Mitt Romney.
Because he is a good decent smart conservative -- despite these 15-year-old out of context statements he made in a campaign against uber-lib Ted Kennedy.
Nobody forced Romney at gunpoint to be the liberal governor of a liberal state. He did that voluntarily and without any apparent discomfort. If the Republican Party is to remain conservative in any meaningful sense that choice has to disqualify him as a serious candidate for the Party’s presidential nomination. It’s as simple as that.
I think the ones with Rs after their names are more insidious. An enemy in the uniform of the enemy is easier to fight than a foe dressed as a friend...
If you would bother to check the history of the Massachusetts plan, you will discover (as I did) that Romney had originally insisted on an opt-out clause where people could simply sign a form claiming they had the means to pay for their own personal health care, and thus would NOT rely on taxpayer funds to pay their hospital bills.
The 85% Democratic legislature balked, took OUT the waiver, and the two sides bickered for a long time.
Finally, after some horse trading, it got left in... but there STILL is a way a person can opt out...if I'm not mistaken.
DONT BELIEVE all the hysterical Romney hating hype on FR.
98% is out-of-context statements designed to make Romney look like a liberal, which he the farthest thing from...
“Here is a good source to read about the health care plan plus every other issue.”
If you’re into propaganda, that would be a great source, However, if you want to get the real facts about Mitt’s record I suggest you go here:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/keyword?k=RomneyTruthFile
Or here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_w9pquznG4
Or here:
http://romneyfacts.com/redblue.php
That should be the 'Statement of the Day.'
These Romney haters should really read this Human Events piece explaining, supporting and even complimenting Romney's health care proposals in Massachusetts.
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=13974
-—I’ve been reading this thread with growing disbelief that anyone would consistently whizz on everyone’s head (that would be mbraynard) and tell them it’s raining and expect not to get called on it.-—
I feel much the same way about the “only true conservative” in this race:
-—KANSAS CITY, Missouri (CNN) — Sen. John McCain’s bid for the Republican 2000 presidential nomination got a boost Wednesday when he was endorsed by fellow Sen. Fred Thompson, who joined McCain’s campaign as national co-chairman.
“When it comes to personal courage and integrity and the courage to do what he thinks is right, regardless of whether or not it’s particularly popular at the moment, John McCain has shown characteristics of leadership like no one else I’ve ever seen,” Thompson said at a press conference.
Sen. Fred Thompson has endorsed Sen. John McCain for president
Thompson, a Tennessee Republican, and McCain are both independent minded senators who have bucked their party, most notably on the issue of campaign finance reform. McCain has repeatedly sponsored a campaign finance reform bill with Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wisconsin) to ban the so-called “soft money” donated to political parties and Thompson has endorsed his efforts.-—
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/08/18/president.2000/thompson.mccain/
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