Posted on 06/30/2007 4:36:50 PM PDT by 1066AD
Oswald 'had no time to fire all Kennedy bullets' By Tim Shipman in Washington, Sunday Telegraph Last Updated: 12:30am BST 01/07/2007
Lee Harvey Oswald could not have acted alone in assassinating President John F Kennedy, according to a new study by Italian weapons experts of the type of rifle Oswald used in the shootings.
The new findings will encourage conspiracy theorists In fresh tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action weapon, supervised by the Italian army, it was found to be impossible for even an accomplished marksman to fire the shots quickly enough.
The findings will fuel continuing theories that Oswald was part of a larger conspiracy to murder the 35th American president on 22 November 1963.
The official Warren Commission inquiry into the shooting concluded the following year that Oswald was a lone gunman who fired three shots with a Carcano M91/38 bolt-action rifle in 8.3 seconds.
But when the Italian team test-fired the identical model of gun, they were unable to load and fire three shots in less than 19 seconds - suggesting that a second gunman must have been present in Dealey Plaza, central Dallas, that day.
Two of the bullets hit Kennedy, with the first - the so called "magic bullet", ridiculed by conspiracy theorists - also wounding the governor of Texas, John B Connally, after it had struck the president.
In a further challenge to the official conclusions, the Italian team conducted two other tests at the former Carcano factory in Terni, north of Rome, where the murder weapon was made in 1940.
They fired bullets through two large pieces of meat, in an attempt to simulate the assumed path of the magic bullet. In their test, the bullet was deformed, unlike the first bullet in the Kennedy assassination, which remained largely intact.
The second bullet is thought to have missed its target. According to the commission, the third disintegrated when it hit Kennedy's head. The new research suggests, however, that this is incompatible with the fact that Oswald was only 80 yards away, in a book depository, when he fired. The Italian tests suggest that a bullet fired from that distance would have emerged intact from Kennedy's head, implying that the third shot must instead have come from a more distant location.
The findings will encourage conspiracy theorists who hold that Oswald could not have fired three shots in time. For each shot, he would have had to push up the gun's bolt handle, pull the bolt backwards to eject the spent cartridge case and then forward to slide the next round into the chamber, before turning down the bolt handle to lock it in place.
Nearly seven out of 10 Americans believe that Kennedy was murdered as a result of a plot. Depending on which theory they back, the participants supposedly included any or all of the CIA, the Mafia, the Cubans, the FBI chief J Edgar Hoover, the military-industrial complex and Vice-President Lyndon B Johnson.
It is the second challenge in two months to the view of the Warren Commission that Oswald acted alone. In May, researchers at Texas A&M University argued that the ballistics evidence used to rule out a second gunman had been misinterpreted.
The findings will be a frustration to Vincent Bugliosi, the author of a 1,600-page book, also published in May, which claimed to put to rest all the conspiracy theories of the past 44 years.
The Italian findings will be hotly contested by those who believe that Oswald was a lone gunman - not least because they contradict firing tests previously conducted, using Oswald's actual rifle, by the FBI and the US Marines, and another study by Washington police marksmen using an identical gun.
Oswald would only have needed to reload the weapon twice in the eight seconds to get off all three shots, since the time was measured only from the moment he fired the first shot. The FBI concluded that a marksman could have fired a shot at least every 2.3 seconds.
In his book, Mr Bugliosi details how after just two or three minutes' practice with the gun in 1979, three police marksmen aiming at three targets representing Kennedy at the same distance from Oswald, got away three shots in less than eight seconds.
One marksman hit the targets twice and missed the third shot by an inch. A second shooter scored a "kill" with his second shot.
Mr Bugliosi recounts three separate ballistics tests that found that the magic bullet could have wounded Kennedy and Connally and emerged in similar condition to the real bullet. But that is unlikely to stop the Italian research fuelling another generation of conspiracy writers.
You tell me. It's always that way with conspiracists:
Me: It happened this way.
You: No it didn't.
Me: Yes it did. Here's the evidence.
You: Nuh uh. I don't buy it, especially not from those crooks.
Me: Why not?
You: YOU TELL ME! (*burp*).
There is the proof of the extra assassin.
Dr. Shooter 2.5, you're needed in the Zapruder room, please. Connally coat lapel lift at frame 219, I believe.
While spanalot is explaining how and from where the extra assassin was, we're content with the previously shown evidence.
Spanalot, your turn. Go on. I hope that I won't hear 'YOU TELL ME!'.
Probably the rifle not the clip.
I also don’t believe Carcanos eject their clips on the last shot. Garands do but not the Carcano. If there is any information otherwise, I would like to see it.
They are supposed to, The cartridges are the only thing hokding the clip in the magazine.
But doesn't alwatys happen. When he did his reconstruction, Dr John K Lattimer found that two of the four Carcanos he purchased would not reliably eject the clip automatically(Didn't affect the ammo feed however)
. We have. You say it's not so, then don't say why.
Bull. I've explained in detail why your single bullet theory does not work.
Me: It happened this way.
No it didn't. And I explain why.
Me: Yes it did. Here's the evidence.
I don't buy it. That's Specter's theory, not evidence.
Me: Why not?
(*burp*).
You drinking already? - I'm about to go to a party and will join you soon.
I’m not referencing Stone’s movie. I’ve got several bookcases full of material on the JFK assassination. And while fingerprints may be an archaic police method, if memory serves, the assassination took place a long time ago.
... You're not saying there's no prints or that they're not Oswald's prints.
Alright, so we have Oswald's prints on Oswald's rifle. Pretty damning evidence, wouldn't you say? Glad that's settled.
JoeA makes a good point, some conspiracy theorists apparently don’t like the take of the JFK movie; but at least it puts a lot of the issues out there. There are hundreds of books on the subject; maybe up to 700.
Reading some of the testimony, like that of Warren Reynolds or Dean Andrews is a bit astounding (http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ). And then, reading Andrews testimony in the Garrison case after his testimony in the Warren Commission surely would make many wonder.
Kennedy is hit at 224 and already bringing his arms up and Connelly is still gawking around.
Tough one to lose but this is proof of a second shooter.
Bingo!!
I’ll admit to Oswald’s single palm print on the rifle. There is no disputing that. But how is it that there is only one print? If he handled the gun, there would have to be more than one, on the barrel, the stock, somewhere else. And, if he fired the rifle, why was the Dallas PD nitrate test negative?
Again, with the paraffin testing, it's a non-issue. It even came up partially positive.
Extra bullets, where, exactly?
Thanks for the fun. I counted four out and out lies.
I figured you had to use a pry bar to pull your terrible trigger.
Just keep posting about guns. The mistakes keep adding up.
“Just keep posting about guns. The mistakes keep adding up.”
What mistakes?
That “Zapruder” image has more touchup than my motherinlaws face.
Dont forget the Zapruder film was not released until ten years later.
I have a Remington 788 in .243, and the action is not all that slick, and I am an average shot at best, but I think that with a rest such as a window frame, I could easily put 3 shots in the black at 80 yards in 8.3 seconds. That's giving me four seconds each follow up shot to work the bolt and re-aim, not that tough when motivated and full of adrenaline.
I believe it is the Warren Commission and the FBI experts who have some reservations about the palm print found on the gun.
Fibers from Oswald's shirt are found on the rifle. Likewise on the box too.
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"The FBI tests of the Mannlicher-Carcano's accuracy showed that the rifle was:
1) Inaccurate from 15 yards.[10]
2) Carrying a scope that was mounted for a left-handed person (Oswald was right-handed).[11]
3) The rifle was unable to be "sighted-in", using the scope, without the installation of 2 metal shims (small metal plates) which were not present when the rifle arrived for testing, and were never found.[12]
During efforts supervised by the FBI to duplicate the shooting accuracy allegedly achieved, no FBI, military or civilian (National Rifle Association) expert was ever able to match Oswald's performance. No tests have ever been made using Oswald's rifle in the condition in which it was found.[16]"
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