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Dobson Says He Won't Support Thompson
AP ^ | 9/19/07 | Erik Gorski

Posted on 09/19/2007 7:14:10 PM PDT by pissant

DENVER (AP) — James Dobson, one of the nation's most politically influential evangelical Christians, made it clear in a message to friends this week he will not support Republican presidential hopeful Fred Thompson.

In a private e-mail obtained Wednesday by The Associated Press, Dobson accuses the former Tennessee senator and actor of being weak on the campaign trail and wrong on issues dear to social conservatives.

"Isn't Thompson the candidate who is opposed to a Constitutional amendment to protect marriage, believes there should be 50 different definitions of marriage in the U.S., favors McCain-Feingold, won't talk at all about what he believes, and can't speak his way out of a paper bag on the campaign trail?" Dobson wrote.

"He has no passion, no zeal, and no apparent 'want to.' And yet he is apparently the Great Hope that burns in the breasts of many conservative Christians? Well, not for me, my brothers. Not for me!"

The founder and chairman of Colorado Springs-based Focus on the Family, Dobson draws a radio audience in the millions, many of whom who first came to trust the child psychologist for his conservative Christian advice on child-rearing.

Gary Schneeberger, a Focus on the Family spokesman, confirmed that Dobson wrote the e-mail. Schneeberger declined to comment further, saying it would be inappropriate because Dobson's comments about presidential candidates are made as an individual and not as a representative of Focus on the Family, a nonprofit organization restricted from partisan politics.

Dobson's strong words about Thompson underscore the frustration and lack of unity among Christian conservatives about the GOP field. Some Christian right leaders have pinned their hopes on Thompson, describing him as a Southern-fried Ronald Reagan. But others have voiced doubts in recent weeks about some of the same issues Dobson highlighted: his position on gay marriage and support for the 2002 McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform legislation.

Dobson and other Christian conservatives support an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would bar gay marriage nationally. Thompson has said he would support a constitutional amendment that would prohibit states from imposing their gay marriage laws on other states, which falls well short of that.

Karen Hanretty, a spokeswoman for the Thompson campaign, said Wednesday in response to the Dobson e-mail: "Fred Thompson has a 100 percent pro-life voting record. He believes strongly in returning authority to the levels of government closest to families and communities, protecting states from intrusion by the federal government and activist judges.

"We're confident as voters get to know Fred, they'll appreciate his conservative principles, and he is the one conservative in this race who can win the nomination and can go on to defeat the Democratic nominee."

In his e-mail addressed "Dear friends," Dobson includes the text of a recent news story highlighting Thompson's statement that while he was baptized in the Church of Christ, he does not attend church regularly and won't speak about his faith on the stump.

U.S. News and World Report quoted Dobson earlier this year as questioning Thompson's commitment to the Christian faith — comments Dobson contended were not put in proper context. Dobson in this week's e-mail writes that suppositions "about the former senator's never having professed to be a Christian are turning out to be accurate in substance."

Earlier this year, Dobson said he wouldn't back John McCain because of the Arizona senator's opposition to a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage.

Later, Dobson wrote on a conservative news Web site that he wouldn't support former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani should he win the Republican nomination. Dobson called Giuliani an "unapologetic supporter of abortion on demand" and criticized him for signing a bill in 1997 creating domestic-partnership benefits in New York City.

Last week, Dobson announced on his radio show that the IRS had cleared him of accusations that he had endangered his organization's nonprofit status by endorsing Republican candidates in 2004. The IRS said Dobson, who endorsed President Bush's re-election bid, was acting as an individual and not on behalf of the nonprofit group.


TOPICS: Front Page News; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: b4dh; byebyefred; christianvote; dobson; elections; firstnamebasis; fotf; fred; fredthompson; jamesdobson; pissyfit; spartansixdelta
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To: LadyNavyVet
you’re going to stay home and let the Anti-Christette win

Anti-Christette . . . heh!

1,201 posted on 09/25/2007 5:53:17 PM PDT by Greg F (Duncan Hunter is a good man.)
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To: radioman; Greg F
You yourself have shown on this thread just how dangerous YOU PEOPLE are. You are denigrating Mormons because they will not submit to your demands to believe as you do. The Nazis denigrated Jews and Gypsies. You denigrate Mormons and Wiccans but the message of intolerance and hate has remained the same.

Sounds like, Radioman, you're a bit intolerant of one or more of Greg F's posts. Tolerance for me but not for thee?

1,202 posted on 09/25/2007 6:31:26 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: guido911
Good Job, you irrelevant and pitiful excuse for a Christian!

This is one of the stranger things I've read. I'm going to assume from the tone of it that you are not a Christian, or if you are that it is not important to you . . . the statement just doesn't have a Christian spirit. So it's a strange statment. If you aren't a Christian or don't care much about it, are you complimenting Dobson? If I said someone was "a pitiful excuse for a Democrat" I would be complimenting them, since I think Democrats are dangerous idiots . . . Are you a non-Christian that thinks Christians are superior, so that this is an insult?

1,203 posted on 09/25/2007 6:45:22 PM PDT by Greg F (Duncan Hunter is a good man.)
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To: Patriotic1
Fred Thompson was the only contender to attend the Annual Catholic prayer breakfast. I think many of us like him.

Isn't Brownback a Catholic? Why wouldn't he go? Maybe it's not a big function?

1,204 posted on 09/25/2007 6:49:08 PM PDT by Greg F (Duncan Hunter is a good man.)
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To: restornu; Greg F
4-that you condemn Christians as apostate; that you believe Joseph Smith takes part in your judgement at the end of time before Christ; etc. [Greg F] The Church does not condemn because for the apostaty it is something that happen to you not something you did, when this took place you were not even born![Restornu]

OK, Resty, is your spin cycle complete yet?

For you to be consistent on this, you would have to say the same thing about historic Christians at the time of the alleged "First Vision" to Joseph. (A "why blame them? the apostasy occurred before the 1800s?" line you spout). But Smith said he was told to join "none of the churches"--that, present-tense their creeds were all an "abomination" unto God & their leaders corrupt.

Now fast-forward to 2007: Are you trying to tell us with a straight face that when Mormons read Pearl of Great Price, Joseph Smith - History, vv. 18-19...they are thinking of ONLY the original apostates of the faith (the first and closely ensuing generations)?

Nope. Not true. LDS think of ALL other church members as apostates; as creedal abominations unto God (as if the Holy Spirit couldn't preserve truth for 1500 years); as corrupt. "...to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus THROUGHOUT ALL GENERATIONS, FOR EVER AND EVER!" (Eph. 3:21)

BTW, Resty, "all" in the Greek = "all" (generations...including your alleged generations & centuries of apostasy; so stop calling the apostle Paul & the Holy Spirit a liar)

I mean it's almost comical to hear your "why you're-not-to-blame-you-poor-child-you...the apostasy occurred before the 1800s!" [Kind of sounds like: "Why you're not to blame for being white trash. Your mom & dad before you were white trash; and so were your grandfolks; and so were their folks and grandfolks; and on on."]

And THAT comment kind of sounds similar to comments LDS leaders for years have been saying about African-Americans and African continentals: "Why you're-not-to-blame-you-poor-child-you for being excluded from the priesthood (pre-1978 years). Your spirit-in-heaven forefathers and foremothers were less-than-valiant in the great war in heaven, and tried to remain neutral; therefore you were "cursed" with black skin [Disclaimer: LDS leaders' words, not mine]. As the Book of Mormon says, Native Americans will one day become "white and delightsome" (like us!)."

1,205 posted on 09/25/2007 6:54:32 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: restornu; Greg F
2- The reasons are that you are polytheists, believing in many gods; that you believe that you can become gods (which is the oldest of the lies of Satan);[Greg F] We are not poly at all that is your distortion of what the LDS beleive. I call it Godhead that the Father and Son & Holy Ghost, are 3 personages and you call it Trintiy and that they are 3 in one, but I would not berate you, nor your doctrine![Restornu]

Nice camouflage, Resty. Let's do a Mormon "Scripture" ad history review on the number of gods, shall we, to see if it's a "distortion" as you claim?

Number of gods in the Book of Mormon: 1 (Alma 11:26-29 is as plain as day).

Number of primary gods in Joseph Smith's latter years: 3 ("three Gods...low and behold! We have three Gods anyhow"--Joseph Smith, History of the Church).

Number of additional gods in early Mormonism? Smith refers to a "council of gods" (exact number unknown, but from the brother of Mitt Romney's ancestor, LDS apostle Orson Pratt, we know it's a lot: "there are more gods than there are particles of matter" -- Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p. 345).

Question: Is this just a matter of 19th century conjecture, or have the general authorities of more recent times spoken more authoritatively on this?

Answer: We just have to go to a few choice quotes from a Mr. Spencer W. Kimball, who was the LDS "prophet" a few "prophets" ago: "Brethren, 225,000 of you are here tonight. I suppose that 225,000 of you may become gods" (Ensign Magazine, official publication of the LDS church, from a speech November 1975--and 1980 republished). "In each of us is the potentiality to become a God" (Tribune, Oct. 7, 1974). "Man can transform himself, but he has in him the seeds of Godhood that can grow. He can lift himself by his very bootstraps" (Tribune, Sept. 18, 1974).

So Kimball confirms Apostle Pratt's particles opinion, basically saying "in each of us is the potentiality to become a God"--which is a lot of gods.

Yet you have the audacity to think we're all so simple-minded that we can't count. You have the audacity to claim "we are not poly [theistic] at all." (if the 3 personages you concede are different "gods," then how is that not poly?

Now re: the number of gods worshipped by Mormons:

Number of gods LDS general authorities concede they worship: 2 (McConkie, MD, p. 848).

And why does McConkie have to conclude this? Well not only do multiple Bible passages show that Jesus is worshipped--like Hebrews 1:6--but the Book of Mormon confesses this as well in 3 Nephi, which happens to be, BTW, the name 3 Nephi in which Jesus is prayed to DIRECTLY even tho LDS leaders now backtrack on that {what an amazing maze).

It's time to 'fess up to polytheism (Poly wants a cracker)

1,206 posted on 09/25/2007 7:02:44 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: pissant
Unfortunately, Thompson has small cell lymphoma. Large cell caught early can be cured; small cell can never be cured - it will keep coming back. My husband has large cell caught early and the doctor believes after the chemo he is undergoing now and a small amount of radiation, it will be completely gone. His started in the groin and leg. Thompson small cell cancer started under his jaw. He only had radiation, the cancer left, then two months later, there were two tumors under his jaw. He had chemo then. A person's jaw is too close to the head. I believe if Thompson is elected, his vice-president will end up president. Each chemo treatment is worse than the one before and one has to have several treatments; the number depends on how far the cancer has spread and the type it is. They make one weak, sick, and susceptible to disease so the patient has to stay away from people. It would not be good for a president to have to undergo chemo. Poor general health or older people have a worse time with chemo and the body systems may shut down and cause death.

I was going to vote for Thompson until my husband got lymphoma and then I checked to see what type Thompson has. Now, I will likely vote for Romney.

1,207 posted on 09/25/2007 7:09:22 PM PDT by Marcella
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To: Greg F

Nope. As I said in an earlier post in this thread. Dobson and (some) of his followers espouse a general “you are not Christian enough for me” belief structure that I believe is not about Christianity at all. But hey, who am I to judge...


1,208 posted on 09/25/2007 7:31:45 PM PDT by guido911 (Islamic terrorists are members of the "ROP", the "religion of pu*&ies")
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To: Saundra Duffy; restornu; FastCoyote
If you have Mormons living near, you will probably find them to be your best neighbors.

I have found this to be true.

They [Mormons] are spiritual, probably more than most other so-called religious people I have encountered.

So what? The Pharisees were "spiritual." The gnostics of old were "spiritual." The gnostics of new (new agers) are "spiritual." Snake charmers are "spiritual." Channelers are often "spiritual." Wicca & witches (some of whom have conversations with trees) are "spiritual."

"Spiritual" is a nice modern generic term for loosy-goosy, any eclectic beliefs "go."

They are some of the most honest, hard-working people I have ever known.

Yes and no. Hard-working. Definitely! Frankly, if you're out to eventually become a god of your own planet, like I'm sure Mitt & company are, you're gonna have to work quite a bit harder than of us mere mortals, especially if your key "verse of so-called 'Scripture'" is that "We're saved by grace AFTER ALL YOU CAN DO." (Book of Mormon)

(The question is: When can ANY person, LDS or not, ever conclude, "Yup, I've done ALL I can do spiritually, physically, emotionally, attitudinally, thought and deed, comission and omission-wise...so NOW grace gets to kick in!?")

As for the "honest" part, first of all there's a reason why the White-collar crime rate is high in Utah, and it's not ONLY because Mormons are the victims there (being such trusting vulnerable folks). It's often LDS folks in Utah who wind up defrauding others. Spiritually speaking, if you're aren't willing to face the mirror and take a good honest look at yourself, and know in your heart of hearts that you are NOT god or goddess material, and that the celestial kingdom is not a "bootstraps" ("pull yourself up to godhood by your bootstraps" is a Spencer Kimball phrase) possibility, then you forever remain in denial about the obvious.

They teach the gospel of Christ, as they understand it.

Uh...[coughing to get Mr. letter-writer Allen's attention]. Uh, suffice to say, that's the problem! As the apostle Paul warned the Galatians: "I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you BY THE GRACE of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we OR AN ANGEL FROM HEAVEN [see, it wouldn't even have to be some evil Angel from hell!] should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned." (Galatians 1:6-8)

The name of their church is ‘The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.’ Does that sound like a non-Christian church to you?

Yeah, well counterfeit $100 bills wouldn't go over so well if they were mostly marked as $3 bill. [BTW, many of you have seen FastCoyote's posting of images of $3 bills on these threads...actual images of Joseph Smith's Kirtland (Ohio) Safety Society Bank, which folded...so now you know where the phrase, "as phoney as a $3 bill" came from]

I asked them many questions about what they teach and why. I got answers that, in most cases, were from the New Testament.

Well, yeah. Verse after verse of KING JAMES ENGLISH was lifted directly out of the KJV Bible and placed in the Book of Mormon, including entire chapters from the books of Isaiah and the gospels. (This is otherwise known as plagiarism). Listen, 1830 Americans did NOT speak in King James English (unless they were quoting the Bible or merging it into their writings). There was no reason, even if the concepts were meant to be the same, for the BoM to have 17th century thees and thous. If the phrases were really from ancient gold plates, then the language should have reflected more of that period in history (just as the NT language is distinct often from the OT). If the BoM was more intended for a 19th century readership & beyond, then, again, no need for achaic 1611 language...unless...unless, you wanted to pull a Mark Hofmann and come up with something that looked and sounded authentic.

The rhetoric which is spread around against them is nothing more than evil propaganda founded in untruths.

OK. Here's the real "evil propaganda": Joseph Smith telling the entire world that EVERY creed of every other church is an "abomination before God." That every leader of every other church is "corrupt." (LDS First Vision, as recorded in Pearl of Great Price Mormon "Scripture," Joseph Smith - History, verses 18 & 19).

Tell me, if someone "nukes" the entire world--attempting to wipe out its authenticity, like Smith did spiritually, who made the first strike? (Answer that honestly)

1,209 posted on 09/25/2007 7:33:13 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Auntie Dem; greyfoxx39
There is no contradiction between the Bible and the Book of Mormon.

"we are saved by grace AFTER all WE can do." (2 Nephi 25:23, Book of Mormon)

"For it is BY GRACE you HAVE BEEN SAVED, [past tense] through FAITH--AND this is NOT FROM YOURSELVES, it is the GIFT OF GOD--NOT BY WORKS, so that NO ONE CAN BOAST." [Word for "boast" there in the Greek has context of self-pride; as for "no one"--"no one" includes "me" and "no one" includes "you"] (Ephesians 2:8-9)

"For the wages [what we earn] of sin is death, but the GIFT of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." (Romans 6:23) [Just try having your kids start "earning" their gifts...give the gifts to them ONLY AFTER ALL THEY CAN DO to work them off]

"Then they asked him [Jesus], 'What must WE DO to do the works God requires?' Jesus answered, 'The work OF GOD IS THIS: to BELIEVE in the one he has sent.'" (John 6:28-29)

Does this just mean that God has to have enough "faith" in his own Son? Nope. The "believing" is for us--but even that is done due to God's work in us...even God gets the credit & glory for enabling faith. As Paul said: "No one can say that Jesus is Lord EXCEPT by the Holy Spirit." (1 Cor. 12:3)

I beg of all of us: Stop trying to...

...amass brownie points,

...spiritual merit badges,

..."A" or "B" or "C" moral grades where we think somehow that God grades "on a curve" ("well, at least I'm not as bad as..."),

...self-spiritual healings,

...living a "spiritual" life DRIVEN by temple recommends & public reputations,

...and forever panting after some super-personal "worthiness"--often defined more by what we do than who we are (as if God didn't know our hearts, anyway; as if He didn't know the boomerang motivations for some-of-our-acts...motivations meant to earn a "higher" eventual kingdom status or placement).

God doesn't grade on a "curve." He didn't say most would be saved. If fact, Jesus said just the opposite: "Wide is the road that leads to DESTRUCTION, narrow is the way that leads to life." (I'm sorry to inform you but "Destruction" IS NOT a degree of "salvation", and "SalvationLand" is not found in "telestial" and "terestial" and "territorial" and "turftorial" kingdoms--"turftorial" is the land of NFL idols, for those who didn't know).

1,210 posted on 09/25/2007 7:58:43 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: pissant

Was there any doubt in anyone’s mind that dobson would NOT support Fred Thompson. It’s a given......dobson began this whole episode, from the beginning, that Fred Thompson was NOT a christian. How does dobson know this? Does he live in Fred Thompson’s brain or heart????????? Give me a break. He’s had something about Fred Thompson, before Fred announced his run for the whitehouse.


1,211 posted on 09/25/2007 8:03:05 PM PDT by tillacum
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To: Auntie Dem; TheBattman
Since you now (apparently) embrace the beliefs of Protestant Christianity that denies current revelation...

Allow me to clarify that many, many, many Christians DO believe that current revelation is still with us. (But you need, in part, at least to start with the best definition of the Ultimate Revelation).

And if you don't at least start with these two verses as to what is Vital Revelation, then the discussion will veer off to a rabbit trail.

"I am the Way, and the TRUTH, and the Life." (John 14:6)

Jesus IS the Living Truth, the Living Reality, The Living Revelation.

Hebrews 1:1-2: "In the PAST God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times an in various ways, BUT in these LAST DAYS he has spoken to us by his Son..." (Now are we in the last/latter days according to Hebrews 1 or not?)

If so, whose the ONLY divine spokesperson offered up here? (Joe? Brig?) Our Living Prophet to Heb. 1:1-2 is Jesus (and if you missed the part about Him being "alive" may I suggest you read the gospels)

Finally, why did Joseph Smith disobey the closing words of the book of Revelation?: "I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book." (Rev. 22:18)

Now, I don't like others apply Rev. 22:18 to the entire Bible or New Testament. I apply it only to the book of Revelation. So why did Joseph add "dozens" of words to that book in his so-called "translation" of the book of Revelation in the JST?

1,212 posted on 09/25/2007 8:09:45 PM PDT by Colofornian
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All threads involving religion eventually degenerate into hilarity.


1,213 posted on 09/25/2007 8:19:44 PM PDT by Swordfished
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To: radioman; AFA-Michigan
I now see Mormons, Wiccans and Libertarians under attack here the same as Jews, Gypsies and Libertarians were in 1930s Germany.[Radioman]

What? This thread is a supposed "welcome mat" for the gas chambers? That's your claim? And the Evangelicals are the chambers' porters? Really?

Tell, you what buddy, stop with the typical liberal-like hysterical, non-historically parallel hyperbole & rhetoric by catching the first flight over for a first-hand look at what the Germans TRULY did to Jews & Gypsies & Christians, especially Christian leaders (I see you neatly substituted "Libertarians" for "Christian" as if leaders like Dietrich Bonhoeffer were executive for their "hands-off" policies...yeah, it was those bury-their-heads-in-the-sands Germans who really teed off the S.S./Gestapo).

I now see Mormons, Wiccans and Libertarians under attack here...All of these divisive attacks come from the evangelical wing of the party.

Hey, if you want to go in your backyard and bow down & worship a tulip, your religious freedom expression grants you that right. But if, (hypothetically) after having made a spiritual pattern of doing that, you expect to run for public office & tell us that is what you believe--and that somehow we voters are to consider that 100% irrelevant to the qualities we weigh you on...then ya gotta another thing coming.

I bring that up because many Wiccan practitioners believe you can go have one-on-one conversations with trees. (Therefore, that's eco-conservation run amuk...I mean, I can't even light my fireplace without some Wiccans telling me I'm a wood-murderer; or that the real crime of Jesus dying on a cross was the fact that the Romans cut up a living personality to use as the point of execution).

As for Mormons, if the would-be prez thinks the Oval Office chair is simply a "stepping stone" to the heavenly throne as "god" of his own planet, I think that's relevant (along with many other considerations) as to whom we vote for.

As for libertarians, they stand for a number of key components that we would ALL be better off worth embracing. The problem is that they don't know where to stop a "hands off" policy and attempt moral neutrality where entire communities, entire states, and entire nations are held culpable in the eyes of God. The key isn't concluding, "I'm NOT a neighbor to that person 'cause I'm a moral libertarian"...I don't think trying to ask 'Who is my neighbor?' is going to quite cut it in the final accountability session before God Almighty).

1,214 posted on 09/25/2007 8:27:35 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Saundra Duffy; Greg F
Re: post #1059:

As joint heirs with Christ and thus heirs of all things, we can also be as “lord of all”...

If my dog becomes an heir, it doesn't mean he'll be "Underdog" upon my death, human voice and cape & all.

This helps understand the full intent of Christ’s commandment to “be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father in heaven which is also perfect” Matthew 5:48...

OK, whether you've realized it or not, you've just re-opened the whole Adam-god theory of Brigham Young. Brigham contended that God was Adam. And if you're claiming that perfection makes us into gods, well once upon a time, Adam & Eve were "perfect." So Adam was once a "God" on this earth? And you believe in the goddess, "Eve" (or ex-goddess, Eve?) (or ex-goddess, Eve-become goddess again if she rose to the "celestial kingdom?)

Boy, the maze of Mormonism is tougher to track than any cornfield maze.

1,215 posted on 09/25/2007 8:36:06 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Auntie Dem; greyfoxx39
If you aren't aware of the many internal errors and contradictions in the Bible texts I won't waste my time explaining them to you. You need to do more study, both of the Bible and the Book of Mormon. There is no contradiction between the Bible and the Book of Mormon.

Sorry... bad logic.

IF the Bible is so full of 'errors and contradictions', then there CANNOT be a lack of contradictions between the bible and the BoM.

You can't have your assumptions both ways.

(You'll have to study some logic yourself, as I cannot waste my time explaining it to you.)

1,216 posted on 09/25/2007 8:46:06 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Saundra Duffy
They teach the gospel of Christ, as they understand it.

Yup.

1,217 posted on 09/25/2007 8:47:35 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: radioman
I pay taxes to the Church. Pat Robertson alone rakes in over $1.5 million in tax dollars.

Huh??

How?

1,218 posted on 09/25/2007 8:49:36 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: radioman
I win!

Then you probably know the frequency...

1,219 posted on 09/25/2007 8:51:11 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Greg F
He doesn’t even take a salary from his ministry anymore.

Just like our overworked Mormon Brethen!

--MormonDude(Workin' fer the Lord!)

1,220 posted on 09/25/2007 8:53:34 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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