Posted on 01/04/2008 5:06:16 AM PST by Man50D
A lawyer who was acquitted by a federal court trial jury of Internal Revenue Service accusations he failed to filed income tax returns for two years now is suing several IRS agents over their alleged improper disclosure of his personal information in the case.
A spokeswoman in the office of lawyer Tom Cryer told WND the case was assembled and filed by Cryer between Christmas Day and the end of 2007 and is expected to be placed on the docket in the U.S. District Court for the Western District of Louisiana.
Last summer in federal court a jury voted 12-0 to find Cryer, of Shreveport, not guilty of the IRS allegations. He had been indicted on 2006 on government claims he failed to pay $73,000 to the IRS in 2000 and 2001.
His successful defense was based on a challenge to the IRS to prove a constitutional foundation for the nation's income tax.
Now his claim against the government's agents, according to a report in the Shreveport Times, explains four IRS criminal investigation division workers tried to destroy his reputation during the course of their investigation in the case.
The lawsuit alleges IRS agents Jimmy H. Sandefur, Darrin A. Heusel and Judge Armand, and a trainee, Patrick Potter "entered into a smear and fear campaign to destroy Plaintiff's good reputation and law practice."
Cryer alleges the federal workers repeatedly violated federal laws that restrict the disclosure of tax information, release of information about an investigation and publicizing information about a grand jury investigation.
The report said Cryer's lawsuit alleges the agents continually raised those issues in telephone calls, during personal visits and in letters exchanged with Cryer's clients during their investigation.
The action seeks $1,000 in damages for each incident in which a federal agent compromised Cryer's confidential information.
(Excerpt) Read more at worldnetdaily.com ...
Collection actions are not public record.
At least you can acknowledge that the fairtax would get gov’t out of our everyday decisionmaking processes.Well no I can't acknowledge that because I have no way of knowing if it's true...You do know it doesn't actually exist and isn't even being discusssed/debated legislatively, don't you?
What I can acknowledge is you are more than just a little naive if you think the Fairtax would pass exactly as it is presently written.after we get reform in place then we can work on the next step.
Right, let's start with 2 impossible tasks...that'll fix everything.
Do you think for a second that Cryer wouldn’t publicize any effort by the IRS to collect? The risk to the government is so great, the IRS dare not attempt to collect.
And you won't. Believe it or not, your personal tax records are not in the public domain. You will never see a single mention of the civil collection process as it regards Cryer unless he fails to pay at some point.
Why do you think they have not taken action yet if Cryer owes the taxes?
Of course, "they" have taken some action, but neither you nor I know the stage of collection Cryer is in because none of it is public unless he fails to pay after some sort of final determination via whatever process, either internal to the IRS or in federal court.
Could it be that they are unwilling to risk a civil action to collect?
No.
They will take whatever action they need to take, but we'll never know about anything that doesn't wind up in federal court. He could have already paid every dime of tax, penalty and interest and we would have absolutely no way to know that unless Cryer chooses to disclose it.
See how it works? People get carried away by nothing while confusing criminal process with civil process and jump to totally meritless conclusions.
That's the kind of junk thinking that gets you put in prison for a long time. Just ask Ed family: Brown and his fellow long-term jailbird "supporters."
You don't know if the IRS has attempted to collect from Cryer, do you?
You think for a second that any collection action against Cryer is not going to wind up in federal court?
LOL.
You're kidding, right?
Cryer's interest is to deceive rubes like you. Like I said, he could have paid every dime he owes and you have no way to know that unless he admits it. He could claim he never paid anything, and the IRS is barred by law from saying anything at all about it, one way or another.
Which he certainly might do in the interest of furthering his value on the TP seminar circuit. There is a certain paucity of speakers due to the incarceration of most of the idiots who used to comprise the set of available blatherers about ways to get yourself convicted and sent to prison.
I notice that you’re no longer asking me or anyone else to “show you the law.”
Did you finally figure out that you are obligated to pay the applicable tax on any taxable income you may have?
BTW, the fact that there is no federal court action by Cryer thusfar with regard to any collection activity tells me that he has either paid in full, or, at the very least is not delinquent with regard to any internal IRS collection process or activity they may be engaged in.
At some point, if he hasn’t paid in full or according to any agreement they may have reached, there may be a civil process that winds up in federal court. If that happens, it will no doubt come as a great shock to you.
I figured if you could point to the law, you would have done so. I assumed that if the IRS refused to or declined to cite the law that required Cryer to pay, you couldn't either.
Do you think Cryer was making an unreasonable request to be cited the law that required him to pay taxes on the portions he said were not taxable?
I see logic is a weak point with you. The only conclusion one can draw from the lack of a federal court action is that there is no current federal court action (assuming there isn't one, since I can't claim perfect knowledge about any such event). Beyond this statement, everything else is speculation.
nonsense.
The double taxation for those who have already saved is showin the language of the actual Fair Tax Scam bill located at http://www.thomas.gov.
This story is dubious at best and seems based on technicalities not tax obligations.
The IRS shoudl go, the fair tax scam is not the way to do it because it is based on teh concept of tax income neutrality. WE are NOT tax inccorectly, we are taxed too much.
The fair tax scam needs to be dumped just as equally as the current tax code should be dumped. Something else must be adopted.
Read much?
Try post 219.
the only conclusion one can draw from the lack of a federal court action is that there is no current federal court action
Ah, no, actually the lack of activity leads to the conclusions I previously drew.
Just because you don't think the IRS is busy collecting or has already collected what he owes doesn't mean it isn't now happening or has already happened.
I mean, don't all of you foaming-at-the-mouth faux-TPs claim that the IRS is nothing but a bunch of JBTs? How could they possibly not be extracting every dime from Cryer at the earliest possible date?
Grow up.
I'm not the infantile echo around here -- you are. I suggest that you take your own advice and at least trry to act like an adult.
St. Paul was beheaded -- that was the end result of his pleading his case through the courts.
We have a winner!
Congratulations on winning tonight's Drama Queen award!
Now, if you'll please step aside, it's time for the hog-calling contest, to be followed by the watermellon seed spitting competition.
PS: You can call it "willing to get down on bended knee and submit to bad law" but the reality is that it's called "paying to Caesar what's Caesar's" -- with the alternative being me, dying for YOUR windmill, leaving MY family destitute, with some smug prick living in our home after picking it up at a tax sale.
Instead of criticizing Mr. Cryer for doing what was unthinkable 30 years ago, we should be looking at what he did as an example of how to fight back when a federal entity possessing an abusive power intrudes into our lives.
Instead of criticizing ME for having common sense, you ought to mind your own damn business. If you're so dead set on tilting at windmills, get on your OWN damn horse, and stop trying to recruit suckers to go into a suicidal meatgrinder FOR you.
How is that relevant to what I said? I know the history of St. Paul.
The similarity between Tom Cryer and St. Paul is in their conversion not their end results.
Tom Cryer at one time was firmly against any person that refused to file taxes or pay them. His entire ordeal was started by a challenge to find the liability provision of the income tax. He refused to believe that a liability provision was missing in the tax code for income taxes when it was present for every other tax and was required to be in the code for each specific tax. He refused to believe it was missing for the income tax and searched until he was spending every available extra minute in a search to find it.
His search also spilled over into whether his interpretation of the code was too strict and therefore he went to Supreme Court cases to obtain guidance on how to construe the code. Cryer was a highly rated lawyer that won many top awards and he knew how to research and interpret the law. Others in his circle and community respected his legal knowledge and insight.
But along the way he went through a conversion as St. Paul did. He went from being a skeptic and persecutor to a believer of those arguing that payment and filing of income taxes was not required by certain individuals.
This thread contains links to the court transcripts. His experience, it’s all there in his own words as he testified in court.
So he had a conversion. He had always paid his taxes and he was not needing the money. He describes hinself as a lawyer with a passion, a law junkie, a law groupie. His favorite pastime is reading cases.
He never cared for tax law before he was challenged about the lack of a liability clause in the income tax. He didn’t like tax law. But he was determined to prove the challenger wrong. And he could not.
Now all that said, as I cautioned other posters on this thread, this case of Cryer’s is not going to help anyone. Cryer said so himself. In order to beat the IRS you have to be really smart and tough. Most people can’t even hold a small fraction to Cryer over the law, even many other lawyers. Cryer said himself that were it not for his considerable knowledge of the law and trial experience, he would be in prison today. He warned not to try doing what he did.
The bottomline is that the tax code has flaws, its application is often not lawful and these cannot be cured. But don’t try to fight it because chances are you will end up in prison. It doesn’t matter that Cryer won. Most people will end up in prison, it doesn’t matter whether the law is missing or whether it is carried out unlawfully, prison is the likely result.
The alternative solution to the monstrosity and corruption of the Income tax code is found here:
My young son, recently, decided to spend a few years traveling around. He quit his job, and did not renew his lease on his apartment, and had to find a place to store the stuff he has accumulated over a few years. He ruled out storage units, because the stuff he had to store was not really worth the price charged for storage over a year or more. (He tried to store it here, but I've got much to much clutter myself).
Perhaps you can sell your stored stuff on E-Bay, eliminate your storage charges, and make a little money. (hide it from IRS though).
Hi, thanks for your post. I can’t get to my stored things, so that’s not possible. I don’t have a car and I’m too sick to crawl around over all the boxes to get anything out of there.
It does cost a lot and I’ve had it for 4 years, but I’m also kind of old and have plenty accumulated. They may just be “things,” but they’re not, to me. I gave away 2/3rds of my belongings to the Salv Army when I was forced to move unexpectedly, but I still had enough to fill a large and a small unit. Neighborhood HS boys moved things for me a little at a time, as I could pay them, which wiped me out.
I realize my good furniture and appliances may be ruined in there, but I have huge collections of CDs, a large reference library for my work, hundreds of cookbooks that I actually *used* and 100s of videotape movies. Also, very expensive cookware - I had to totally start from scratch in this cheap apt and I know the flimsy pots & pans I had to buy cheap are contributing to my ill health, among many other things.
Anyway, there are also 1000s of $$ worth of dolls in the unit that were going to be sold on the website I was trying to develop when all this came down on my head, plus all my business supplies, 25 years worth of my client files, family heirlooms, over 9000 special Christmas ornaments, just a ton of things that mean the world to me - but not to anyone else. I just can’t get to them to use them or sell them.
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