Posted on 03/29/2007 8:51:40 AM PDT by Fennie
According to information gleaned from a senior source in the Iranian armed forces joint chief of staff, logistical support for the groups that would participate in the plan comes from Brigadier General Qassim Suleimani of the Revolutionary Guards al Quds Brigades. "Most of Iran's visitors in the last four months, including the heads of Hezbollah cells in the Persian Gulf and Europe and North America were asked, when they met with the Iranian intelligence minister and his aides: Are you ready to defend the Islamic revolution? "If you agree to take part in the great Jihad, what would you need to be ready for the great fight?...
Quantity is not Quality. Look at what the Israelis have done to bring back an arab-goat devastated land into fruitfulness. A tree is known by its fruit. The Israelis are flowering in every way, vs what's on the other side of the fence. Quantity is not Quality.
"The UK military, such as it is, is man for man as good as anyone's. True. But, how many ships, planes and divisions have you? Fewer than you need to be taken seriously as a great power, especially as a conventional great power. Russia, China and India are more powerful, as is probably Israel."
Originally posted by: UKrepublican
"Our country is not the same as it once was, it never will reach that level again. There is no way a nation our size could afford to sustain our position in the modern world. Our military isn't as great as it once was, but it's still good enough to work with out international friends if a job needs doing. We have more than shown that to be the case.:
The UK did not have a problem in the past maintaining a world class Navy. Here are some numbers with the pre-WWII 1939 Royal Navy when the UK had a population base of around 48 million (not including the "Empire"). The same comparison is made for the 1941 US Navy when the population base of the United States was around 132 million. The industrial bases of both nations did a very good job of expanding their Navies even with the combat losses both suffered. I do wonder why today when the UK with a poplulation base of around 60 million and the 4th largest economy in the world has problem supporting a Navy of sufficient size?
| Type | Pre-war Royal Navy | Pre-war US Navy | Aug 1945 Royal Navy | Aug 1945 US Navy |
| Carriers, Fleet | 5 | 7 | 5 | 19 |
| Carriers, Fleet Light | 2 | 2 | 8 | 9 |
| Carriers, Escort | 0 | 0 | 40* | 71 |
| Battleships/Battlecruisers | 15 | 15 | 15 | 25 |
| Cruisers, Heavy & Light | 66 | 37 | 67 | 72 |
| Destroyers/Destroyer Escorts | 184 | 171 | 308** | 738 |
| Submarines, Fleet | 60 | 112 | 162 | 232 |
| Total Major Warships | 332 | 344 | 605 | 1,166 |
Notes:
* = Includes 39 Lend-Lease Escort Carriers from USA
** = Includes 50 Lend-Lease Destroyers from USA
Source: Royal Navy and World War 2, Losses
Source: Department of the Navy, Naval Historical Center
Source: Department of the Navy, Naval Historical Center
Source: Hazegray Naval History
The August 1945 US Navy totals do NOT include ship classes such as Mine Warfare, Patrol (Corvettes, PT boats, etc), Amphibious (LST, LSD, etc), Auxiliary (tankers, cargo etc) in any way. Not to mention the ships of the United States Army. :-) If all the US Navy ships in commission in August 1945 were listed the the US Navy would have an end strength of 6,768 ships. The largest Navy which has ever existed in the history of the world.
It will be nice when Britain finally gets back into the big carrier business, maybe then they will buy the necessary escorts for their two planned big-deck carriers. These large carriers combined with their version of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter will again make them the solid number two Navy in the world. However in the mean time it looks as if the Royal Navy will shrink even further until 2015...
On a historical note, I think that the "passing of the torch" as the leading Navy occured late in the year 1944. That is when the newly formed British Pacific Fleet left the UK proper for the Pacific Ocean...
Probably the biggest shock the Brits had in WWII was in December 1944 when the Naval combat of the European Theatre had diminished to the extent that Britain was able to put together their most powerful Naval task force of WWII - the British Pacific Fleet. It included four of their largest Fleet carriers, two fast battleships, five cruisers, fifteen destroyers and support ships. Commanded by Admiral Sir Bruce Fraser the newly formed British Pacific Fleet steamed towards it namesake ocean to join the US Navy in action against the Empire of Japan.
Admiral Fraser was very proud to command the very cream of the WWII British Royal Navy - but he and the British sailors quickly got three jolts upon their arrival in the Pacific Theatre. First was that the British Pacific Fleet was lost among the numbers of ships of US Pacific Fleets then in operations against the Imperial Japanese Navy. Second problem was that the Royal Navy did not have a handle on underway-replenishment - a requirement to maintain the operational tempo in the vast Pacific theatre. The British fleet train was never up to the job, even with US Navy assistance. The third jolt was that the British fleet was not up to US Navy combat standards for the Pacific war against Imperial Japan - it took three months of work in secondary theatres before the British "Task-Force 57" and its Air Groups were ready for action as a first-line force.
The Pacific scale of combat and size of the US Navy Pacific Fleets brought home the fact to the British Royal Navy that had lost its centuries old title as the "Ruler of the Waves" - to the new Mistress of the Seas - the United States Navy.
dvwjr
What a coincidence...
Can't be helped now, and never really could with our open society. The contingency plan for the fifth-column is to act to gather-them-up right at the beginning of hostilities. I have to believe that the domestic muzzies have been planned for.
"...Were it not for this, we would have bombed Iran long ago to remove their meddling in Iraq. Now we are reaching a point because of nukes they will be achieving where we will have to take that risk..."
It's time! We cannot allow Iran to make even one A-Bomb. If they make even one bomb, Ahmanutjob is likely to try to use it as an air-burst, knowing what an EMP is. He IS insane!
"...Note: intel sources have reported at least six viable nuke warhead missiles inside Iran ready to go. Iran realizes they cannot go to war with a "revolver" with only six "nuclear bullets" - thus their frantic effort to produce more of the same to have reloads..."
I agree that they have the missles. Old intel indicates that they've got some of the N. Korean 'big-dongs', but if they had functional nukes, Israel would have whacked them as soon as they learned about it, and the Israeli intel is the best in that region.
Pakistan achieved the 'islamic' bomb, and we started paying attention. We knew about Irans plans to make Nuclear Weapons over ten years ago, and watched their progress, along with watching Iraq and Libya. We took-out Iraq, and Libya tossed-in the towel (MooHAMmar pays attention).
As long ago as last August, it was probable that Iran would have enough fissile material by April, 2007, to make at least one A-Bomb - maybe more. They're using the Paki technique, parts, equipment, and blueprints - we were not able to stop that data-flow until after we attacked the Taliban in Afghanistan, and put-the-screws to Mushareff in Pakistan.
The time has run out, and the events will now play out. "Cry havoc, and let slip the dogs of war!" ............. FRegards
They DO have nukes - go to "Iran's Nukes" on www.antimullah.com and select Archive Details and scroll down till you get to the article which details sources of their nukes.
Israel does not want to nuke anyone till they have to. So far like everyone else, we try to hope the need will pass - while it continues to approach like a train without brakes or a reverse gear as per Ahmadinutjob
"could" ain't worth nothin' without no "would".
If those Brits aren't released by then, watch for fireworks to begin.
L
Think "National Health".
L
"National Health."
Yeah, lottsa moola. But hey, what's up with their National dental plan? :-E
dvwjr
Don't miss the forest for the trees. As Stalin said: "Quantity has its own quality."
The simple demographic fact is all of western civilization, with America as the sole exception, is dying. And America is only maintaining, not growing.
They may be nuts, but they ARE going to rule the world.
UK has 1000+ years experience in diplomacy and espionage.
I have to think that HMG is considering the options carefully whilst weighing Parliamentary stomach for
a fight with Iran.
They have taken American soldiers and murdered them...
Cut their heads off too...
And what have we done about it???
Well...We're still there...Dishing it right back at them!
I'm not sure what else we are actually supposed to be doing...Actually I do, but thats beside the point...
An analogy of the situation would be the equivalent of the "rope a dope" strategy used by Muhammad Ali...
If Baghdad (our troops) were Muhammad Ali, and the insurgents (Iranians) were the "other boxer"...Which on the surface appears to be a very formidable, never-ending opponent...And that other boxer just kept on punching, and we just kept on taking those punches...Our punches going out are effective and more powerful...Wearing down that opponent over a longer period time...
You'd think we would be doing just fine in that ring...
I believe we are...
But in the 15th round...Your coach throws in the towel, and you think you have enough in you to finish the fight???
See the coach (Democrats and liberal/socialist anti-war filth) think we should have pulled out long before the fight is over...Therefore we lose...
Do you see the similarities yet???
I apologize for my fellow American's sleight it was done without discernment. I have served alongside British units and individuals and I am proud to have done so. You are our ally and friend. I pray for the leaders of Britain as well as all our Allies and our own leaders that they grow increasingly strong and resolute to defend the West.
I pray for those who have suffered the Bombings of your Subways. I pray for the families and children of Beslyn murdered by our common enemy that Russia may reunite with the West in this fight.
I pray for the People and for every Soldier, Sailor, Airmen and Marine of the West that they be strong in their faith and resolute in defense of liberty.
W
The only world they have any hope of ruling is the UNDERworld, as one more batch of demons...murderers, thieves, witches don't make it to heaven.
BUMP for OPERATION ROACH SQUASH!
Are you in South Dakota ?
Yes, about five miles from Mt. Rushmore.........thus my screen name.
I can't tell you how much that turns my stomach.
My pioneer grandmother and other founders of this country didn't settle here for the likes of THAT.
Yes, I'm Bigoted against Muslims, AND PROUD OT IT.
Isn't this the same Iran that couldn't beat Saddam after 8 years who's army we wiped out in a few hours???
just asking.
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