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Fill your car up with aluminum?
Reuters on Yahoo ^
| 5/18/07
| Julie Steenhuysen
Posted on 05/18/2007 10:29:42 AM PDT by NormsRevenge
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SOOoooo.. when we run out of aluminum? What then? :-}
A worker walks between stacks of high purity aluminum ingots at the RUSAL aluminum smelter in the Siberian city of Krasnoyarsk April 4, 2007. Pellets made out of aluminum and gallium can produce pure hydrogen when water is poured on them, offering a possible alternative to gasoline-powered engines, U.S. scientists say. (Ilya Naymushin/Reuters)
2
posted on
05/18/2007 10:31:35 AM PDT
by
NormsRevenge
(Semper Fi ... For want of a few good men, a nation was lost.)
To: NormsRevenge
There was a similar article on this yesterday... I find it an interesting concept. Here's what I see as the advantages/disadvantages:
Pro
- No polluting emissions
- Reasonably cost-effective compared to current fuel prices
- Natural material source (aluminum) is highly abundant in the US; no foreign dependence
Con
- Weight -- roughly 150 lbs for a full "tank" means less efficient use of energy (more mass to move) and difficulties in exchanging out a "spent" tank for a "fresh" one
- Can we get political muscle behind the power sources (nuclear, etc.) to "recharge" the aluminum?
3
posted on
05/18/2007 10:34:49 AM PDT
by
kevkrom
("Government is too important to leave up to the government" - Fred Dalton Thompsn)
To: NormsRevenge; kevkrom
When will we see “BIG ALUMINUM” attacked by the Sierra Club?........
4
posted on
05/18/2007 10:40:40 AM PDT
by
Red Badger
(My gerund got caught in my diphthong, and now I have a dangling participle...............)
To: NormsRevenge
5
posted on
05/18/2007 10:41:39 AM PDT
by
Uncledave
To: Red Badger
When will we see BIG ALUMINUM attacked by the Sierra Club? The second this technology shows any sign of improving the standard of living.
That is one additional concern -- how are we going to mine the aluminum without setting of the Greenie whackos. You know, since it's kind of illegal to shoot them.
6
posted on
05/18/2007 10:42:45 AM PDT
by
kevkrom
("Government is too important to leave up to the government" - Fred Dalton Thompsn)
To: NormsRevenge
7
posted on
05/18/2007 10:45:39 AM PDT
by
ReveBM
To: NormsRevenge
It’s about time we wean ourselves off of aluminum. We must seek alternatives.
8
posted on
05/18/2007 10:45:41 AM PDT
by
macamadamia
("Forget it Jake. It's Nanny Town.")
To: kevkrom
Well, the Aluminum is recyclable, so the fuel pellets, once exhausted can be turned in to be reused. Additional advantages, people would be more apt to re-cycle their cans and containers because of a higher price in face of higher demands........
9
posted on
05/18/2007 10:45:52 AM PDT
by
Red Badger
(My gerund got caught in my diphthong, and now I have a dangling participle...............)
To: NormsRevenge
So in a pinch you can pee in the gas tank to get a few more miles.
10
posted on
05/18/2007 10:47:59 AM PDT
by
NonValueAdded
(Fred Thompson in 2008 - there is no doubt about it!)
To: NormsRevenge
Gallium is $1000 a pound.
11
posted on
05/18/2007 10:48:39 AM PDT
by
RightWhale
(Repeal the Treaty)
To: Red Badger
As soon as they figure out that
THE EXACT SAME PEOPLE
are making money on this “alternative” energy source as were making money on oil.
12
posted on
05/18/2007 10:50:46 AM PDT
by
MrB
(You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
To: Red Badger
Well, the Aluminum is recyclable, so the fuel pellets, once exhausted can be turned in to be reused. Additional advantages, people would be more apt to re-cycle their cans and containers because of a higher price in face of higher demands True, but if this is going to be a large-scale replacement for petroleum products, there's going to have to be a HUGE initial influx of aluminum into the supply stream, which means intense mining. And our Green "friends" aren't going to like that, even if it means reducing vehicle emissions to nearly nothing, so best to consider how to neutralize them now, before this goes large-scale.
Of course, given the weight issue, I'm sure there will be some applications where weight is a critical factor that will still use some kind of petrochemical, but a combination of hydrogen power and biodiesel would reduce our dependency on petroleum to near nil.
13
posted on
05/18/2007 10:50:47 AM PDT
by
kevkrom
("Government is too important to leave up to the government" - Fred Dalton Thompsn)
To: NormsRevenge
And in the UK,
will it be AlYuminium?
14
posted on
05/18/2007 10:51:39 AM PDT
by
MrB
(You can't reason people out of a position that they didn't use reason to get into in the first place)
To: NormsRevenge
the cost of making the hydrogen fuel is about $3 a gallon, about the same as the average price for a gallon of gas in the United States. This process releases hydrogen gas. You can't drive far on a gallon of hydrogen gas. If they are talking about the equivalent of a gallon of liquid hydrogen, that's a different story. The author needs to clarify (as usual).
15
posted on
05/18/2007 10:51:58 AM PDT
by
Right Wing Assault
("..this administration is planning a 'Right Wing Assault' on values and ideals.." - John Kerry)
To: NormsRevenge; SunkenCiv
Hydrogen is a pipe dream. Hydrocarbons are hundreds of times more efficient. There will be one exception. There are a few technologies in the pipe that will allow us to passively store cryogenic liquids with no boil-off. That will change the outlook quite a bit.
I will say that gallium-aluminium catalyzed water decomposition is a rather interesting technology. Without Google or Wiki I imagine that the reactions would be something like:
6H2O + 2Ga + 2Al -> 6H2 + Ga2O3 + Al2O3
Problem will be when you want to regenerate the catalyst. It would be much better to find a catalyst for this reaction that you can regenerate in situ. That would be nice. Good luck.
I imagine that this would be better served at a fuel station. Pump water into a holding tank with gallium-aluminium pellets, generate hydrogen gas and then compress it to liquid form. Deliver the liquid directly to the customer, who then stores it just like gasoline. The passive insulation technologies I mentioned earlier will allow that to happen.
I still say that hydrogen is not the answer. We will be on electric vehicles before there is a “hydrogen economy.” And even then, combustion engines will be around for a long time. Things such as airplanes, power plants, they all use combustion engines. You can eliminate that by using Nuclear power. But then you still have airplanes, and I imagine unless we have some breakthrough technology, they will be running on hydrocarbons for a long time to come.
16
posted on
05/18/2007 10:52:38 AM PDT
by
AntiKev
("No damage. The world's still turning isn't it?" - Stereo Goes Stellar - Blow Me A Holloway)
To: RightWhale
Gallium is $1000 a pound. But it doesn't get consumed in the process -- the same gallium can be reused infinitely. So, it's a one-time cost in the manufacturing of the fuel system, rather than a recurring cost. Also, it doesn't have to be high-grade gallium, a fair bit of it can come from the byproducts of the semiconductor industry.
17
posted on
05/18/2007 10:52:59 AM PDT
by
kevkrom
("Government is too important to leave up to the government" - Fred Dalton Thompsn)
To: kevkrom
I would hope that the alumina and alloy may be able to reconstituted in a reversing mechanism run by electricity.
18
posted on
05/18/2007 10:54:15 AM PDT
by
bvw
To: NormsRevenge
More practical is to use natural gas. The only byproduct
from the tailpipe is water vapor. I understand that any car can be converted to use it, and still use gasoline with the flip of a switch.
It is becoming quite popular here in Slovakia and the cost is half that of Gasoline at a gas station. If you have your own filling equipment the cost is about a quarter of the cost of gasoline.
The cars have about a 400 KM range with a reserve tank of normal gasoline to give an extra 200 KM.
The problem is that there are few stations offering natural gas.
19
posted on
05/18/2007 10:54:25 AM PDT
by
AlexW
(Reporting from Bratislava, Slovakia)
To: kevkrom
Biodiesel BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!or Coal Diesel, along with Petro-diesel and Bio-diesel.......
20
posted on
05/18/2007 10:54:31 AM PDT
by
Red Badger
(My gerund got caught in my diphthong, and now I have a dangling participle...............)
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