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Scientists Predict How To Detect A Fourth Dimension Of Space
Science Daily ^ | May 25, 2006 | Unattributed (Duke University)

Posted on 05/25/2006 1:35:30 PM PDT by Ben Mugged

Scientists at Duke and Rutgers universities have developed a mathematical framework they say will enable astronomers to test a new five-dimensional theory of gravity that competes with Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.

Charles R. Keeton of Rutgers and Arlie O. Petters of Duke base their work on a recent theory called the type II Randall-Sundrum braneworld gravity model. The theory holds that the visible universe is a membrane (hence "braneworld") embedded within a larger universe, much like a strand of filmy seaweed floating in the ocean. The "braneworld universe" has five dimensions -- four spatial dimensions plus time -- compared with the four dimensions -- three spatial, plus time -- laid out in the General Theory of Relativity.

The framework Keeton and Petters developed predicts certain cosmological effects that, if observed, should help scientists validate the braneworld theory. The observations, they said, should be possible with satellites scheduled to launch in the next few years.

If the braneworld theory proves to be true, "this would upset the applecart," Petters said. "It would confirm that there is a fourth dimension to space, which would create a philosophical shift in our understanding of the natural world."

~snip~ "When we estimated how far braneworld black holes might be from Earth, we were surprised to find that the nearest ones would lie well inside Pluto's orbit," Keeton said.

Petters added, "If braneworld black holes form even 1 percent of the dark matter in our part of the galaxy -- a cautious assumption -- there should be several thousand braneworld black holes in our solar system."

(Excerpt) Read more at sciencedaily.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: artbell; branetheory; cosmology; hyperspace; multidimensions; physics; supersymmetry
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To: PatrickHenry
Shouldn't post after reading just the excerpt. The full article makes clear what the size of the black holes would be. Still, it's surprising.
81 posted on 05/25/2006 5:20:22 PM PDT by VadeRetro (Faster than a speeding building; able to leap tall bullets at a single bound!)
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To: Huck

No matter how they try, no one can explain 4 dimensions in a way that I can understand""

Me either...but I find all this stuff fascinating..


82 posted on 05/25/2006 5:23:40 PM PDT by ridesthemiles
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To: beaelysium

83 posted on 05/25/2006 5:33:32 PM PDT by antonia (Build the Wall Now!)
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To: Huck

http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Hypercube.html

http://keycurriculumpress.com/sketchpad/javasketchpad/gallery/pages/hypercube.php

http://www.astronomycafe.net/cosm/dimens.html

http://www-geo.phys.ualberta.ca/saig/conf/Bin_seg04.pdf


84 posted on 05/25/2006 5:39:15 PM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: antonia

Nice hypercube. :-)


85 posted on 05/25/2006 5:39:40 PM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: Ben Mugged

bump


86 posted on 05/25/2006 5:50:44 PM PDT by tophat9000 (If it was illegal French Canadians would La Raza back them? Racist back there race over country)
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To: Paradox
I'm still struggling to get through her "Warped Passages".

I guess I can't get my brains around her branes; or perhaps, it should be the other way around. Gheeeez, my head hurts.
87 posted on 05/25/2006 5:55:52 PM PDT by LiberationIT
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To: Huck
No matter how they try, no one can explain 4 dimensions in a way that I can understand. The loaf of bread metaphor doesn't cut it (har har).

Have you ever read Flatland?

88 posted on 05/25/2006 6:16:56 PM PDT by Maceman (Fake but accurate, and now double-sourced)
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To: ridesthemiles
For the algebraically inclined: the standard theory of space-time is 3 space + 1 time dimension. The distance between two points: (x1,y1,z1,t1),(x2,y2,z2,t2) is given (for flat spaces) by (x1-x2)2+(y1-y2)2+(z1-z2)2-c2(z1-z2)2, where "c" is the speed of light in the system (and the space is flat.)

WALOGIMBAT there are 3 positive and 1 negative terms; the signs could be reversed without changing the physics. This "metric" or "distance formula" produces a hyperbolic geometry. Were there a fourth spatial dimension (call it w), then the distance between (w1,x1,y1,z1,t1) and (w2,x2,y2,z2,t2) would be given by (w1-w2)2+(x1-x2)2+(y1-y2)2+(z1-z2)2-c2(z1-z2)2. This describes a different geometrical structure. According to physics (I think), there should be measurable differences between the two models. (I don't know what these would be.)

I have ignored interactions between the various dimensional coordinates. For those interested, see things like quadratic forms or metric spaces, etc.

One need not actually see the dimensions with one's eyes, but only find a method of measuring the effects of such dimensions's existence. This is already done with the quantum variables called "spin" for example.

89 posted on 05/25/2006 7:48:08 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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.


90 posted on 05/25/2006 8:37:30 PM PDT by Ready2go (Isa 5:20 Destruction is certain for those who say that evil is good and good is evil;)
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To: Ben Mugged

Did they put a pencil through a piece of wood?


91 posted on 05/25/2006 8:38:22 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (I LIKE you! When I am Ruler of Earth, yours will be a quick and painless death </Stewie>)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
Math can deal with n dimensions as well as zero and null dimensions. It can also have arrays with null and n axes.

It is fun but conjuring the numbers doesn't get the job done.

92 posted on 05/25/2006 8:41:01 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (I LIKE you! When I am Ruler of Earth, yours will be a quick and painless death </Stewie>)
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To: freedumb2003

But it lets us describe the underlying physics. If not, we'll just invent some more mathematics.


93 posted on 05/25/2006 8:43:51 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
But it lets us describe the underlying physics. If not, we'll just invent some more mathematics.

Alas, I have to go with your description. Remember the Far Side scientist who proved he didn't exist? ;)

94 posted on 05/25/2006 8:51:38 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (I LIKE you! When I am Ruler of Earth, yours will be a quick and painless death </Stewie>)
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To: freedumb2003

The point of the algebra is that one can describe what cannot be visualized directy.


95 posted on 05/25/2006 8:54:50 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
I actually agree with you completely.

Heinlein pointed out that mathematics was the only way to truly describe things and those that could not understand that language really couldn't participate in the conversation.

I was just joshing you a little. Your formulae were actually pretty impressive.
96 posted on 05/25/2006 9:08:34 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (I LIKE you! When I am Ruler of Earth, yours will be a quick and painless death </Stewie>)
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To: nrfcmedia
But I thought theories were indisputable, even stronger than facts? If so, how can Einstein's theory be challenged?

At least that's what those who buy evolution hook line and sinker claim...

Could you please document this?

What I see on the crevo threads is the claim that the theory of evolution could be falsified, but that ID, not being a scientific theory, cannot, even in principle, be falsified. Of course, evolution never has been falsified.

It's quite possible that this new theory could predict phenomena that differ from those predicted by general relativity, and a suitable test could disprove one or both of them.

Think of the motion of Mercury and how it disproved Newton.

97 posted on 05/25/2006 9:11:31 PM PDT by Virginia-American
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To: avacado

You cannot divorce time from the expressions of space in our existence/in reality since any expression of energy involves a temporal component ... and as far as I know there isn't anything expressed in reality that doesn't involve energy in one way or another.


98 posted on 05/25/2006 9:20:09 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: USFRIENDINVICTORIA

The roll it up!


99 posted on 05/25/2006 9:21:37 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: taxed2death

Entropy has an arrow.


100 posted on 05/25/2006 9:28:02 PM PDT by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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