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US preacher defends belief women can't teach men
Reuters ^ | 08/24/06

Posted on 08/24/2006 10:02:06 AM PDT by presidio9

A U.S. Baptist preacher has publicly defended himself for firing a female Sunday School teacher after more than 50 years on the job because he believes the Bible bans women from teaching men.

Watertown First Baptist Church Pastor Tim LaBouf, also a city council member in Watertown, N.Y., said women could fulfill any role or responsibility they wanted to -- outside the church.

"My belief is that the qualifications for both men and women teaching spiritual matters in a church setting end at the church door, period," LaBouf said in a statement on the church Web site (http://www.nnyinfo.com/firstbaptist).

LaBouf and the church board fired Mary Lambert, 81, earlier this month in a letter that cited the scriptural qualifications for Sunday School teachers, Lambert said.

"They quote First Timothy Two, 11-14: A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, she must be silent," Lambert said, reading from the letter.

"I was astonished," she said. "I would not go back and teach as long as this is their thinking."

Watertown is 250 miles northwest of New York City.

William Carlsen, executive minister for American Baptist Churches of New York State, said U.S. Baptist Churches are autonomous and that there would not be many other Baptist Churches that share LaBouf's view.

"A considerable number if not a majority of American Baptist Churches have been quite aggressive in affirming the place of women's leadership roles within the church," Carlsen said.

The board of the Watertown First Baptist Church said in a statement on its Web site that the scripture rules concerning women teaching men in a church setting had only played a small part in Lambert's sacking.

"Christian courtesy motivates us to refrain from making any public accusations against her," the board said.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Miscellaneous; US: New York
KEYWORDS: postedinwrongforum
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To: ketelone

yup


81 posted on 08/24/2006 10:40:48 AM PDT by thoughtomator (There is no "Islamofascism" - there is only Islam)
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To: ArGee
You know, I have an opinion on this subject, but exactly WHY is it news? Exactly WHY is it a subject for political discussion - - except to support the right of a church to choose its leadership in any way it sees fit?

You may have just answered your own question, but what does a question about proper thread material have specifically to do with politics?

82 posted on 08/24/2006 10:41:47 AM PDT by presidio9 (“The term ‘civilians’ does not exist in Islamic religious law.”)
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To: mockingbyrd; Perdogg
You would think it is not that hard to learn to put the empty tp roll in the garbage and the new roll in the holder and not ON THE COUNTER

LOL ... On the other hand ... it is the technology things that men tend to exceed at. For instance ... I followed all of the Star Trek series until the last one (Star Trek Voyager). They really blew it with that one in terms of believability. They would have you believe that when the Federation starship USS Voyager was developed, star travel had become so far advanced that even a woman could be captain.

Just ruined it in terms of believability.
83 posted on 08/24/2006 10:41:49 AM PDT by One_who_hopes_to_know
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To: driftdiver
best one I heard was "you'll grow this church over my dead body"

Sounds familiar. Where did I hear that before.

84 posted on 08/24/2006 10:42:54 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: mockingbyrd
"I'm not convinced of that. You would think it is not that hard to learn to put the empty tp role in the garbage and the new role in the holder and not ON THE COUNTER. You would think I could teach someone that. Five years later, still waiting."

That's funny, ma'am. I have the same problem with my wife. But I just go ahead and put the new roll (role) on after gently reminding her that it's out.

PS: Took a long while to teach her that the end of the roll goes over the top rather than down the back like most women do. ; ^)

85 posted on 08/24/2006 10:43:42 AM PDT by FixitGuy
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To: 1rudeboy

Let me rephrase -- it strains credulity to believe that your sole purpose for equating this person with the taliban is to note that they both don't allow women to teach men.

Because that particular subset of the one belief of the taliban is not actually offensive, but is a spirirtually sound doctrine, not entirely unexpected because the roots of most false religions are grounded in the truth, because that's the best way to deceive people, to start with a small kernel of truth but then distort it or use it to mislead them.

Much like you are doing here with your "innocent" factoid "equating" this man to the taliban.


86 posted on 08/24/2006 10:43:49 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: presidio9
I have found the Council on Biblical Manhood and Womanhood to be very good on these types of issues. Their website is here.

From their "Fifty Crucial Questions", here are questions (and answers) # 2 and #13. More info on this and other gender issues in the church are available on their site. Click on the About Us tab to find out more about this Evangelical organization.

2. What do you mean (in question 1) by "unbiblical female leadership in the church"?

We are persuaded that the Bible teaches that only men should be pastors and elders. That is, men should bear primary responsibility for Christlike leadership and teaching in the church. So it is unbiblical, we believe, and therefore detrimental, for women to assume this role. (See question 13.)

13. In question 2 and question 6, you said that the calling of the man is to bear "primary responsibility" for leadership in the church and the home. What do you mean by "primary"?

We mean that there are levels and kinds of leadership for which women may and often should take responsibility. There are kinds of teaching, administration, organization, ministry, influence, and initiative that wives should undertake at home and women should undertake at church. Male headship at home and eldership at church mean that men bear the responsibility for the overall pattern of life. Headship does not prescribe the details of who does precisely what activity. After the fall, God called Adam to account first (Genesis 3:9). This was not because the woman bore no responsibility for sin, but because the man bore primary responsibility for life in the garden-including sin.

87 posted on 08/24/2006 10:44:28 AM PDT by Pete
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To: presidio9
No, not putting either. Ever watch one of those made-for-tv golf events where Tiger and Annika take on Phil and some other dyke-in-spikes?

Oh, darned English! What I meant was that women are good at teaching putting, not putting.

My mother; my girls friends, now my wife:

Put that here; don't put that there!

Can't you you learn to put it where it goes (i.e. where she thinks it belongs, not where I want it.)

Always obssessed with putting stuff somewhere it can't be used, or found, or gotten at!

88 posted on 08/24/2006 10:44:33 AM PDT by ApplegateRanch (Islam: a Satanically Transmitted Disease, spread by unprotected intimate contact with the Koranus.)
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To: ArGee

Wow. The difference is that he is not armed. Thanks for reminding us.


89 posted on 08/24/2006 10:45:08 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Cicero

I also can't figure out why if this is their interpretation of Scripture, they just now figured it out after the woman's been there 50 years. Maybe this guy just moved in got a new revelation or something.


90 posted on 08/24/2006 10:45:50 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: Preachin'

Nope,
just a lil ole S. GA girl of Austrian decent raised in a super-duper fundy family (did I mention they were twisted and incestuous?) and married at one time to a priest (who had his own issues....but I stayed with him until 'death do us part')

Then I walked away and it was like I stopped crying for the first ime in decades.

Not everyone fits, not every can fit and be themselves.


91 posted on 08/24/2006 10:46:55 AM PDT by najida (The internet is for kids grown up-- Where else could you have 10,000 imaginary friends?)
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To: driftdiver
So, answer this one....

Do you take every word of the Bible (Old and/or New Testaments)literally?
92 posted on 08/24/2006 10:46:57 AM PDT by newcats (Natural Born Skeptic)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
Much like you are doing here with your "innocent" factoid "equating" this man to the taliban.

Ok, I'll back off . . . this thread has taught me that this person is a non-violent preacher with totalitarian impulses. Glad that was settled.

93 posted on 08/24/2006 10:47:24 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 1rudeboy
I am comparing this gentlemen, who claims biblical authority for his position, with the Taliban . . . who claim Koranic authority for the same.

You wear pants, just like Bill Clinton. You are no different than he his.

Good heavens.

Shalom.

94 posted on 08/24/2006 10:47:35 AM PDT by ArGee (The Ring must not be allowed to fall into Hillary's hands!)
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To: 1rudeboy

"That is precisely what I am doing, and not falsely. What's funny are the resulting "well yeah, but" logical fallacies."

So you admit to being a troll?


95 posted on 08/24/2006 10:47:37 AM PDT by driftdiver
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To: driftdiver

>>>The bible is quite clear on the roles of men and women. And unlike the islamo nazi's its not because one is inferior.>>>

Yeah right, suuuurrreeee it isn't.


96 posted on 08/24/2006 10:47:46 AM PDT by sandbar
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To: presidio9

Good for Pastor LaBouf. I always have a great deal of respect for men who take the scriptures seriously.


97 posted on 08/24/2006 10:48:20 AM PDT by Busywhiskers (Delenda est Hezbollah)
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To: driftdiver

Yeah, a troll that has posted 215 threads and 23,177 replies.


98 posted on 08/24/2006 10:48:59 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: najida

"Not everyone fits, not every can fit and be themselves."

Fits what?


99 posted on 08/24/2006 10:49:21 AM PDT by Preachin' (Enoch's testimony was that he pleased God: Why are we still here?)
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To: driftdiver
How many 2000 year old statues have Christians destroyed recently?

Around here, if you want to see evidence of attempting to eradicate religious relics, Christians are on the receiving end, not the giving end.

Shalom.

100 posted on 08/24/2006 10:49:25 AM PDT by ArGee (The Ring must not be allowed to fall into Hillary's hands!)
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