What Does It Mean "The South Shall Rise Again":

The Wichita (KS) Eagle ^ | 23 May 2007 | Mark McCormick

[Rebeleye]

...he was stunned to see two large Confederate flags flying from trucks...emblazoned with the words "The South Shall Rise Again." I'm stunned, too, that people still think it is cool to fly this flag. Our society should bury these flags -- not flaunt them...because the Confederate flag symbolizes racial tyranny to so many... ...This flag doesn't belong on city streets, in videos or in the middle of civil discussion. It belongs in our past -- in museums and in history books -- along with the ideas it represents.

[Lee'sGhost]

“It’s telling to note that even at the end in March 1865 when the confederate congress finally bit the bullet and agreed to enlist free blacks and slaves as combat soliders the legislation authorizing it specifically refused to free slaves that served.”

Yes. It tells us that the Confederate government did not want to exceed its power by giving away property that did not belong to them.

Good catch.

[Badeye]

States Rights, primarily.

‘States’ “rights” to do what? Secede to prove they had the “right” to secede? The “right” not to abide by the results of an election they participated in? What “right” was burning so fervently besides the “right” to maintain slavery in the face of a Republican administration seeking to limit its expansion Westward?’

The North’s view of taxation as it applied to the Southern States was a key argument in this vein offered up by Southern orators of the day, and they had a very sound point in my view. Just one that comes to mind.

[LexBaird]

The demand for the South’s raw cotton was a “derived demand,” dependent ultimately on the demand for the finished cotton goods produced from it. So, a tariff on imported, finished cotton goods reduced the demand for the South’s raw cotton.

So, why didn't the South respond by building their own textile mills, thus avoiding import tariffs when shipped North to fill the demand for finished goods? Seems they could have undercut the costs of British goods considerably.

[Lx]

Stupid Nazis, can't even have the Swastika rotating the correct direction.

[Badeye]

‘But the buzzards dined better. ;-)’

More accurate than many realize.

Its not by accident whenever a cheer would rise up the veterans of the Army of Northern Virginia routinely remarked ‘There goes Jackson or a rabbit’.

[the OlLine Rebel]

If I were *allowed* to access Photobucket anymore here, I’d post a pix of Edmund Gwyn. ;-)

[mjolnir]

True-— being a libertarian rather than a conservative, Walter Williams tends to reduce all politics, if not all human behavior, to economics. Therefore he sees Lincoln as many (although by no means all) libertarians do, as simply the tyrant who raised taxes and increased the size and power of the federal government.

However, even Walter Williams might-- I say might--- take note of context as important in this issue. What I mean by that, is that, while the Confederate flag represents martial courage of the South and its general kickass attitude to many, it was in fact at one time a rebel flag.

There's a big difference between a patriotic American who salutes said flag along with the stars and stripes at a statehouse and someone who not only embraces the "Lost Cause" but hopes someday to revive it. Yes, some great patriots say they hope for the latter, but I don't think they really mean that--- if they did, they would be taking concrete steps to that effect.

So, that the words "The South Will Rise Again" are the context in which the Confederate flag is placed would therefore be reasonably disturbing to anyone who believes in the present Union, but for the fact that the person bearing it isn't making likely making that sort of serious ideological statement anymore than a black guy with an "x" on his cap is. Rather, both are expressing pride of place and probably not thinking much about what that pride entails or its proper limits.

Both Williams and other writers for "Southern Partisan" are incorrect when they claim slavery was not the cause of the South, however-— or at least the government representing South Carolina seemed to think it was:

The General Government, as the common agent, passed laws to carry into effect these stipulations of the States. For many years these laws were executed. But an increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery, has led to a disregard of their obligations, and the laws of the General Government have ceased to effect the objects of the Constitution.

The States of Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Wisconsin and Iowa, have enacted laws which either nullify the Acts of Congress or render useless any attempt to execute them. In many of these States the fugitive is discharged from service or labor claimed, and in none of them has the State Government complied with the stipulation made in the Constitution. The State of New Jersey, at an early day, passed a law in conformity with her constitutional obligation; but the current of anti-slavery feeling has led her more recently to enact laws which render inoperative the remedies provided by her own law and by the laws of Congress. In the State of New York even the right of transit for a slave has been denied by her tribunals; and the States of Ohio and Iowa have refused to surrender to justice fugitives charged with murder, and with inciting servile insurrection in the State of Virginia. Thus the constituted compact has been deliberately broken and disregarded by the non-slaveholding States, and the consequence follows that South Carolina is released from her obligation.

The statements of Mississippi, Texas and Georgia are even stronger in this regard.

I'll take Thomas Sowell over Walter Williams any day on this issue (or on any issue upon which they disagree). As Sowell puts it, "We all need to leave the past in the past. We have the present and the future to deal with, and wholly different problems to confront."

[Mr. Silverback]

The Battle Hymn was written by a woman using John Brown as her inspiration. John Brown WAS not above terrorizing people of all kinds who got in his way.

I agree that John Brown was scum, but...the Freeper you're helping out here claimed that the lyrics of the song promote attacks on civilians. Words mean things. He's busted.

[beckysueb]

Oh no! Not this $%^& again!

[wardaddy]

Invite some of the other exiles to test the water again.

i think i am one of the first, i don't know what the plans are for others and it's not my call obviously who gets that opportunity. i still had friends here....and they helped...i reckon i must know maybe 15-20 folks or so off this forum in the real world..that helps too, but some folks may stay away even if invited or allowed back....i just don't know, it's not like we are a cabal or anything though i do communicate with a dozen or so of them

we watched what happened here a few weeks ago with our mouths dropping...i had no idea but i think some of those already had made contingency plans

anyhow....i was glad to see a stand made here for social conservatism...that really is pivotal.. glad to see old friends..even nonsensical..lol

[beckysueb]

Great post! Ever notice how the yankees always turn it into a personal attack? “We whooped your a** nyahnyahnayahnayah.” Immature idiots!

[U S Army EOD]

Meet me and we will go burn it again.

[beckysueb]

The next civil war will be the true patriotic Americans against the socialiist loving libs. Since the south is in the 1st category, which side will you be on this time?

[AnAmericanMother]

And a Merry Christmas to you, too!

( . . . did they ban you from Photobucket for posting pics of Santa? < g > )

[mkjessup]

Oh Mark give it a rest. Historical flags are still that. It doesn’t mean they want slavery again, you dolt.

Uhh, I never said they did. Are you sure you're responding to the right person? I'm a 100 percent genuine son of the South, born below the Mason Dixon Line, and I'll have you know I had grits for breakfast this morning, and I know all the words to 'Dixie' AND 'Are You From Dixie'.

Don't be slinging that 'dolt' word around unless you know what (and who) you're talking about, ok?

[TexConfederate1861]

“we were solidly in the Union for the duration of the War of Southern Rebellion. “

Yes, you were..terrorizing Missouri citizens.
Until Quantrill. :)

[beckysueb]

Ok Tennesseans. We have to get this woman out of office.

[frithguild]

‘Answer “Cause your down here....’ said the young Iraqi man...

[mjolnir]

The battle hymn does NOT refer to John Brown, the terrorist crackpot.

It refers to a dead Union soldier of the same (rather common) name, as Mark Steyn notes:

At the time, Dr Samuel Howe was working with the Sanitary Commission of the Department of War, and one fall day he and Mrs Howe were taken to a camp a few miles from Washington for a review of General McClellan’s Army of the Potomac. That day, for the first time in her life, Julia Ward Howe heard soldiers singing:

John Brown’s body lies a-mould’ring in the grave
John Brown’s body lies a-mould’ring in the grave…

Ah, yes. The famous song about the famous abolitionist hanged in 1859 in Charlestown, Virginia before a crowd including Robert E Lee, Stonewall Jackson and John Wilkes Booth.

Well, no, not exactly. “By a strange quirk of history,” wrote Irwin Silber, the great musicologist of Civil War folk songs, “‘John Brown’s Body’ was not composed originally about the fiery Abolitionist at all. The namesake for the song, it turns out, was Sergeant John Brown, a Scotsman, a member of the Second Batallion, Boston Light Infantry Volunteer Militia.”

[TheRightGuy]

What Does It Mean "The South Shall Rise Again"

Save your dixie cups?