No scientific basis for 'born gay' theory. (DUH!)

The Salt Lake Tribune ^ | 07/08/2006 | David Clarke Pruden

[carlo3b]

No scientific basis for 'born gay' theoryBy David Clarke Pruden

Although the simple "born gay" theory has faded from the science scene, activists continue to misrepresent scientific findings. When you assert that individuals are born gay and cannot change, people naturally jump to the conclusion that same-sex marriage is the only rational choice for same-sex attracted individuals.

   However, the innate-immutable theory of homosexuality has no basis in science. The simplistic biological theory has been dismissed by all of the researchers whose studies have been cited to support the notion that homosexuality is so deeply compelled by biology that it cannot change.

   Let's examine the words of just one of those often incorrectly cited as providing evidence for a "gay gene." Simon LeVay notes, "It is important to stress what I didn't find. I did not prove that homosexuality was genetic, or find a cause for being gay. I didn't show that gay men were born that way, the most common mistake people make in interpreting my work."

   A new research study by a University of Illinois team, which has screened the entire human genome, reported that there is no one gay gene. Writing in the journal Human Genetics, lead researcher Dr. Brian Mustanski noted that environmental factors were also likely to be involved.

   Of the innate-immutable argument, Dr. Richard C. Friedman and Dr. Jennifer Downey, noted, "At clinical conferences one often hears . . . that homosexual orientation is fixed and unmodifiable. Neither assertion is true . . . The assertion that homosexuality is genetic is so reductionistic that it must be dismissed out of hand as a general principle of psychology."

   And the fluidity of homosexual attractions is well-established. Dr. Ellen Schecter of the Fielding Institute studied women who had self-identified as lesbian for more than 10 years and who after age 30 were now in intimate relationships with men lasting a year or longer.

   Even more prominent was the research by Robert Spitzer, the very psychiatrist who led the charge to remove homosexuality from the psychiatric manual. His study of 200 gay men and lesbian women who had undergone re-orientation therapy concluded: 44 percent of the women and 66 percent of the men had arrived at what he called "good heterosexual functioning" and 89 percent of the men and 95 percent of the women reported that they were bothered slightly or not at all by unwanted homosexual feelings.

   Mainstream gay-affirming publications like The Advocate are changing their terminology to embrace the concept of fluid sexual attractions. Matt Foreman, of the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force, summarizes what the gay movement has done.

   "We as a movement can take pride that we opened the door for young people to be much more fluid about sexuality, gender, gender roles, orientation and sexual behavior than any other generation in history. That's what the gay movement has contributed to society, and that's a tremendously good thing."

   But is it? If the innate-immutable theory of homosexuality has no basis in science then why do so many activists still insist that individuals are born gay and cannot change? LeVay provided the answer. He notes " . . . people who think that gays and lesbians are born that way are more likely to support gay rights."

   This is not to say that anyone chooses homosexual attractions nor do most of us choose many of the other challenges we face in life, but we do choose how we respond.
   ---
   David Clarke Pruden is the executive director of Evergreen International, a nonprofit Latter-Day Saint organization that provides resources and educational services for same-sex attracted members.

[DJ MacWoW]

Being born gay, or how ever you arrive at that state of desire and consorting with another consenting adult is something different from what you describe. There are victims in your statement. If it's "consenting adults", I don't see why society should condemn this.

Let me be blunt. If this was the case, no victims, why does Glaad want to teach "fisting" in Mass schools? It's called recruiting. So who is being recruited in grade schools? Why do all the gay orgs want homosexuality taught in grade schools?

[Jim Noble]

What difference does it make? (1 vote for "this is not an important question, whichever side of it is true")

[aberaussie]

Anybody got a clue?

Exodus International has a lot of information about helping people with unwanted same sex attractions.

http://www.exodus-international.org/

[John Lenin]

Anybody got a clue?

Lack of self control.

[Always Right]

Anybody got a clue?

Sexuality is mostly between the ears. I am not sure what happens to kids that leads them to be attracted to the same sex. Many come from some form of abuse, but there are some that do not. It is a behavior that can be changed by effective use of positive and negative reinforcement. Sex is one of the most powerful positive reinforcement tools available, so it is difficult to overcome a life long exposure to the lifestyle, but can be if people understand how to use it. People's sexuality can be altered by changing what they fantasize about. Many people develop all kinds of weird fetishes through fantancies. These fetishes are not things people are born with. Sex is a powerful tool.

[spunkets]

"When one identical twin is gay, less than half the time will the second identical twin be gay."

52% is not less than 1/2.

[jackieaxe]

If this was the case, no victims, why does Glaad want to teach "fisting" in Mass schools? It's called recruiting. So who is being recruited in grade schools? Why do all the gay orgs want homosexuality taught in grade schools?

I am not advocating "recruitment" or teaching fisting in schools. Also, I would not be for teaching girls how to perform oral sex on males in school either. I'm not denying there is a group out there who would like everybody to be gay and are conducting outreach programs, nor do I think these recruiting and fisting education programs should be happening, but there were gay people long before they were teaching fisting in schools. I believe for the most part people are born gay and it should not be a crime for acting on that impulse provided, of course, it's with a consenting adult. I also believe there is a time and place for acting out your sexuality, but obviously not in schools, nor highway rest areas.

[ROLF of the HILL COUNTRY]

From a couple of archived FR articles (2005)


Have you noticed, in the multitude of hostile reactions to the Vatican's Instruction, that what has provoked the most violent outrage is not the Church's teaching that homosexual tendencies are objectively disordered, but her conviction that they are capable of being overcome? Gays don't like the judgment that homo-erotic propensities are in need of healing, but it's the notion that healing is possible that brings out the rage, the flecks of spittle in the corners of the mouth. The secular dogma that insists homosexual orientation is innate is, for obvious reasons, a comforting one for many people, but to advance the opposite position -- and threaten to deprive them of the myth -- sparks a reaction comparable to taking a pork chop away from somebody else's Doberman.

In that connection, I was put in mind of the following passage from a 2002 CWR article by the Dutch clinical psychologist Gerard van den Aardweg, an expert in the treatment of homosexual disorders:

The traits which form the basis for biological explanations are extreme feminine identification (in males) combined with a 100 percent homosexual orientation in fantasies. But effeminacy is a learned identification. For example, Rekers and Lovaas describe a boy with such profound feminine "mannerisms, gestures, fantasies, flirtations, ... wig, nail polish, high screechy voice, slatternly, seductive eyes that it suggested irreversible neurological and biochemical determinants." After therapy, "he looked and acted like any other boy. People who viewed the videotaped recordings of him before and after treatment talk of him as 'two different boys.'" All of the boys treated for extreme femininity by Newman "became more masculine, more aggressive, discontinued feminine behaviors ... remaining masculine in puberty."

Finally, both therapy and self-therapy may completely eradicate a fully homosexual orientation and restore normal heterosexuality. That this does not happen suddenly, nor very frequently, is part due to the fact that therapy for homosexuality is still very rare, and that most homosexuals, in spite of a wish to change, at the same time cling to their sexual pleasure addiction and infantile personality, so that only relatively few really engage in a continued struggle with the old self. One of the distressing aspects of the misplaced mystification of the causes of this disorder and the emphasis on the "natural" or inborn factor is that it discourages both clients and therapists to do something about it; that way, the myth that the orientation cannot be changed becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Here's a man who's talking sense. The folks who insist there is no cure are the same folks who insist there's no disease to be cured from: a scientifically dubious contention, especially where the patient has zero wish to take the medicine and his physician zero wish to prescribe it. No wonder they go ballistic when the Church declines to take part in the fraud.

And note: it's not only gays who are making noise. There's a baritone line to the chorus of anti-Catholic editorial fury contributed by heteros who are themselves addicted to unseemly sexual indulgences and who panic at the demand that they give them up. Each of us, in his own way, finds onerous what Aardweg calls the "continued struggle with the old self." But those who have given up the fight and made peace with their sins hate the cure the way demons ("Have you come to torment us before the time?" Matt 8:29) hate the exorcism


HOMOSEXUALS PREY ON CHILDREN

33% of homosexuals ADMIT to minor/adult sex (7).
There is a notable homosexual group, consisting of thousands of members, known as the North American Man and Boy Love Association ( NAMBLA). This is a child molesting homosexual group whose cry is "SEX BEFORE 8 BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE." This group can be seen marching in most major homosexual parades across the United States.
Homosexuals commit more than 33% of all reported child molestations in the United States, which, assuming homosexuals make up 2% of the population, means that 1 in 20 homosexuals is a child molester, while 1 in 490 heterosexuals is a child molester (19).
73% of all homosexuals have had sex with boys under 19 years of age (9).
Many homosexuals admit that they are pedophiles: "The love between men and boys is at the foundation of homosexuality" (22).
Because homosexuals can't reproduce naturally, they resort to recruiting children. Homosexuals can be heard chanting "TEN PERCENT IS NOT ENOUGH, RECRUIT, RECRUIT, RECRUIT" in their homosexual parades. A group called the "Lesbian Avengers" prides itself on trying to recruit young girls. They print "WE RECRUIT" on their literature. Some other homosexuals aren't as overt about this, but rather try to infiltrate society and get into positions where they will have access to the malleable minds of young children (e.g., the clergy, teachers, Boy Scout leaders, etc.) (8). See the DC Lesbian Avengers web page, and DC Lesbian Avengers Press Release, where they threaten to recruit little boys and girls. Also, see AFA Action Alert.


THE HOMOSEXUAL AGENDA

The homosexual agenda includes desensitizing the public: "The first order of business is desensitization of the American public concerning gays and gay rights.....To desensitize the public is to help it view homosexuality with indifference instead of with keen emotion. Ideally, we would have straights register differences in sexual preferences the way they register different tastes for ice cream or sports games....At least in the beginning, we are seeking public desensitization and nothing more. We do not need and cannot expect a full 'appreciation' or 'understanding' of homosexuality from the average American. You can forget about trying to persuade the masses that homosexuality is a good thing. But if only you can get them to think that it is just another thing...then your battle for legal and social rights is virtually won" (25).
Part of the homosexual agenda is to get the public to affirm their filthy lifestyle, as one homosexual admitted in the October 1987 homosexual rally on Washington: "We are no longer seeking just a right to privacy and a protection from wrong. We also have a right -- as heterosexual Americans already have -- to see government and society affirm our lives" (27).
Part of the homosexual agenda is to turn people from Christianity: "The teaching that only male-female sexual activity within the bounds and constraints of marriage is the only acceptable form should be reason enough for any homosexual to denounce the Christian religion" (1).
Homosexuals knowingly lied (and still lie) about the 10% figure (i.e., homosexuals make up 10% of the population). As Tom Stoddard (formerly of the Lambda Legal Defense Fund) said, "We used that figure when most gay people were entirely hidden to try to create an impression of our numerousness" (17).

REFERENCES

(1) Advocate, 1985.
(2) Bayer, R. Homosexuality and American Psychiatry.
(3) Bell, A. and Weinberg, M. Homosexualities: a Study of Diversity Among Men and Women. New York: Simon & Schuster, 1978.
(4) Cameron et. al. ISIS National Random Sexuality Survey. Nebraska Med. Journal, 1985, 70, pp. 292-299.
(5) "Changes in Sexual Behavior and Incidence of Gonorrhea." Lancet, April 25, 1987.
(6) Corey, L. and Holmes, K. "Sexual Transmission of Hepatitis A in Homosexual Men." New England J. Med., 1980, pp. 435-38.
(7) Family Research Institute, Lincoln, NE.
(8) Fields, Dr. E. "Is Homosexual Activity Normal?" Marietta, GA.
(9) Jay and Young. The Gay Report. Summit Books, 1979, p. 275.
(10) Kaifetz, J. "Homosexual Rights Are Concern for Some," Post-Tribune, 18 December 1992.
(11) Kus, R. "Alcoholics Anonymous and Gay America." Medical Journal of Homosexuality, 1987, 14(2), p. 254.
(12) Lesbian News, January 1994.
(13) Lief, H. Sexual Survey Number 4: Current Thinking on Homosexuality, Medical Aspects of Human Sexuality, 1977, pp. 110-11.
(14) Manlight, G. et. al. "Chronic Immune Stimulation By Sperm Alloantigens." J. American Med. Assn., 1984, 251(2), pp. 237-438.
(15) Morton-Hunt Study for Playboy
(16) MsKusick, L. et. al. "AIDS and Sexual Behavior Reported By Gay Men in San Francisco." Am. J. Pub. Health, 1985, 75, pp. 493-96.
(17) Newsweek, February 1993.
(18) Newsweek, 4 October 1993.
(19) Psychological Reports, 1986, 58, pp. 327-37.
(20) Rueda, E. "The Homosexual Network." Old Greenwich, Conn., The Devin Adair Company, 1982, p. 53.
(21) San Francisco AIDS Foundation, "Can We Talk."
(22) San Francisco Sentinel, 27 March 1992.
(23) Science Magazine, 18 July 1993, p. 322.
(24) Statistical Abstract of the U.S., 1990.
(25) "The Overhauling of Straight America." Guide Magazine. November, 1987.
(26) United States Census Bureau
(27) United States Congressional Record, June 29, 1989.
(28) University of Chicago's Nation Research Corp.
(29) Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders Fourth Edition, American Psychiatric Association, 1994.

[little jeremiah]

I don't have time to search for more links, but check these out. Under the second link there are many categories that will give you a lot of knowledge. You can click on scripter's name and check out his comments, he's got a lot of links on this very topic. You owe it to yourself and the people you're trying to help to get really informed.

Root Causes, Homosexual Consequences
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1420619/posts

Homosexual Agenda: Categorical Index of Links (Revision 1.1)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1026551/posts

[little jeremiah]

One for the list? Nice simple overview.

[DJ MacWoW]

Where'd you learn that double speak?

I am not advocating "recruitment" or teaching fisting in schools.

Gays ARE recruiting in schools whether you advocate it or not.

I believe for the most part people are born gay and it should not be a crime for acting on that impulse provided, of course, it's with a consenting adult.

There is NO proof of that. And they've been searching. It's key to their "civil rights". And gays are only arrested for children. Where in the sam he!! do you get this statement?! it should not be a crime for acting on that impulse Who was arrested for it unless it was with a kid?!

I also believe there is a time and place for acting out your sexuality, but obviously not in schools, nor highway rest areas.

That won't make the activists happy. Their parades are a lesson in depravity. They want to force acceptance of their deviant behaviour on people via the government.

[silverleaf]

ditto.

Some people are born this way (got one in our family) and can be traced through the family line, one in each generation); some may be born genetically pre-disposed based on environmental factors (including emotional effects from their reaction to human interactions and experiences) ... while others may create their sexual identity and lifestyle by choice.

Mood/personality/emotional dispositions and disorders ... even personality quirks ... can be inherited. Don't know why so many people would refuse to accept that some cases of homosexuality could also.

but it really seems as if the culture is encouraging teenagers these days - almost daring them - to experiment to show how "open-minded" they are. And this immersion in "nothing wrong with that" (recruitment effort) is reaching down to younger and younger kids in the name of "diversity" and "tolerance" .. which suggests many homosexuals know deep inside it is a choice that some people (especially youngsters) can be led to.

[BackInBlack]

The miniscule genetic advantage of having brown eyes over blue is one thing; the advantage of having a reproductive drive vs. not having such a drive is entirely different. If there were a gay gene, how would it be passed on if its bearer doesn't want to have sex with members of the opposite sex?

I guess there are things like "linked traits" and so on that make it theoretically possible. But I find it very unlikely.

[WildHorseCrash]

. Don't know why so many people would refuse to accept that some cases of homosexuality could also.

Some, because their religious beliefs won't permit them to consider that, because of what it would mean if it were so.

[VeritatisSplendor]

The real problem gays have is not that they are attracted to their own sex, it's that they're not attracted to the opposite sex. Fortunately, the latter condition is easier to learn to change than the former. Most people are married, and have therefore agreed to forsake all others of EITHER sex; I suspect those gays who reject the idea of therapy aimed at learning to like the other sex are doing so because they don't like the idea of monogamy rather than because they think the other sex is just too yucky.

[Old_Mil]

Having been active in church for many years, I have found myself in situations where I have had to counsel homosexual men. What do you say when they sit there, with tears rolling down their cheeks and say: "I can remember being attracted to boys since I was 5 years old." Or, when they say: "I did not choose to be this way. Give me a pill to make me straight and I'll take it."

A psychiatrist looking into their past would be key. Many homosexuals have been abused by other homosexuals at an early age. As far as "being attracted to boys since I was 5 years old", no child of 5 feels sexual attraction, period...same sex, or otherwise.

[WildHorseCrash]

There clearly isn't a gay gene -- if there were, evolution would have weeded it out --

If there were a gay gene, how would it be passed on if its bearer doesn't want to have sex with members of the opposite sex?

Oh, the gene very well could be passed on and survive if it provided a greater reproductive advantage in the homosexual males' siblings than it cost in missed direct reproduction. For example, if there was a gene which increased the propensity toward homosexuality in men, but, in women, greatly increased fertility or made for healthier babies, the advantage the gene would have when expressed in women would be selected for by natural selection and preserved, notwithstanding the reproductively deleterious effect it has when expressed in men. Even if it man some men gay, it would be preserved if the same gene increased the fertility of those men's sisters. (N.B., I am not saying this is what is actually happening, just presenting a plausible reason why it is not, per se, impossible under natural selection.)

[jackieaxe]

I'm not doublespeaking. Let me ask you, if someone is a homosexual does that mean there are child rapists? does that mean they advocate teaching fisting in schools? does that mean they are out to recruit your children? Do you believe there are good homosexuals functioning and contributing within our society, obeying the laws and not sharking on children? Or is it by definition if you are a homosexual there is some kind of evil within you that the rest of society is obligated to route out?

I believe there are good gay people in our society. Not everyone wants to dress in a jock strap and march on phony long legs in the gay parades. I believe there are gay people who have children who hope their children are not gay because of how hard a road it is.

[jackieaxe]

One of the distressing aspects of the misplaced mystification of the causes of this disorder and the emphasis on the "natural" or inborn factor is that it discourages both clients and therapists to do something about it; that way, the myth that the orientation cannot be changed becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I don't accept the premise that there is something wrong with gay people. I don't believe evey homosexual person is evil. I believe there are good gay people who function and contribute within our society.