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To: peteram

It's been pretty well established that the Shroud of Turin is a medieval fraud.


65 posted on 02/23/2007 6:30:24 AM PST by Tallguy
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To: Tallguy
Shhhh! Don't say that, you'll stir up all the True Believers.

There are people who seem to have an awful lot invested emotionally in the Shroud of Turin.

The bishop of the time declared it a fraud, and knew the artist. A modern investigator has demonstrated how it was done. The Shroud-ologists go through all sorts of gymnastics to explain those facts away (the bishop was in competition for fees with the monastery that had the Shroud, etc. etc.) but this far removed in time that's the best we're going to get. The contemporaneous evidence is what clinches it for me.

69 posted on 02/23/2007 6:33:43 AM PST by AnAmericanMother ((Ministrix of Ye Chase, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment)))
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To: Tallguy
It's been pretty well established that the Shroud of Turin is a medieval fraud.

Look up the "Sudarium of Oviedo". This is the facecloth that went with the Shroud. It has been in Spain since 600 AD (700 years before the Shroud came to France). The bloody marks on the facecloth, and their DNA match those on the Shroud perfectly.

You may be thinking of the carbon-dating, which indicated a Mediaeval provenance. However the dating was done on a piece of the Shroud used as a "gripping point" during public viewing. For centuries the Shroud was displayed to the public, and held lengthwise by a dozen prelates at least once a year - and their hands weren't all that clean. Its easy to see how this could throw out the C14 dating. (Also, of course the entire Shroud was suffused in woodsmoke during a fire in 1532, further corrupting C14 data).

85 posted on 02/23/2007 6:45:46 AM PST by agere_contra
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To: Tallguy

Please point to the proof.

If you actually investigate, the science actually places it as an artifact that is likely from the same time and location of Jesus burial.


86 posted on 02/23/2007 6:46:04 AM PST by Notwithstanding ("You are either with America in our time of need or you are not" - W? No, 'twas Sen. Hillary 9/12/01)
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To: Tallguy

Maybe you're more up on the Shroud circuit than myself, but there's been plenty of new discoveries that throw the carbon-dating of the late 80s/early 90s completely into question. Namely, the samples they carbon dated were most likey portions of the shroud that had been repaired and rewoven in the 13th or 14th century after it was severely damaged. That being said, there still remain a good number of issues that ought be resolved by the the "medieval fraud" camp (the presence of pollen particles produced only by middle eastern plants, how backwards medievalers produced a photographic negative, etc). Don't get me wrong, my faith would remain unchanged were the Shroud CONVINCINGLY debunked, but it hasn't been.


88 posted on 02/23/2007 6:46:45 AM PST by Squire of St. Michael
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To: Tallguy; All
It's been pretty well established that the Shroud of Turin is a medieval fraud.

Not so fast. Read the following for the latest research.

shroudstory.
134 posted on 02/23/2007 7:19:13 AM PST by khnyny
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To: Tallguy
It's been pretty well established that the Shroud of Turin is a medieval fraud.

No. The 1988 Carbon Dating has been totally discredited. They tested a 16th Century patch that has been proved to have been chemically and physically different from the main body of the Shroud.

203 posted on 02/23/2007 11:45:36 AM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE is "AAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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