Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

How Coherent Is the Human Evolution Story?
Institute for Creation Research ^ | William Hoesch, M.S.

Posted on 06/01/2006 1:12:18 PM PDT by Sopater

"Australopithocines evolved into Homo erectus around 1.5 million years ago and Homo erectus, in turn, evolved into Homo sapiens around 400,000 years ago." This is presented to school children as no less certain than Washington's crossing of the Delaware. The statement makes dual claims: (1) there are fundamental anatomical differences between these three categories, and (2) each occurs in the right time frame. Let us examine these claims.

The anatomical differences between these three groups must be very substantial for the statement to have any meaning. Any anthropologist should be able to spot a Homo erectus on a crowded subway train, even clean-shaven and in a business suit, as different from modern humans. Not so. In fact, leading anthropologists Milford H. Wolpoff (University of Michigan), William S. Laughlin (U. of Connecticut), Gabriel Ward Lasker (Wayne State U.), Kenneth A. R. Kennedy (Cornell), Jerome Cybulski (National Museum of Man, Ottawa), and Donald Johanson (Institute of Human Origins) find the differences between these fossil categories to be so small that they have wondered in print if H. sapiens and H. erectus are one and the same. Fossils classified as H. erectus all share a set of "primitive" traits including a sloping forehead and large brow ridges, yet these all fall comfortably within the range of what are called normal humans today. For example, the very same traits are found in some modern people groups, including Eskimos! Eskimos might not like being referred to as "primitive" humans, yet evolutionists must do so if they are to be consistent. There are a lot of problems with the continued use of this taxon, yet it is essential to the evolution story.

The second truth claim embedded within the statement given to school kids has to do with these fossils occurring in the right time frame. For example, fossils with a H. erectus anatomy should be found exclusively in rocks that are older than those with its youthful descendents, "anatomically-modern" humans. This is decidedly not the case. Putting aside the validity of age-dates for a moment, the range for H. erectus is usually given at between about 1.5 million years and 400,000 years. Studiously avoided in most museum depictions is the fact that fossils with a H. erectus anatomy that are younger than 400,000 years number well over 100, including some as young as 6000 years. Even more amazing is this: fossil humans that are easily interpreted as "anatomically modern" (i.e., non-H. erectus) have been found in rocks that are much older than 1.5 million years. From a dozen different sites have come cranial fragments, including one good skull, teeth, several arm and leg bones, a fossil trackway, and stone structure that each screams out "modern human." The trackways at Laetoli, Tanzania, dated at 3.6 million years, and tibia (leg bone) and humerus (arm bone) from Kanapoi, Kenya, dated at 3.5 million, are especially significant for these pre-date even "Lucy," the celebrated upright-walking ape. These embarrassments have been revised, reinterpreted, and re-dated, but will not go away.

Keep these things in mind the next time you hear of a "missing link" being reported, for example, between H. erectus and modern man (as has been in the recent popular press). God made His creatures to reproduce "after their own kind," and it appears from the fossils that they have done just that.

* William A. Hoesch, M.S. geology, is an ICR Research Assistant in Geology.


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: creation; crevo; evolution; humanorigins; ignoranceisstrength; pavlovian; science; usualsuspects; youngearthcultists
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 101-120121-140141-160 ... 361-365 next last
To: David Allen
"Suffice it to say that I think the language, the spiritualism, the difference in the treatment of women, and the overall abilities of the modern humans are what set them apart demonstrably from Neanderthal, who remained virtually unchanged for tens of thousands of years."

You may, at least in part, be referring to our consciousness, which many scientists claim is only some 40,000 years old. The theory is that our modern self-aware state of consciousness is responsible for the development of burial practices, religions, and such. This is NOT my theory.

121 posted on 06/01/2006 4:59:33 PM PDT by Nova
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 104 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer

Ha! I hear ya.

You know what I tell people when they show how an investment is going to payout?

"Hey, math still works!!"

Oh, if life were diagrams and charts. I love em, but they're dog and pony.


122 posted on 06/01/2006 5:04:35 PM PDT by David Allen (the presumption of innocence - what a concept!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 110 | View Replies]

To: Ol' Dan Tucker
That is an interesting creation story. It is similar to many around the world in multiple religions. The Genesis story is notable for two things it includes that other creation stories lack such as the one you posted here. First, Genesis includes a time-line. It may be a disputed time-line, but it does stick its neck out with a sequence of events delineated by days. Second, it gives a geographic location of the first humans by noting four rivers located in Iraq. At least most historians agree that this is the birthplace of civilization.

If you value a scientific theory by its testability, then you should also value a creation story by the number of testable claims it makes more highly than one that makes no testable claims. You have pointed out the only thing in the story that sounds like a claim, but is entirely untestable since the "clarified butter" was part of their god.

123 posted on 06/01/2006 5:25:38 PM PDT by dan1123
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: dan1123
"First, Genesis includes a time-line. It may be a disputed time-line, but it does stick its neck out with a sequence of events delineated by days. Second, it gives a geographic location of the first humans by noting four rivers located in Iraq. At least most historians agree that this is the birthplace of civilization."

The Creation stories were first past from one generation to the next by way of telling a story in the oral tradition. The reason the rivers of Iraq are identified is directly the result of the Babylonian exile. During the exile, Jews were enculturated into Babylonian society so later when it came time to write the story of Creation the authors were influenced by the Babylonian story of creation. That is also the reason why there are two distinct Creation stories in Genesis.
124 posted on 06/01/2006 5:55:28 PM PDT by spatso
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 123 | View Replies]

To: spatso

Is there any proof of this? Most reports I have heard of this go back to now-defunct evolution of religion theories.

Actually, as an aside, how would you tell the difference between a true ancient creation story and a false one? Or are they all false by default?


125 posted on 06/01/2006 6:06:36 PM PDT by dan1123
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 124 | View Replies]

To: dan1123
"Actually, as an aside, how would you tell the difference between a true ancient creation story and a false one? Or are they all false by default?"

Generally we accept all creation stories as being authentic to the culture wherever it is found. So, for example, in traditional missiology, missionaries would go out to bring the Gospel message to the heathens. Contemporary missiology goes out into the new community to discover how the Gospel may already be alive within the tradition of that culture. So, the stories and traditions of a culture are integrated into the Christian message. Almost all the creation stories are beautiful understandings of a Creator nurturing his creation and always humanity is the very special part of the creation.
126 posted on 06/01/2006 6:25:22 PM PDT by spatso
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 125 | View Replies]

To: spatso
So, the stories and traditions of a culture are integrated into the Christian message. Almost all the creation stories are beautiful understandings of a Creator nurturing his creation and always humanity is the very special part of the creation.

???????


The Creation of Men and Women

When the world was finished, there were as yet no people, but the Bald Eagle was chief of the animals. He saw that the world was incomplete and decided to make some human beings. So he took some clay and modeled the figure of a man and laid him on the ground. At first he was very small but he grew rapidly until he reached normal size. But as yet he had no life; he was still asleep. Then the Bald Eagle stood and admired his work. "It is impossible," he said, "that he should be left alone; he must have a mate." So he pulled out a feather and laid it beside the sleeping man. Then he left them and went off a short distance, for he knew that a woman was being formed from the feather. But the man was still asleep and did not know what was happening. When the Bald Eagle decided that the woman was about completed, he returned, awoke the man by flapping his wings over him and flew away.

The man opened his eyes and stared at the woman. "What does this mean?" he asked. "I thought I was alone!" Then the Bald Eagle returned and said with a smile, "I see you have a mate! Have you had intercourse with her?" "No," replied he man, for he and the woman knew nothing about each other. Then the Bald Eagle called to Coyote who happened to be going by and said to him, "Do you see that woman? Try her first!" Coyote was quite willing and complied, but immediately afterwards lay down and died. The Bald Eagle went away and left Coyote dead, but presently returned and revived him. "How did it work?" said the Bald Eagle. "Pretty well, but it nearly kills a man!" replied Coyote. "Will you try it again?" said the Bald Eagle. Coyote agreed, and tried again, and this time survived. Then the Bald Eagle turned to the man and said, "She is all right now; you and she are to live together.

California Indian creation story


127 posted on 06/01/2006 6:32:17 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Stupidity is the only universal capital crime; the sentence is death--Heinlein)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 126 | View Replies]

To: Coyoteman

That is not a story I was familiar with, it appears to meet the test of a nurturing Creator, I am not sure about the meaning of the Coyote. I will think about it, is there a site?


128 posted on 06/01/2006 6:42:24 PM PDT by spatso
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 127 | View Replies]

To: spatso
That is not a story I was familiar with, it appears to meet the test of a nurturing Creator, I am not sure about the meaning of the Coyote. I will think about it, is there a site?

No cite. That is from the ancient anthropological literature.

Old Man Coyote is known from across much of the US. Often a creator figure, almost always the trickster, and always loved.

Crow Creation Story

In the beginning, Old Man Coyote stood alone with water surrounding him. Two ducks swam by, and Coyote asked if they had seen anyone else. The ducks said no but thought that something might exist under the water.

Coyote asked if they would travel underwater for him and report on what they saw. The ducks did as they were asked, finding nothing. He asked again, and the ducks returned with a root. On the third try, they found mud and Coyote was happy. He told the ducks that they could build with it, and he began to shape and mold the mud into an island. He blew on it, and it expanded. He blew again, and it grew into the earth. The ducks said they did not like the earth's emptiness, so Coyote created grass and trees out of the roots that came from the water.

Coyote and the ducks loved the earth, but it was flat. They wanted rivers, valleys, mountains, and lakes. So it was done. Soon Coyote and the ducks made a perfect earth, but they grew lonely, with only the three of them to sit and enjoy the land. So Coyote molded dirt to form men and then more mud to create many types of male ducks. Soon, they realized that without women, the males could not have children. So with more dirt he made women and female ducks to populate the earth.

One day Old Man Coyote traveled upon the land and was surprised to find another Coyote. When asked where he came from, the younger brother, named Shirape, said he was unsure of his origin and only knew he existed. As the two traveled along, Shirape wanted Old Man Coyote to make other animals, for only ducks, humans, and the two Coyotes had been created. The elder Coyote agreed, and as he spoke the new animals' names, they were created. He said "Elk" and an elk appeared. He said "Bear" and a bear appeared. This is how it was until all animals were created.


129 posted on 06/01/2006 6:47:16 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Stupidity is the only universal capital crime; the sentence is death--Heinlein)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 128 | View Replies]

To: Coyoteman

I found a site with California Amerindian legends. The Coyote as trickster makes Eve and the apple appear rather tame.


130 posted on 06/01/2006 6:55:53 PM PDT by spatso
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 129 | View Replies]

To: spatso
I found a site with California Amerindian legends. The Coyote as trickster makes Eve and the apple appear rather tame.

Great. Please post a link!


But what makes you think it was an apple? They are pretty tame. Doesn't it translate more as fruit?

I always imagined something more like:


131 posted on 06/01/2006 6:58:54 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Stupidity is the only universal capital crime; the sentence is death--Heinlein)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 130 | View Replies]

To: Coyoteman

http://www.indianlegend.com/california/california_index.htm

Stop, I'm watching a hockey game, a basketball game and I laughed so hard on your last post I missed the winning goal. I did want to ask if the trickster is your namesake or is that just a coincidence.


132 posted on 06/01/2006 7:07:06 PM PDT by spatso
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 131 | View Replies]

To: Sopater
How Coherent Is the Human Evolution Story?

In


133 posted on 06/01/2006 7:09:45 PM PDT by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: F.J. Mitchell
than other ages when the unlearned was beguiled by, witch doctors, soothsayers, wizards and similar charlatans.....Huh? Huh?

Other ages?

134 posted on 06/01/2006 7:27:23 PM PDT by Oztrich Boy (Here to Help)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 76 | View Replies]

To: spatso
I did want to ask if the trickster is your namesake or is that just a coincidence.

In Native American lore, the coyote is a central figure. The exact roll varies around the country, but the trickster is one of the main themes.

Coyote is also a creator figure in some areas, as well as sometimes the bringer of knowledge and culture in others.

Coincidence? Of course! Must be just an accident.


(You can learn a lot by listening to your Elders.)

135 posted on 06/01/2006 7:30:56 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Stupidity is the only universal capital crime; the sentence is death--Heinlein)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 132 | View Replies]

To: pikachu
I've been told all the bones before homo erectus ever found will fit easily into one phone booth.

Curious? Who "told" you this statement? I do not believe that it is accurate.
136 posted on 06/01/2006 7:31:48 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Elsiejay
Can you document an instance wherein the Institute for Cretion Research has misrepresented the views or words of evolutionists?

From ICR's website:

“It is notoriously difficult to determine whether a mutation is neutral, semideliterious, or moderately advantageous.”

This is to suggest that claims regarding mutations are pure speculation. Sherman omits the following sentence: “However, mutations in certain regions of the genome, such as intergenic segments, introns, or parts of the 3’ untranslated region have a high probability of being neutral.”

More from the same ICR article is available here.
137 posted on 06/01/2006 7:36:42 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: F.J. Mitchell
Evidence that many other equally qualified scientists are unable to see either.

To whom do you refer?
138 posted on 06/01/2006 7:42:04 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 78 | View Replies]

To: Echo Talon
hmmmm... I wonder how you interpret the Bible.

Even if I were to accept that the Bible rules out the possibility of evolution, you have presented a false dichotomy.
139 posted on 06/01/2006 7:42:59 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Echo Talon
And no evidence exists that we evolved from Apes either

This statement is false, and you have been told otherwise. I do not understand why you continue to repeat a claim that you know to be false.

at least the miracles of Jesus have been documented.

Please reference the relevant document to which you refer.
140 posted on 06/01/2006 7:43:50 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 101-120121-140141-160 ... 361-365 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson