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They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious Bigotry, alive and well today
Saundra Duffy

Posted on 05/04/2007 5:46:36 AM PDT by Saundra Duffy

They Shoot Mormons, Don't They? Religious bigotry, alive and well today

May 4, 2007 - by Saundra Duffy-Hawkins

“I wouldn’t vote for a Mormon for dogcatcher, much less President of the United States!” There’s a lot of that kind of hateful rhetoric going around since Mitt Romney decided to throw his hat in the ring – as if Mormons are some kind of hideous evil monsters. The loudest anti-Mormon shouts, sad to say, are coming from America’s so-called “Christian right”. How can Mitt Romney hope to get a fair shake in this spiritually polluted atmosphere?

There was another man running for President who faced the same dilemma – John F. Kennedy – only he was the target of anti-CATHOLIC bigotry. In his 1960 speech to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association, JFK said the following: “. . .I believe in an America where religious intolerance will someday end - where all men and all churches are treated as equal - where man has the same right to attend or not attend the church of his choice - where there is no Catholic vote, no anti-Catholic vote, no bloc voting of any kind - and where Catholics, Protestants and Jews, at both the lay and pastoral level, will refrain from those attitudes of disdain and division which have so often marred their words in the past, and promote instead the American ideal of brotherhood.” John F. Kennedy Library & Museum (Speeches, 1960). By the way, if you listen to the audio version of JFK’s speech, you will hear the hurt and frustration in his voice and the unfair treatment surely must have caused many a sleepless night.

Fast forward to 2007 where JFK might as well have been “whistlin’ Dixie”. The hostility toward Mormons today, in my opinion, is even worse than that suffered by JFK. Although it is said that JFK lost about a million votes to religious intolerance, Romney stands to lose even more if the anti-Mormon evangelicals hang together.

According to Media Matters for America - “. . . a Web-based, not-for-profit, 501(c)(3) progressive research and information center dedicated to comprehensively monitoring, analyzing, and correcting conservative misinformation in the U.S. media” - FOX News is not reporting accurately on the level of evangelical hostility to the Romney run. Media Matters for America points out that among evangelical leaders rejecting Mormons: Shirley and James Dobson (National Day of Prayer and Focus on the Family, respectively), the Southern Baptist Convention (collectively), Pat Robertson (Christian Broadcasting Network), and Dr. D. James Kennedy (Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church in Florida). “Among many conservative evangelicals – who comprise a significant part of the Republican base – Mormonism is considered an un-Christian cult.” Media Matters for America (2007)

While stumping in Florida, a man in the audience stood up during the Q&A portion and said the following to Romney: “You, sir, you’re a pretender. You do not know the Lord. You’re a Mormon.” Media Matters for America (2007). This is the kind of un-American, disrespectful treatment Mitt Romney will apparently have to endure throughout the entire campaign – as if just being a Mormon is reason enough to open the floodgates for free flow of pent-up hatred and vindictiveness.

For the record, the Mormon bashers know full well that the official name of Romney’s church is “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints” and the members should rightfully be called “members of the LDS Church” but the words “Mormon” and “Mormonism” have an aura of negativity so they prefer to use the “M” word as if it were dirty.

Less than five minutes cruising around the official LDS website (LDS.org) will show anyone who’s interested that the Church is a Christian organization, with Jesus Christ at the Head. There are no paid clergy – all are volunteers. Humanitarian aid is legendary. Members of the LDS Church believe in strong family values; they are patriotic, they are law-abiding upstanding citizens of their community. Many LDS young men right out of high school go on two-year missions – you know, the guys on bikes – and during their mission they don’t date, read newspapers, go to movies or watch TV; but rather they dedicate two years of their lives to serving others. Many women go on missions as well, and couples, only theirs is 18 months in length but the obligations are basically the same. Most members do not shop or go out to eat on Sundays – reminiscent of the good old days when shops and stores were closed in obedience to the Commandment, “Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy”. If they can help it, LDS Church members do not work on Sundays, either, preferring to spend the day at church and with their families. Church members are encouraged to store up a year’s supply of food and water so they will be able to care for their families in the event of an emergency. The LDS Church believes in self-sufficiency and self-reliance but in the event of a financial hardship the Church distributes food and supplies through their welfare (Bishop’s Storehouse) program. Members of the LDS Church do not drink alcohol nor do they use illicit drugs; they do not drink coffee and tea. A Mormon in good standing, therefore, will not be found in a drunken stupor puking her guts out at 3 a.m. anywhere in the world. Furthermore, members of the church are encouraged to dress modestly, be polite and courteous. And members of the LDS Church are faithful tithe payers. Come on, people, what’s not to love?

So what on earth is their beef, the anti-Mormon zealots? Why is there such disdain for the LDS Church and its members? In Hugh Hewitt’s book, “Mormon in the White House?” he states his thesis that the fierce anti-Mormon sentiment among main-stream Christians stems from one or two or all three of the following factors (in order of importance):

1) “It is just too weird.

2) “A Mormon president will supercharge Mormons’ missionary work.

3) “If there is a Mormon in the White House, Salt Lake City will call the shots, at least on the biggest issues.” Hewitt (2007, p. 221-227)

Hugh Hewitt has written an exquisite book about the Romney campaign and overcoming the “Mormon problem.” It’s a good read and I highly recommend it. Of the three problem points listed in the previous paragraph, Hewitt believes – unless some unforeseen blunder destroys his chances – none of the three is insurmountable for Mitt Romney. (Plus, he has the best hair.)

Well, I’m no Hugh Hewitt, not even close; he’s an icon on the conservative radio talk show circuit. Hewitt could talk circles around me (I’ve seen him in action in Sacramento); he’s brilliant; he’s well educated, well read, no doubt a genius, plus he’s kind of cute. I’m basically a “nobody” – an overweight grandma – but after having researched for this paper, I have come to a totally different conclusion as to why there is such in-your-face angst over Romney’s religion of choice: It’s all about money, power and control (in that order). I think they’re (the evangelical religious bigots, that is) scared half to death and are revving up their attacks, not to save souls, but to save their reputations (which if tarnished would lead to financial ruin).

As I said, all one must do is browse around the LDS official web site to see what the LDS Church believes and stands for. Any reasonable person would conclude that Mormons are not evil monsters at all. In fact, they are God fearing, Christ believing, Holy Ghost following people going about doing good. “You will know them by their fruit” and the LDS has plenty of fruit and they are willing to share.

Earlier, I stated that some high-powered ministries have publicly condemned Mormons: Shirley and James Dobson, the Southern Baptist Convention, Pat Robertson, and Dr. D. James Kennedy – just to name a few. There are hoards of others. Sunday after Sunday, preachers, evangelists, reverends and ministers from all Christian denominations pound the pulpit with anti-Mormon rhetoric. I heard the message loud clear when I was a Baptist and when I tiptoed through evangelical/Pentecostal territories. Was I ever miffed when I later learned for myself the Gospel truth about the LDS Church.

Just think about it, please. If Dr. D. James Kennedy, for example, who wrote the book, The Wolves Among Us, were to admit he’d been wrong in labeling the LDS Church a “cult” that leads unwary ignorant people astray (to hell), what would become of his multi-million-dollar ministry? Suffice it to say, there’s big money to be had by sale of books, tapes, CD’s, videos, and other anti-Mormon propaganda, not to mention speaking engagements and world-wide religious crusades. We’re talking trillions, all told. I realize the anti-Mormon aspect of these ministries is but a small portion of the business, but if the truth came out, that they had been using falsehoods about the LDS Church as a cash cow, their entire empires could tumble.

The ABC News program 20/20 aired on March 23, 2007, exposed the lavish lifestyles of some of the top evangelical preachers – million dollar mansions and personal jets. ABC News - 20/20 (2007) (Again, the LDS Church has no paid clergy.)

It’s nothing new. Severe harassment and persecution has been the lot of the LDS Church since it’s inception in 1820 when a 14-year-old boy named Joseph Smith saw visions and communed with heavenly beings. Rather than discuss the spiritual aspects of the LDS Church, however, let’s stick to facts of history. Taken from a college-level early American history textbook, Joseph Smith, upon experiencing the visions and visitations, believed “that God had work for me to do, and that my name should be for good and evil among all nations, kindreds and tongues.” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 292). The textbook continues, “They were met with hostility virtually everywhere they went . . . . As the movement gathered momentum, hundreds of people joined the church; entire congregations of churches of other faiths joined . . .” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 293)

During the dark time of American history when slavery was flourishing and when Native Americans were forced from their lands, the pioneers of the LDS Church also suffered at the hands of unscrupulous politicians, governmental leaders, and angry hate-filled mobs. “In the face of relentless persecution, Joseph Smith, the founder of the church, had led his flock to Illinois. There they had established the town of Nauvoo, which by the mid-1840’s had become the largest city in Illinois with over 15,000 people. . . In June 1844, a mob of non-Mormons broke into the jail where Smith was being held and killed both him and his brother. . .The Mormons abandoned Nauvoo in the spring of 1846 as anti-Mormons pounded the town with cannon, destroying the Great Temple. In a well-coordinated migration, 15,000 Mormons moved in stages to the Great Salt Lake.” Ayers, Gould, Oshinsky, and Soderlund (2004, p. 334-335) Many walked all the way and many died along the way, including innocent babes.

Joseph Smith at one time was tarred and feathered by a mob. No jury, no trial, no judge – and they had planned to castrate him, too. On October 27, 1838, the then governor of Missouri issued an “extermination order”: “The Mormons must be treated as enemies, and must be exterminated or driven from the State if necessary . . .” Far West History (n.d.) Please note that the order called for exterminating “Mormons” making no distinction between men, women and children, and indeed women and children were subject to the extermination order.

In an event known in LDS history as “the Haun’s Mill Massacre”, precipitated by the extermination order, 30 to 40 LDS families were surprised by some 200 to 250 militia. After the smoke cleared, seventeen LDS people lay dead including a ten-year-old boy. Thirteen LDS members were wounded including a woman and a seven-year-old boy. “A few Missourians returned the next day and took plunder.” LDS FAQ (n.d.) No Missouri militiamen were killed but three were wounded. Just a few years earlier, the LDS folk who died that day had been members of other churches - Congregational or Methodist or Baptist or Presbyterian.

In l976, Governor Bond of Missouri officially rescinded the extermination order and presented apologies for the “unfortunate developments” it caused. Quoting from Governor Bond’s Executive Order: “WHEREAS, Governor Boggs’ order clearly contravened the rights to life, liberty, property and religious freedom as guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States, as well as the Constitution of the State of Missouri; and . . . Expressing on behalf of all Missourians our deep regret for the injustice and undue suffering rescind Executive Order Number 44 dated October 27, 1838, issued by Governor W. Boggs. . .” Far West History (n.d.) The individuals who harassed, abused, and even murdered Mormons in cold blood were never tried for their crimes.

I read Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.’s Letter from Birmingham Jail and it really touched my heart. There he was, suffering for the Lord in jail, and these religious leaders with highfalutin titles on the outside wrote an open letter (“A Call for Unity”) in which they criticize King’s tactics and basically blame King for the racial turmoil of the time. Though you can tell King is upset and hurt by the attack – made worse because he’s stuck in jail and can’t confront the religious leaders face-to-face – his response is gentle genius. “I wish you had commended the Negro sit-inners and demonstrators of Birmingham for their sublime courage, their willingness to suffer, and their amazing discipline in the midst of great provocation. One day the South will recognize its real heroes.” Barnet and Bedau (2005, p. 881)

King has a few choice words for the Church, too: “If today’s church does not recapture the sacrificial spirit of the early church, it will lose its authenticity, forfeit the loyalty of millions, and be dismissed as an irrelevant social club with no meaning for the twentieth century. Every day I meet young people whose disappointment with the church has turned into outright disgust.” Barnet and Bedau (2005, p. 880)

King signs off with “Yours for the cause of Peace and Brotherhood”.

There’s an eerie commonality between what JFK and MLK endured at the hands of the religious bigots of their day and what Mitt Romney is facing today. I hope and pray that Romney will be able to fend off these undeserved attacks from the religious hypocrites with the same grace, dignity and God-inspired resolve displayed by the other two.

A few popular bumper stickers read: “Honk if you love Jesus” and “Christians aren’t perfect, just forgiven” or “Jesus is my co-pilot”. Yet, apparently, these same bumper-sticker Christians are the ones waging war against Mitt Romney’s run for the Presidency solely on the basis of his chosen faith in a Church that bears the name of the Savior of the world.

References

ABC News - 20/20 (2007). Philanthropic donations come from your heart, but where do they end up? Ex-money manager says "enough!" to secretive Christian Ministry spending. Glenn Ruppel & John Stossel. United States: ABC News.

Ayers, E. L., Gould, L. L., Oshinsky, D. M., & Soderlund, J. R. (2004). American Passages - a history of the United States - Volume I: to 1877 (2nd ed.). Belmont, California: Thomson/Wadsworth.

Barnet, S., & Bedau, H. (2005). Letter from Birmingham Jail. Current Issues and Enduring Questions - a guide to critical thinking and argument, with readings (7th ed., pp. 867-882). Boston and New York: Bedford/St. Martin's.

Far West History. (n.d.). The Extermination Order and how it was rescinded. Retrieved April 28, 2007, from http://www.jwha.info/mmff/exorder.htm

Hewitt, H. (2007). A Mormon in the White House? 10 things every American should know about Mitt Romney. Washington, D.C.: Regnery Publishing, Inc.

John F. Kennedy Presidential Library & Museum. (1960, September 12). Address of Senator John F. Kennedy to the Greater Houston Ministerial Association. Retrieved April 22, 2007, from http://www.jfklibrary.org

Lds Faq. (n.d.). What was the Haun's Mill Massacre? Retrieved April 28-2007, 2004, from Brigham Young University Web Site: http://ldsfaq.byu.edu/view.asp?q=57

Media Matters for America. (2007). Fox News whitewashes evangelical hostility to Romney's faith. Retrieved April 22, 2007, from http://mediamatters.org/items/printable/200702280002


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: boggsforgovernor; cuespookymusic; election; lds; mormon; mormons; romney; whitesalamanderblues
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To: edsheppa; Afronaut
For example, they might say to themselves, there is all this ignorant intolerance of Mormons out there. If a Mormon were to be elected president, probably a lot of that would disappear. I'm sure many Catholics thought something similar about Kennedy.

Is there some kind of mantra, JFK=Mitt Romney that we aren't all aware of? I missed class that day, I guess.

Trying to equate the two is a red herring, IMO. AND, you're missing the most important thing...JFK was a dem. We're talking about the Republican nomination with Mitt, and if he gets the nod, Republicans will be shut out of the WH and the dems will gain a large majority in the congress...don't think they aren't counting on it.

281 posted on 05/04/2007 1:54:14 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I'm proud to be a FREDHEAD. Run Fred Run!)
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To: Colofornian
if a person cannot properly define what true Christianity is, then on what basis do we expect him/her to properly define what is Islam or radical Islam or jihadic Islam or Wahhabi Islam?

That's what the bottom line if for you??? If Romney (as most Mormons) considers himself a Christian and you don't you'd vote against him on that basis???

282 posted on 05/04/2007 1:58:41 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: GrandEagle

Actually, I am Catholic and I frequent Catholic bookshops a lot. We must be a very self-interested group of people (LOL!), because I have never, ever seen a book that so much as mentioned Baptists, or any other religion! There are boatloads of books on catechism, apologetics, Mary, the Saints, Holy Communion, the Pope, the rosary, baptism, scapulars, etc., IOW all the bells and whistles pertaining to our faith.

In our library in our parish, we additionally do have a small section containing books (it appeared after 9/11, when people’s curiosity about islam got piqued) such as “world religions for dummies” type books which give a brief overview of what other faiths believe, but I have never even opened one of them, so I have to admit that I have no idea what is presented in them. However, these books are not “Catholic” books, they are secular books that would readily be found (and I have seen them) in a Borders or Barnes and Noble in the Religion section, so if there is anything derogatory in them, it is probably against Catholics anyway!


283 posted on 05/04/2007 1:59:52 PM PDT by VRWCer ("The Bible is the Rock on which this Republic rests." - President Andrew Jackson)
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To: AxelPaulsenJr

Haven’t finished the thread, so this already may have been posted, but I googled and found this link, which not only contains a link to an image of a man and a woman wearing the garments, but also a lenghty and thorough description of the Temple and the ceremonies/rituals. Very informative, I think you will find it interesting! (I know I did!)

http://home.teleport.com/~packham/temples.htm


284 posted on 05/04/2007 2:04:05 PM PDT by VRWCer ("The Bible is the Rock on which this Republic rests." - President Andrew Jackson)
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To: Theophilus

Romans 13:3-5 (King James Version)
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.


Exodus 23

31 “I will fix your boundary from the Red Sea to the sea of the Philistines, and from the wilderness to the River Euphrates; for I will deliver the inhabitants of the land into your hand, and you will drive them out before you. 32 “You shall make no covenant with them or with their gods. 33 “They shall not live in your land, because they will make you sin against Me; for if you serve their gods, it will surely be a snare to you.”


285 posted on 05/04/2007 2:05:26 PM PDT by Netizen (If we can't locate/deport illegals, how will we get them to come forward to pay their $3,250 fines?)
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To: colorado tanker
Well, obviously there are folks around today who are convinced if Romney wins he’ll take orders from Salt Lake City,

Carvile, Begala, Ickes, Chris Matthews, Keith Olberpoop, all the assorted MSM lackeys of the Clinton campaign will be pushing that message...with the electorate as closely divided as it is, you want to bet that there won't be enough sheeple who swallow it to swing the election? I don't.

286 posted on 05/04/2007 2:05:57 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I'm proud to be a FREDHEAD. Run Fred Run!)
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To: VRWCer
Haven’t finished the thread, so this already may have been posted, but I googled and found this link, which not only contains a link to an image of a man and a woman wearing the garments, but also a lenghty and thorough description of the Temple and the ceremonies/rituals. Very informative, I think you will find it interesting! (I know I did!)

I haven't seen that site before. Thanks for posting.

287 posted on 05/04/2007 2:08:35 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I'm proud to be a FREDHEAD. Run Fred Run!)
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To: greyfoxx39
For example, they might say to themselves, there is all this ignorant intolerance of Mormons out there. If a Mormon were to be elected president, probably a lot of that would disappear. I'm sure many Catholics thought something similar about Kennedy.

Is there some kind of mantra, JFK=Mitt Romney that we aren't all aware of? I missed class that day, I guess.

Yes, it's like the mantra the gays have comparing their "plight" to that of the civil rights movement in the 60s.

288 posted on 05/04/2007 2:12:48 PM PDT by needlenose_neely
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To: greyfoxx39
Well, if Hillary is the Dem nominee, it will be very nasty whoever our nominee is. With Romney it would be religion, with Guiliani it would be his personal life. With McCain it would be, what, his cancer?
289 posted on 05/04/2007 2:16:27 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker
That's what the bottom line if for you??? If Romney (as most Mormons) considers himself a Christian and you don't you'd vote against him on that basis???

First of all, it's not the only consideration.

Like others in here, I weigh issues like personal character, social issues' stances, voting record, public statements.

Secondly, I've already said that even among the faith issues, the "definition of true Christianity" is not the only issue. The Bible shows that it's important for leaders to be guided by God, and to persistently call upon Him for guidance (the prayer issue we've talked about). Also, as I've mentioned, pinpointing a candidate's discernment skills are very important.

Let me give you a parallel: We don't want to be solo issue voters, right? So we don't want to evaluate a candidate on the solo issue of abortion, right? Well, yes and no. "No" in that many other issues and character and track record and faith issues all also come into play. But "yes" in that a person's commitment or lack thereof toward the most vulnerable in society will tell you a lot about the rest of what I just mentioned without even looking. A pro-abortion candidate will usually have a libertyless voting record. If mayhem in the womb is a non-issue to him/her, or if he's/she's pro-violence in the womb, then what does that say about his/her character?

Also, as I pointed out in my previous post, the definition of true Christianity is not something that occurs in a vacuum. And neither does properly "reading" Islam. Properly reading Islam, and its elements, IS a vital foreign policy/national security issue! If a president doesn't get a proper "read" of the threat posed by some elements of Islam, then where is his/her natural security discernment? (I mean don't we call it a gaff if a candidate makes an off-base comment about some world religion?)

So what? You think discernment skills in the Oval Office is a kindergarten issue? You think it doesn't matter if a president is wildly off-base in his/her understanding of Jihadic Islam, or of other world religions like historic Christianity? These are simple take it or leave it issues?

If you think that, you are naive. We can perhaps "get away with" (to some degree) such outright deception at lower offices, but not in the Oval Office in this juncture of our history.

290 posted on 05/04/2007 2:19:00 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: Saundra Duffy

There seems to be a conflation of a couple of issues in this article. The first issue is whether or not folks would vote for Mr. Romney, taking into account his religious affiliation. The second is the position of the LDS church in relationship to Christianity.

A third issue might be religious bigotry toward LDS folks.

Regarding the first issue, myself, if I thought that Mr. Romney were actually a sincere social conservative, I’d vote for him. I couldn’t care less about his religious affiliation. I won’t refuse to vote for him because he’s a Mormon, but rather because he’s a fraud.

However, as a Catholic, I agree with the Church’s teaching, and with the beliefs of most Christian ecclesial communities, that the LDS church is not a Christian church or ecclesial community, and that it doesn’t hold to a Christian theology. I don’t want to have a big debate over this, I just want to point out that this is the sincere belief of most Christian communities the world over.

Ironically, the LDS church used to be a bit more pronounced in proclaiming its own view that it is the rest of us whose theology is fundamentally false and apostasized. So, I’m not sure that LDS folks have much of a complaint to make that we believe that the LDS church isn’t Christian, as LDS teaching is that our beliefs are apostasy from true Christianity.

The third issue is religious bigotry. I think that folks can be anti-Romney without being anti-LDS. I also think that folks can be anti-LDS without being bigoted toward the LDS and its members. Although I don’t believe a word of LDS teaching that differs from the teaching of the Catholic Church, I don’t view myself as an anti-LDS bigot. I just think that the LDS is wrong. Very wrong.

Nonetheless, I’m cool with Mormons generally as persons.


291 posted on 05/04/2007 2:20:45 PM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: colorado tanker
Well, if Hillary is the Dem nominee, it will be very nasty whoever our nominee is. With Romney it would be religion, with Guiliani it would be his personal life. With McCain it would be, what, his cancer?

McCain gives them multiple choices, doesn't he? If we can't get Fred, I hope none of the RudyMcRomney trio make it. I think Hunter looked o.k. to some during the debate.

RUN FRED RUN, RUN FRED RUN!

292 posted on 05/04/2007 2:21:06 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I'm proud to be a FREDHEAD. Run Fred Run!)
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To: greyfoxx39
Now, just what was the question again?

The question is in my post 260. I know you read it, because it was that post to which you responded you wouldn't 'take the bait'.

Clearly, you are unable to answer the question.

293 posted on 05/04/2007 2:21:51 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MHGinTN

I find it sort of amusing when people can’t (or won’t)answer a question that goes to the very heart of the position they are attempting to argue. It proves they have no basis to their stance, and they know it.


294 posted on 05/04/2007 2:23:43 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: MEGoody
Um, wrong. She posted the requisite Mormon Temple oath Mitt took and it contradicts the Oath of office and places his first fidelity to the Mormon Church, if he gets to the oath of office.

NEXT ...

295 posted on 05/04/2007 2:27:18 PM PDT by MHGinTN (You've had life support. Promote life support for others.)
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To: Colofornian
If you have listened to Romney at all, he "gets" islamofascism and it's role in global terror.

I think you don't like Mormons and have created an enormous smokescreen to justify why you just won't vote for one.

296 posted on 05/04/2007 2:28:20 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: greyfoxx39
Sorry, didn’t mean to exclude Fred, assuming he’ll eventually run. I’m sure Hillary’s hatchet men would go after him too, but he’s got that kind of good-natured persona and optimism that makes it hard for the attacks to stick, sorta like the Gipper IMHO.
297 posted on 05/04/2007 2:31:08 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker; Colofornian; Elsie; MHGinTN
I think you don't like Mormons and have created an enormous smokescreen to justify why you just won't vote for one.

Love the Mormons.
Hate the Mormonism.

298 posted on 05/04/2007 2:33:12 PM PDT by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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To: MEGoody; Colofornian; MHGinTN; needlenose_neely; Pan_Yans Wife; colorcountry; VRWCer
Personally, I don't see anything in that pledge that is scarey. I don't see that it would conflict with the oath he would take if elected President. If you disagree, please point out specifically what you see as a problem.

Oh, do you mean this part: "Romney made this vow as part of a mormon temple ritual: "You and each of you covenant and promise before God, angels, and these witnesses at this altar, that you do accept the Law of Consecration as contained in the Doctrine and Covenants, in that you do consecrate yourselves, your time, talents, and everything with which the Lord has blessed you, or with which he may bless you, to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, for the building up of the Kingdom of God on the earth and for the establishment of Zion.

"consecrate yourselves, your time, talents and everything you have or will have" (including the power you gain as POTUS) "to the LDS church for the building up of some mythical "Kingdom" and for the establishment of Zion.

That doesn't give you pause? That doesn't have any escape clause in there that I can see. I suppose there might be a question as to just what the "establishment of Zion" might mean today, but it DIDN'T mean the good ol' USA then, and I'm quite certain it doesn't mean the good ol' USA today. Frankly, in spite of the much used lately mantra of JFK=Romney, this particular oath just might cause a voter or three to hesitate pulling the handle for Mitt.

299 posted on 05/04/2007 2:39:00 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I'm proud to be a FREDHEAD. Run Fred Run!)
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To: MHGinTN

Three. And you.


300 posted on 05/04/2007 2:44:20 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (I'm proud to be a FREDHEAD. Run Fred Run!)
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