Posted on 11/12/2007 3:53:44 PM PST by mdittmar
UFOs may be fodder for comedians and science fiction but there was no joking Monday when a group of pilots and officials demanded the US government reopen an investigation into unidentified flying objects.
The 19 former pilots and government officials, who say they have seen UFOs themselves or been involved in probes of strange flying objects, told reporters their questions can no longer be dismissed more than 30 years after the US case was closed.
"We want the US government to stop perpetuating the myth that all UFOs can be explained away in down-to-earth, conventional terms," said Fife Symington, former governor of Arizona and air force pilot who says he saw a UFO himself in 1997.
"Instead our country needs to reopen its official investigation that it shut down in 1969," Symington told a news conference.
Symington read an appeal on behalf of the group of who came to Washington to recount their sightings of UFOs.
"We believe that for reasons of both national security and flight safety, every country should make an effort to identify any object in its airspace," the statement said.
The group included a retired pilot from Air France who said he saw an enormous flying disc during a flight from Nice to London in 1994, an Iranian pilot who tried in vain to fire on a UFO in 1976 and a former US official from the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) who claims a probe into a UFO seen over Alaska in 1987 was squelched.
"'Who believes in UFOs?' is the kind of attitude of the FAA all the time," Symington said.
"However, when I asked the CIA person: 'What do you think it was,' he responded 'a UFO.'"
When Symington suggested the government tell Americans about a UFO, the CIA official allegedly told him: "'No way, if we were to tell the American public there are UFOs they would panic.'"
The subject of UFOs came up in a recent debate among presidential candidates, with Democrat Dennis Kucinich saying he saw a UFO.
Skeptics say UFO sightings are merely aircraft or meteors re-entering the Earth's atmosphere.
I go to crevo threads if I want to talk about religion.
The topic at hand was what you think these mysterious objects in the sky are. Your answer was "I don't know". So without a possible alternative explanation, I see nothing here to change my original statement; these people are seeing earthly phenomena. Every one of them. To be clear, that's what I'm saying.
That being said, my own opinion will wind up somewhere between yourself and our FRiend Quix, whose position holds much value as well. I think technological advancement is driven by demonic forces, and always has been; their motive being to oppose Almighty God with the force available right here on this earth where they have been trapped among us. Our literal dependence on that technology drives us away from what God had intended and causes us to become calloused to the miraculous evidences of God by our reliance on false miracles.
= = =
Thanks for your kind words.
I think your post is well put.
The same critters (nephilium/watchers/fallen angels), evidently, got in trouble with God
BY GIVING MAN IMPLEMENTS OF WAR AND INTERBREEDING
BEFORE
the flood.
Here they are doing it wholesale leading up to Armageddon. And satan has reportedly convinced the puppet masters that he will WIN at Armageddon. Boy are they in for a surprise.
I doubt that the oft reported “ET’s” are demons per se. I wouldn’t be surprised if some variation of the greys are, as some have asserted, bioengineered shells housing demons . . . but I think the bulk of the ET’s are the
NEPHILIUM/FALLEN ANGELS/WATCHERS
as Guy Malone outlines so well in his website
I have often pondered the seeming evolution of the craft. And the fact that SOME percentage of craft DO seem to be living organisms . . . from a spirit dimension?
But many are tangible if not nuts and bolts!
AND a number of the ancient depictions DO depict MODERN STYLES. So, it’s not a consistent thing one way or the other.
Thx.
THERE IS MORE THAN A LITTLE
evidence that there is a huge ‘spiritual’ component to the phenomena.
That aspect is more than appropriate for such threads.
If you are THAT allergic to mention of religion . . . not sure what to suggest.
Are you saying that UFOs might be religious and/or spiritual phenomena, as in people are seeing angels and such?
You may have to continue to ask for clarification.
At 60, My writing style is fairly resistent to change. Sorry.
I’ll try and reform around the edges a bit when posting to you.
I thnk this is a complete sentence:
THERE IS MORE THAN A LITTLE evidence that there is a huge ‘spiritual’ component to the phenomena.
COMPONENT, part, aspect, feature, factor,
1. Some say it is because of the world’s religions that secrecy is so strict.
2. Some say there is a very thick book on RELIGION vis a vis ET info.
3. I say and have expected for many decades that ET’s are going to be involved more and more overtly in what the Bible calls THE GREAT DECEPTION of the END TIMES. I think they will offer supposed 3D holographic supposedly historical videos purportedly calling into question Christ’s deity.
4. Some say some of the ships are spiritual creatures from a spiritual dimension and that’s how/why the ships themselves can transform in shape etc. so readily.
5. Most ET’s pontificate some variation of a NEW AGEy sort of bunch of hogwash setting the world’s citizens up to view the ET’s as saviors ... or one race as saviors and another race as attackers. I view that as the old good cop/bad copy ploy engineered from hell to coerce the world’s citizens into the Biblically predicted evil world government ruled by the Anti-Christ.
6. Religion has to do with many aspects of life. Ultimate issues particularly are in it’s purview. ET’s claim similarly to deal in ultimate issues sorts of philosophical areas. That will always be inherently religious, maybe even spiritual.
7. I have seen the ET/UFO stuff for more than 40 decades as having a LOT to do with END TIMES prophecies and events in negative spiritual ways. Each year those convitions have been strengthened.
8. I do not think that God needs UFO’s to do His bidding/will. HE MAY use such on occasion. I don’t know. Ezekiel’s chariot comes to mind.
9. I do not believe, have not observed or read about convincing stories about angels loyal to God being evident in UFO reported incidents. Certainly not above 1% or less of such reports.
Hi roamer,
I find your post #198 interesting and thought-provoking.
I also like your FReeper page and think you have chosen a TRUTH about what makes the USA great and an alarming warning at what could cause the USA to cease to be great.
Thanks.
I remember hearing Winkie Pratney say long ago that he believed the Industrial Revolution and all advancements of mankind since then have been allowed by God in His sovereignty and as part of His timing of world events ultimately leading up to the end times.
You are probably correct that the kingdom of Satan is working overtime to use these same advancements to lure and entice mankind down the broad path that leads to death and eternal damnation (rather than the straight narrow way that leads to life) but God is sovereign and all wisdom comes from Him.
I do appreciate your awareness that the father of lies and his cohorts are very much involved in using the things of the world to advance the kingdom of darkness and to oppose Almighty God and His loving purposes for the world and for all mankind.
However, I sit here using a computer and my furnace is running and keeping me warm; I have a car out in the driveway and later today I will go and use my debit card at K-Mart to buy some Boylan’s Natural Root Beer sweetened with pure cane sugar, and then I will go to work and log in on the computer and punch in to start my day, et cetera.
I guess the alternative would be to become a strict Amish. However, even some Amish drive their horse and buggies and park at Wal-Mart and go in and shop; it’s true, I’ve seen it with my own eyes.
Though I live a modern life, I still yield to God and live my life for Him.
I do see people all around me busy living lives devoid of God and yes, many of them are mesmerized by technology. And it says in Ephesians 6: 12-13,
12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. 13 Therefore, take unto you the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day and, having done all, to stand.
There are evil principalities and rulers of the darkness of this world, and folks who don’t take up the whole armor of God won’t withstand in the evil day. Woe to those who’re too busy for God. They are sitting ducks.
I look forward to talking with you again sometime. Have a good day.
Most of the evidence of UFOs is testimony and pictures. The most such evidence could do is cast doubt.
That's why I had to ask you the same question multiple times, (Do you believe in God) and each time you attempted to avoid the question by changing the subject, or answer the question with a question instead of an answer.
One need not be a senior investigator to read back and see this exchange. The Internet makes an excellent witness.
You make the statement, "I do not believe in anything for which there is no evidence".
No problem. I then ask you repeatedly, "Do you believe in God and you respond, "I'm a deist" .
I then discover that deist believe in God. No problem.
A deist is a person who believes that God designed and created the world and governs it through natural laws that are inherent in everything.
You have avoided the question because early on you stated, "I do not believe in anything for which there is no evidence".
My next question to you is, how can you believe in something where no evidence exists?
There is plenty of bandwidth, feel free to answer the question and then we can move on.
There is evidence both ways, I have made an educated decision on the more likely scenario.
Unlike the UFO question, where there is evidence against alien origin, yet none supporting it.
The answer will make more sense once you read the book.
There is evidence both ways, I have made an educated decision on the more likely scenario.
Some advised gunner. Educated decisions, guesses, hunches, and what someone might consider "likely scenarios", are NOT "evidence" by any stretch of the imagination.
Just when I thought I was getting somewhere with you, this below. lol! Here we go again!
there is evidence against alien origin, yet none supporting it.
Simple question. Can I see your "evidence" and proof that life does not exist elsewhere?
Take your time with this one. My suggestion to you would be quit digging a hole for yourself, but you keep making these odd statements.
So please feel free and provide your proof and *evidence* that life outside of earth does not exist.
OK, just to be clear, are you stating that *all* of these incidents are *all* just witness misinterpretations, optical illusions and secret military craft? YES
***My approach is very similar, but since this is an inductive area, that word *all* is completely misplaced. Once I see “the great majority” replace that word “all”, then that’s when I can say YES.
What I do know is that we have very few spacecraft outside our moon orbit, and those would not be visible anyway...Not with my equipment anyway. lol
***Here is where your presumptions about the data are getting in the way. You neglect that there could be successful black programs that could be placing sizeable craft in our moon orbit. And, to apply Occham’s Razor, what is the most likely thing you had seen?
Just a note on Ockham's razor or Occam's razor: There are those, anti-razors, who have been around in a semi-organized movement since the time of Ockham who oppose the concept.
I think we have some more important things to do right now. Go put on your tin foil hat and climb into your bunker.
I don’t have evidence for EVERY SINGLE sighting, just like I can’t debunk every Bigfoot, Nessie, or leprechaun sighting....
***See my post #213. That’s why I won’t sign up for this nonsense about explaining *ALL* because then that is what the ET crowd will focus on. It’s essentially a form of straw argumentation. What can be explained is the great majority of events, and in light of those explanations the remaining unexplained items do not hold nearly as much weight as they did before the explanation. Let’s say it turns out that 90% of the sightings can be explained by Secret Weapons or natural phenomena. That leaves a few scattered 10% that no longer seem as compelling for the ET hypothesis. You should get Vesco’s book, you’ll like it. It’s right up your ally.
To: GunRunner
OK, just to be clear, are you stating that *all* of these incidents are *all* just witness misinterpretations, optical illusions and secret military craft? YES
***My approach is very similar, but since this is an inductive area, that word *all* is completely misplaced. Once I see “the great majority” replace that word “all”, then that’s when I can say YES.
213 posted on 11/14/2007 10:35:38 AM PST by Kevmo (We should withdraw from Iraq — via Tehran. And Duncan Hunter is just the man to get that job done.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies | Report Abuse ]
anti-razors: First I’ve heard of them. Is there a link or some place I can come up to speed?
Oh really Kev? And where were all these launches, taking all this material up there, taking place? LOL!
Maybe NASA is now launching from Panama..Outer Mongolia? Invisible "black" launches?
Too funny!
Here, start with post #56. But in your case I think I’ll just spot you 5 orders of magnitude, ha hah!
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1924782/posts?page=56#56
This would be evidence and not proof. The fact that you are even asking for proof where OBVIOUSLY none exists shows that you are stuck in deductoland when you’re operating in Inductoland.
From #56:
We got a start on covering that possibility with the probability calculations started by Coppedge and others on this thread.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1904271/posts?page=86#86
Coppedge’s calculations of 1 in 10^123 for the formation of a protein of 445 amino acids in length, and 1 in 10^29345 for the formation of an aggregate of proteins minimal for the existence of life are computed on the basis of the left-handed amino acid problem alone. Once that’s plugged into the Drake Equation, you’re looking at maybe one in a trillion galaxies that might have intelligent life, if you’re lucky. And by lucky, I’m giving you 50 ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE leeway.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.