Posted on 03/03/2007 6:36:47 AM PST by Jeff Head
Edited on 03/03/2007 8:34:45 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
In 1991, when the Soviet Union dissolved, the second full-size aircraft carrier for the Soviet Union, the Varyag-sister ship to the Kuznetsov, was under construction in the Ukraine. Withe the Soviet demise, the Ukraine inherited the incomplete vessel but did not have the finances to complete her. In 1992 a Chinese delegation visited the Ukraine in the hopes of coming to terms on a purchase price of the unfinished vessel. A suitable purchase price was not agreed upon. Later, in 1998, the Chong Lot Travel Agency, a supposed Maccu firm, bought the Varyag from the Ukraine for $20 million dollars with the stated intention of making the Varyag a casino for commercial profit. As it turned out, Chong Lot had no offices in Maccu and was simply a front company for a Hong Kong firm called Chinluck Holding Co. Ltd. As it also turned out, the managing directors of Chinluck, had strong ties to the Chinese navy. It took three years for the front firm, Chong Lot Travel, to get permission to tow the Varyag through the Istanbul Straits and on to China. That permission was finally granted in 2001 and the following pictures document what has occurred to the Varyag since. |
![]() The Ukrainian Carrier Varyag in Ukraine Naval Yards, approximately 70% complete, prior to being towed away by Chong Lot Travel Agency.
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In October of 2006, the Kommersant online newspaper in Moscow announced a deal between Russia and China where the Russians sell up to 50 Su-33 fighters to China for $2.5 billion. Details seem to indicate that China will spend $100 million to buy two Su-33 fighters from Komsomolsk-on-Amur Production Association for evaluation, with delivery expected in 2007. There appears to also be a fairly firm option for 12 more Su-33 fighters, with the potential for the deal to add another 36 SU-33s. In that event, the deal would total the $2.5 billion. The SU-33 fighter is the navalized version of the SU-27 fighter that China has purchased in large numbers from the Russians and now license builds themselves. It is the same fighter that the Russians use on their carrier, the Kuznetsov, which is the older sister ship to the Varyag. In addition, over the last two years, the Chinese have been negotiating with the Russians regarding the KA-31 helicopter, which is the helicopter the Russians use on their carrier for AEW duties. The Chinese have also introduced designs for prop-driven AEW aircraft of their own similar to the United States E-2 Hawkeye aircraft. The continuing efforts by the PLAN to obtain navalized, carrier fighters and AEW aircraft from Russia (or design their own), coupled with the recent completion of a non-skid surface on the flight deck of the Varyag, and its painting in official PLAN colors, make it abudnantly clear that this vessel, at some future date, will be China's first aircraft carrier. |
![]() ![]() ![]() In 2005 and 2006 the Chinese negotiated with the Russians to purchase SU-33 naval fighters for carrier operations, receiving special demonstations at Moscow and Chinese military airshows.
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WHile all of this has been occuring, the PLAN has embarked on a phenominal naval ship building and modernization program, simultaneously working on ten to twelve new classes of major combatants and building several of each at one time. This program has already developed and launched all of the necessary modern classes of guided missile destroyers, guided missile frigates, attack submarines, and supply ships to form the basis for a very powerful carrier strike group once a carrier is available...and to defend and supply it in the blue water, as the following pictures attest. |
![]() Two new modern, AEGIS-like area air defense destroyers for the PLAN, equiped with VLS and PAR. These ships would be very capable as escorts for a carrier.
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It is this author's and researcher's opinion that the Chinese Navy (PLAN) will launch the Varyag in the 2008-2010 time frame and begin trials and training for her use as an operational aircraft carrier with a wing of SU-33 aircraft, perhaps modernized with vectored thrust and strike at sea and ground attack capabilities in addition to its already significant air superiority capabilites. Furthermore, this air wing will be supported by KA-31 AEW helos operating off the carrier in conjunction with other ASW and SAR helicopters. This training will be ongoing for several years as the PLAN gains experience in carrier operations, and will prepare them for the introduction of one or more of their own indigenous carrier later in the 2010 decade, which will include Chinese indigenous navalized aircraft and their own, more capable AEW and EW aircraft. |
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Copyright © 2007 by Jeff Head
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Oh I agree. Were I am enemy of the US I would worry about the array of weapons that we have and can bring to bear. The problem as I see it is that many tinpot countries have extremely good capabilities - that they bought. One lucky shot - which will happen sooner or later - and we have a carrier in deep trouble with no way out but the Straits of Hormuz.
For example, the Spruance destroyers, among the quietest most effective ASW platforms we had have all been decommissioned, many of them with 10-20 years service life left in them. The majority of them have been sunk in live fire exercises. IMHO it is a sad day when you see sites like these...
Of the 79 vessels you mention, 19 of them were these very effective ASW destroyers, built at great cost to the US taxpayers, and capable of providing a significant reserve...but not from the bottom of the sea. We are doing ourselves (sinking these mangificent warships) what any enemy would lose a war to try and accomplish.
Ship's Name | Hull Number | Homeport / Status |
---|---|---|
SPRUANCE | DD 963 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
PAUL F. FOSTER | DD 964 | decommissioned |
KINKAID | DD 965 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
HEWITT | DD 966 | decommissioned, scrapped |
ELLIOT | DD 967 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
ARTHUR W. RADFORD | DD 968 | decommissioned |
PETERSON | DD 969 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
CARON | DD 970 | decommissioned, sunk during tests |
DAVID R. RAY | DD 971 | decommissioned |
OLDENDORF | DD 972 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
JOHN YOUNG | DD 973 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
COMTE DE GRASSE | DD 974 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
O'BRIEN | DD 975 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
MERRILL | DD 976 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
BRISCOE | DD 977 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
STUMP | DD 978 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
CONOLLY | DD 979 | decommissioned |
MOOSBRUGGER | DD 980 | decommissioned, scrapped |
JOHN HANCOCK | DD 981 | decommissioned, scrapped |
NICHOLSON | DD 982 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
JOHN RODGERS | DD 983 | decommissioned, scrapped |
LEFTWICH | DD 984 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
CUSHING | DD 985 | decommissioned |
HARRY W. HILL | DD 986 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
O'BANNON | DD 987 | decommissioned |
THORN | DD 988 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
DEYO | DD 989 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
INGERSOLL | DD 990 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
FIFE | DD 991 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
FLETCHER | DD 992 | decommissioned |
HAYLER | DD 997 | decommissioned, sunk as target |
...and I would not limit it to the straits there in the PG. The Chinese are building an effective and modern blue water navy...while we sink many of our own vessels.
Nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
There are private jets and motor yachts that cost $20M...
The Bill Clinton
This cannot possibly be true.
Just last night, I heard on NPR that China doesn't have the military budget to support a carrier fleet.
NPR wouldn't lie to us.
/sarcasm
Maybe all three.
Yep...but not any more. All decommissioned and oly six or seven even left afloat. We also sank the USS America CV and the USS Belleau Wood LHA as well, both of which could have easily been kept in reserve as servicable, commissionable vessels for emergencies.
The VLS Spruances were GREAT ASW and anti-surface warfare (particularly ground) vessels. No reason they shouldn't be in an active reserve role.
See post 162 and be prepared (IMHO) to cringe.
Suicidal Hubris to put it diplomatically!!Those hulls still have atleast 15 years of useful life in them.Heck,the US could have sold them off to Taiwan,Turkey or even Indonesia.Upgrade the sensor suites & arm em with ESSM,RAM & ASROCs.It would have made a perfect defensive ship.
It is unbelievable. I can understand perhaps using one or two for sinking with studies for water-tight integrity, structural soundness, effetiveness of weapons, etc...but to sink 19 of them? Unbelievable and I belive almost criminally derelect.
In addition, we have taken all of the S-3 aircraft out of service from the aircraft carriers. Their long legs for ASW and loiter capability and the amount of ordinance they carried will be sorely missed in CSG ASW defense. With the SPruances gone and the S-3s gone, there is a huge hole (IMHO) in our carrier strike group ASW defense...and to me, that is equally derelict.
The CHinese see all this and are responding by building more and more modern major combatants.
Here is a good pictorial representation of the current difference in our naval strenmgthening strategies:
China's solution to naval moderinization--- US solution to naval modernization
In addition, we have taken all of the S-3 aircraft out of service from the aircraft carriers. Their long legs for ASW and loiter capability and the amount of ordinance they carried will be sorely missed in CSG ASW defense. With the SPruances gone and the S-3s gone, there is a huge hole (IMHO) in our carrier strike group ASW defense...and to me, that is equally derelict.
The CHinese see all this and are responding by building more and more modern major combatants.
Here is a good pictorial representation of the current difference in our naval strenmgthening strategies:
...and it almost has to be the Varyag, unless they have somehow managed to conceal from sat and intelligence and the common man a carrier construction somewhere else (very doubtful).
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