Posted on 08/15/2006 6:24:16 AM PDT by steve-b
For Cindy Nooney's 3-year-old twin boys, playing with the Thomas the Train set at their local bookstore in Southern California is a major thrill. Jack and Sam push Thomas, Arthur and friends down the track, they run around the table, jump up and down — and, of course, they squeeeaal.
Nooney expects as much in the children's section of the store. But on a recent afternoon, she was surprised by an employee who confronted her, calling her darling Jack a tyrant.
"He was a little loud but this is a children's section," says Nooney. "They run a noisy, cavernous bookstore but they don’t want kids to make any noise? It just seems ridiculous and leads me to believe that they don't want kids, they want silent kids."
The bookstore is not the only place that likes quiet, controlled children — and isn't afraid to say so. Across the nation, there are signs of a low-burning uprising against children supposedly behaving badly in public.
Eateries from California to Massachusetts have posted signs on doors and menus saying "We love children, especially when they are tucked in chairs and well behaved" or "Kids must use indoor voices." In North Carolina an online petition was started last year to establish child-free restaurants — the petition loosely compared dining with children to dining with cigarette smoke....
(Excerpt) Read more at msnbc.msn.com ...
That just disgusted me. So I moved his hand (making a mental not not to smack his hand) and said, "People EAT that."
A few minutes later I overheard the first kid telling his mom, "This lady smacked his hand and said, 'don't eat that.'" I decided instead of having an irate mother come after me, I would confront her instead. I told her what happened and that I had not smacked the boy's hand. She was a bit overwhelmed, since she was watching three or four other boys, as well as he son. She said she had told them many times to stay away from the bins, apologized for their behavior and made sure they stayed close by her from then on.
My favorite part was that everytime I was within earshot I heard the first kid say, "I can't believe you said that lady hit you."
This is a good observation...thankfully the Stink Eye works on both my kids.
But for the life of me, I don't know why! Heh!
I don't know. My folks, and my aunts and uncles, managed to keep the kids well-behaved in public. It's a pity that seems to be a lost art.
And yes, sometimes one of us would overstep the line--but we were rushed out before creating much of a ruckus, and forced to sit with one or the other parent in the car until the movie or dinner was over. At home, we got "what for." But we were NOT allowed to ruin the evening for the other diners or movie-goers.
My Mom called it "The Death Stare." :)
"Back in the day when "breeders" were the norm and homosexuals were outcast, parents were expected to have well behaved children."
And the perverts were expected not to flaunt their perversions, let alone show contempt for the non-pervs.
This is better than a PITBULL thread!
You make a very good point. My favorite child psychologist, Dr. James Dobson, makes the same point in his books. He remarks that a lot of parents think that the flawless behavior of their firstborn is due entirely to their wise and kind parenting, and congratulate themselves--until #2 or #3 comes along. Then they realize that a lot of behavior, good or bad, is the result of innate neurological wiring.
When my angelic firstborn girl was 2, my husband and I were so proud of ourselves. We'd see some kid having a tantrum and the daughter and I would exchange scandalized looks. "I'm so glad you're not like that," I'd tell her. As a preschooler she was just as shocked as I was by bad behavior. I was so naive and complacent, I have to laugh at myself now.
Then her brother came along. Believe me, from Day 1 he was wired up differently. When he was just four months old he would scream and scream with rage because he wanted to crawl and couldn't make himself do it yet, and we were shocked at the force of his anger. All his nerves were just strung more tightly. It took a long time to make him the pleasant well-behaved child he is now. It was no picnic. (But he is very good now, and I'm proud of him.)
I often hear a table full of "adults" cackling 'til my ears hurt.
Natural noise? I just spent a weekend at Scout camp with a child who screamed every syllable he spoke. He only has one volume and it is very loud. His mother (no father really) does nothing to limit his volume. When he wants to play with the kids, his mother says he is normal. But when he hurts someone or tears something up in his zeal, suddenly he is "special".
There is no excuse for a screaming kid at play. They can learn how to use inside voices and not to scream.
The other day at the library there was a woman walking around talking (in a normal voice) on her cell phone. She had 2 little bitty kids trailing her...just yelling and running around. The whole time she was talking on the cell phone, wandering around in the library. Ever now and then she'd give a loud "SHHHH!" to the kids...about every 2-3 minutes.
I turned to the guy sitting next to me and said "She sounds like the UN."
> He remarks that a lot of parents think that the
> flawless behavior of their firstborn is due entirely
> to their wise and kind parenting, and congratulate
> themselves--until #2 or #3 comes along. Then they
> realize that a lot of behavior, good or bad, is
> the result of innate neurological wiring.
Amen! We had the same experience.
Well, it helps to know what reasonable expectations for children are. Natural noise of children can be anything from the almost silence of reading a book (or watching the boob tube) to the full-throated pandemonium of an elementary school playgound 2/3 of the way into a long recess on a nice day. In a bookstore - toys or no - relatively low levels of noise are tolerable. Likewise, in restaurants children can and should be expected to use inside voices and not run around bothering others. Parents have a duty to others not to let their children disturb them: children can learn there is a time and a place for running and yelling, and a time for restraining themselves.
> They can learn how to use inside
> voices and not to scream.
Sigh. And how do they learn???
I have a sign in my office that reads: "Unattended children will be given an espresso and a free puppy" :o)
I love kids too. They taste just like chicken.
Agreed. There is typical kid squealing from healthy enjoyment and then there's out of control destructive behavior.
If the bookstore is going to be a place for quiet, take out the things that encourage three-year-old boys to get excited.
We solved the problem in our store. We purchased 50 electric spark dog collars that send a shock to the dogs neck when they bark. It works on children also and we've had only one electrocution accident. Great gadgets!!
> Except for one time (we removed her from the restaurant
> immediately..and left a considerable tip) she was well
> behaved and considerate. It *can* be done!
Sorry to rain on your parade, but you got lucky.
See Dobson's comments referenced above.
Sounds like my last trip to Norman Library! LOL!
"The looks I got in the parking lot I was waiting for a police car to pull up for child abuse. Especially after I had just spanked him once we got to the truck."
Spanking used to be common and expected. I would like to know how it suddenly became almost universally considered child abuse?
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