Posted on 10/07/2007 8:01:14 PM PDT by JSDude1
President George Bush has repeated his belief all religions, "whether they be Muslim, Christian, or any other religion, prays to the same God" – an assertion that caused outrage among evangelical leaders when he said it in November 2003.
(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...
I dunno, N&V. I’ve seen plenty of your posts and can’t think where you’ve been such an intolerant buffoon as this guy. I’ve made my share of mistakes in forum, but I have always been respectful with one exception: when someone has been deliberately insulting to me, I will ask for an apology. If one is not forthcoming, then I give as good as I get, without vulgarity, violence and the like.
So, as far as I’m concerned it’s a beautiful day in the neighborhood, with one jerk hanging around.
You need to check again because Jesus IS God.
I’ve had my days. You obviously haven’t read all 60,000+ posts I’ve made.
A few were so bad that I hit the abuse button and had them pulled myself.
Oooops, I just admitted to self-abuse on an open forum...
Who did he pray to in Gethsemane?
Now, JSDude1 you’re a man I can talk to.
When one says “G-d the Father” as you do, I have to say no, Jews do not believe in G-d the Father if that means in relation to a specific Son who was the Messiah. We do refer to G-d as our Father in the more general sense that all of us are his children: we rely on him as a father, we hope he will have a father’s mercy on us and that he will protect us. It is never taken as literal fatherhood of a specific individual but the attributes of a father’s love, protection, mercy, etc.
A similar response must follow about G-d’s “Holy Spirit”. In any sense that this means a separate distinct entity, forming a part of G-d, there is no such thing in Judaism. There is the concept of the Shechina, which means a manifestation of G-d’s presence, but it is by no means anything separate or in derogation of his absolute Oneness.
As far as the prophets go, I respect your wish that I would see them leading to Jesus as the Messiah, as I perceive you mean it from a spirit of benevolence: you would want your fellow man to benefit from what you have found to be good in your own life. Still, with the same respect, I cannot agree. I am lucky enough to be able to read the prophets in the original Hebrew and they simply do not yield the interpretation that you prefer. We could get into a discussion of the vast topic of interpretation, but I think it would not be prophetable (pun intended).
“I’ve had my days. You obviously haven’t read all 60,000+ posts I’ve made.”
60,000!!! Wow. I almost said “Moses our Teacher!!”, but managed not to sucumb to the temptation to blaspheme that comes out in the heat of debate.
“A few were so bad that I hit the abuse button and had them pulled myself.”
Ah, yes. So you see, the difference between you and THE Jerk is you know the difference. As for the sin of self-abuse, I’ll leave that between you and your preferred deity.
*hangs head* Yeah, 61,167 posts so far. I have no life...
I care about the consequences of any person who might fall into damnation because they simply were not aware of something as simple as salvation which he provides. Your belief between your self and God is a private affair.
If indeed you have had faith through Christ at some point, then we both have gifts provided to us by God, the Holy Spirit, wherein we both would be working together in the same body which works all for Him.
Our relationship with Him, though isn’t based upon feelings, so wrt feelings, no I don’t really care what somebody else thinks. Their thinking is up to them. I respect the volition of others, and that is the foundation of good manners, but respecting feelings is a slippery slope which gives more credit to third parties than through faith in Christ.
Again, Nowhere have I attempted to tell you what to believe or what you do believe. I have pointed out that Jesus Christ Himself is Jewish. Instead of giving Judaism a bad name by associating Judaism with anything antiChristian, it need be noted that Christianity and Judaism worship the same God through faith in Christ and of Christ.
“Or, mebe more accurately, this is my life...”
Lament not, good and prodigious FReeper. I have always found this forum immensely informative and have learned wonderful things from fellow FReepers. I have been entertained and enlightened. I have been inspired to write to politicians, news organs and others and to donate money to good causes by the content of this wonderful site. So what you and others do is very valuable. If this is your life, it is a good, purpose-driven life.
Me too. I love this place!
Why do you write into Scripture and imply Jesus Christ isn’t Jewish? I find nothing in His testimony to suggest He is not God the Son, before Abraham, the ‘I AM’.
Why does my respect of Him and affording that same shared faith with yourself disgust you?
In both cases, God, the Father.
The last supper was over. Judas had already gone out to betray the Lord. Soon Jesus would be headed to Gethsemane. And now, as he sat with his disciples, he shared with them his final words of instruction, beseeching them to love one another after his departure. He'd spent three years revealing the father to them.
And now he said, "I am going back to my father. In his house are many mansions, and I go there to get a place ready for you. One day you will come and be with me there."
It must have shocked Jesus to hear Thomas respond, "...Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way?" (John 14:5). Thomas was really saying, "Jesus, you speak so intimately about going to your father. But we do not know how to get to him. We don't know him as you do. How can we know the way to the father?"
This was a confession. Thomas was admitting, "Lord, we know you. We've been intimate with you for the past three years. But we have no revelation of who the father is -- of his love, his care, his tenderness. Please, before you go -- show us the father!"
Yet, that is just what Jesus had been doing for the past three years. His disciples had missed the revelation!
If we fully understand that we have a loving, caring heavenly father, why would we ever be downcast when the enemy comes against us? Why would we ever despair over a financial burden that seems overwhelming? Why would we ever wonder why we can't seem to get victory over a besetting sin?
Listen carefully to Jesus' answer to Thomas. It has everything to do with us:
"If ye had known me, ye should have known my father also..." (verse 7).
Then Philip speaks up: "...Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us" (same verse). Jesus was aghast at this! He couldn't believe what he was hearing. You can almost hear the incredulousness in his voice as he answers Philip: "...Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? He that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?" (verse 9).
In other words: "Thomas, Philip, my precious disciples -- how can you ask this? You say you know me, that we are intimate. Yet how could you miss the revelation I have spent the past three years giving you? Don't you yet see that all the mighty works I did were the father in me -- revealing who he is, what he is like, what he wants to be to you? All I taught you was from his heart, not mine!"
Well, that pretty much does it for me.
It’s been nice Mr. President. But here’s where I get off.
Good bye sir.
That is correct, and sorry I'm late. Zeus is! Jesus may be one of the gods like Hercules, and all those dudes and chicks.
We’re not left to speculation at all - if someone is saved and they are praying to the one true God, then these verses make it quite clear:
Psalm 34:15-16 “The eyes of the LORD are upon the righteous, and his ears are open unto their cry. The face of the LORD is against them that do evil, to cut off the remembrance of them from the earth.”
Psalm 66:18 “If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:”
Proverbs 15:29 “The LORD is far from the wicked: but he heareth the prayer of the righteous.”
Isaiah 59:1-2 “Behold, the LORD’S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear: But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.”
1 Peter 3:12 “For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous, and his ears are open unto their prayers: but the face of the Lord is against them that do evil.”
I don,t think you can make that case. Muslims try to make 'Allah' into the God of Abraham, but the attributes of their Allah are the exact attributes of Satan.
Again, Nowhere have I attempted to tell you what to believe or what you do believe.
In post number 76 you say:
Sherman L, before thinking that “Jews also reject the Trinity”, please remember that Jesus Christ IS Jewish,...the King of the Jews. Now, which perspective of the Trinity is more trustworthy? That of Jesus Christ, or that of those who deny Him? Keep it simple. Place it in His hands and let Him guide you as to what is trustworthy. That is the very meaning of faith in the Greek.
In post number 241 you say:
Don’t try to convince me, try to convince Jesus Christ. He’s Jewish, Resurrected, Ascended, and seated at the right hand of the Father. He is the Word, the firstfruits of all created things. If you can convince Him he isn’t one with the Father, then perhaps who might prevail. Until then, even if you disagree, we will all still have to submit to His authority whether we like it or not. In regards to the Gospel, it will be stated and it’s between you and Him to either accept Him or reject Him. I’d encourage you to consider that Yahweh Saves and maybe, just maybe, God has already come in the flesh and the Son has already ascended. (i.e you’re behind the power curve)
In post 248 you say:
in, Jesus Christ Himself is Jewish and has no problem in sharing His faith and what he believes with others. In fact His Great Commission mandates that those who are aware of that faith communicate it to others.
Not only have you behaved poorly, but you are dishonest in the bargain. You have absolutely told me and others what to believe, while demeaning our fervently held beliefs. YOU ARE OUT OF ORDER, SIR. GOOD DAY.
Point taken, and intention truely identified:
I have to point out one final thing: Genesis 1:2:
2” And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of teh waters.”
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