Immigration is not the pox neo-Know Nothings make it out to be

The Jewish World Review ^ | 4/31/2006 | Tony Snow

[Luis Gonzalez]

I don't bother because my opinion is already set in place on this issue; as I stated to Jim Robinson, we don't need more laws, we need more law enforcement.

Politicians sell us the notion that passing a law is "doing something" when in fact, it's just a way to make us think that they're doing something.

They are not enforcing the existing laws, why on Earth would we think that they plan to enforce new ones.

You want a law I will get behind?

Write a law that makes it a crime for the government not to enforce immigration laws.

That law will never be passed.

[Dane]

I don't know that on a divided issue such as this, the general population could withstand the assault by the media, and the flood of images of families being taken out of their homes and forced to leave the country being blasted across the TV screens nightly

Yep and this image would be played, a photo from the Warsaw ghetto.

But that does not matter to immigration zealots, since they do not learn from history, IMO.

The real culprits in this mess are the liberals who since WW II have done what they do best, divide people on race and ethnicity, for their own political and personal aggrandizement, while destroying the early American 20th century notion of working hard and becoming part of the America, and there are those on the right who on cue "react" to the leftist tactics, exactly the way the leftists want them to.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"SS taxes can only be used to pay SS benefits or administer the SS program."

Please...

"Focusing on an accumulating balance in the Social Security trust funds can also be misleading. The only economically significant way that the government has a surplus is if there is a unified budget surplus--when total receipts are greater than total outlays. Although separate taxes are collected for Social Security, the money left over after benefits are paid is used to fund other government programs or to pay down the debt held by the public. Moreover, in the future, those separate tax receipts will become insufficient to maintain the program once the post-World War II baby-boom generation begins drawing federal entitlement benefits. Social Security and other entitlement programs will then be dependent on the federal government to cover their costs--at the same time that the government must pay for its many other functions." -- Source

The problem is that generally speaking, we're NOT smart enough to constantly question what the government does with our money.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"The real culprits in this mess are the liberals who since WW II have done what they do best, divide people on race and ethnicity, for their own political and personal aggrandizement."

I used to be white before I got here.

[DoughtyOne]

I can live with your opinion of me. Thanks.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"You should really do a quick google and read about all the bills..."

I have to say that you're correct on that, and thank you for forcing me to read the bill.

From what I've read thus far, there are some good things in that bill, in spite of the source.

[Luis Gonzalez]

Variations on this picture, over, and over, and over, every day.

[wtc911]

To be fair, I believe a large portion of illegal immigration is made up of single, childless males.

===================================================

I am a licensed NYS RE Appraiser, although I no longer practice. Two years ago I spent a couple of months helping out a former associate who couldn't handle the load. Most of the work was in single family attached and semi-attached homes in Queens (3-5 bedrooms - one bath - one kitchen - basements divided into cubbies was the norm). Nearly all of these were jam-packed with multiple Mexican and other Central American families. It was very common for there to be over eight kids under the age of seven and three to five adult women in each house. Never any men. They were out mowing lawns.

I would have a hard time believing that the scores of houses I saw like this were the exceptions rather than the norm.

[Mojave]

You support illegal immigrants being here, and as part of that you don't mind the murders, rapes or child molestations that go along with it.

I had a friend who lived in California until an illegal alien "undocumented worker" raped and murdered his sister. After finishing the assault, the "immigrant" stabbed her and left her bound in a closet, where she bled to death after several hours.

But who are we to object? That's just necessary collateral damage in the fight to pull down our borders and bring us into the light of the glorious new world order.

[Dane]

I used to be white before I got here

LOL!.

Just an anecdotal story. While working in the Bell services dept. of a major tourist hotel in Orlando, there were two guys of Puerto Rican ancestry, one a second generation guy who looked Italian and another who had grown up in Puerto Rico.

Well anyway the the "Italian Puerto Rican" always put the other guy down, because he was a bit slow and didn't understand the computer. I took pity on the guy who had come from Puerto Rico and showed him the basic uses of the computer system, he was greatful for me helping him out and soon knew the sysytem down pat.

The "Italian Puerto Rican guy" never lifted a finger to help the other guy learn the system, but if one of the other bellmen made a disparaging remark about Puerto Ricans or other hispanics, he was the first to feign outrage saying such things "you do know I'm Puerto Rican". he probably votes democrat.

[hinckley buzzard]

Excessively sloppy article. Snow constantly confuses his own obtuse anti-anti-immigration projections with the very real and legitimate concern about our borders and our laws having been compromised by the flood of illegals.

The assumptions about "immigrants" and "hispanics" which he seeks to poo-poo are all validated for illegals. They do cause excessive crime, they do clog up the hospitals, they don't pay much withholding(60-some% pay taxes? I'm thrilled.), and they do lowball the wage market. None of this takes into account for the otherwise avoidable social costs of divisiveness and conflict which the illegal problem engenders.

There are enough anti-hispanic people and anti-immigration people to go around, to be sure, but it is an "illegal alien" issue at the base, and should be acknowledged as such. Those who would corrupt the debate by pretending it is primarilly anti-Mexicanism or anti-immigration are liars and frauds, and those who don't know any better, are no better.

[WOSG]

I would not call the unions free marketeers and they are NOT weighing in why?"

Unions no longer represent worker's interests, but are now run by leftist ideologues. Ask "what do the leftists want?" to figure out the new union position.

leftists want 'clients' for the socialist welfare state, and voters to vote socialist, and no better clients than Mexico's exports of poverty-stricken residents looking for work and handouts. Hence, they line up for amnesty, even if it hurts American workers to have a flood of low-wage competition.

[WOSG]

Ivins, Ivins, Ivins.

Gets a few good shots/quips in, but is still wrong mostly wrong as she always is.
Wrong on the fence. (Having a fence works better than having nothing). Right on employer sanctions (illegal immigration is driven by hiring of illegal immigrant). Wrong on the way to improve things.

Mostly wrong on the social services angle. She fails to admit that Govt services and handouts are going to illegal immigrants, and Govt agencies know it and fail to check ...

"Racists seem obsessed by the idea that illegal workers -- the hardest-working, poorest people in America -- are somehow getting away with something, sneaking goodies that should be for Americans. You can always avoid this problem by having no social services. This is the refreshing Texas model, and it works a treat."

Here is a statistic for ya: One quarter of the children in a our major metro school district are from illegal immigrant families. There is a reason why thousands of schoolkids in LA marched. This is a consequence of a bad USSC decision and bad public policy.

Go ahead and ask the question of your school district, or LA school district.

The fact is that Texas is spending millions, nay, billions, on services for illegals. They are overloading the local hospital districts and schools, and make a sizeable part of the prison population.

Amnesty and legalization wont make any of that better, perhaps make it worse, because they will then have 'rights' to more services.

[evilC]

>>>

Have you seen the threads discussing the possibility of an increase in H1B visa issues?

When you bring higher-skilled immigrants into the nation, they will compete with our own higher skilled workers for jobs we DO want.
<<<

We are already competing with them. Many high skill jobs (e.g. radiology) are easier to outsource then low skill jobs. Whether they work here as immigrants or there as "offshore resources", we will be competing. I see certain advantages to having them here.

It is likely that offshore competition has lowered, or at least tempered growth, in skilled wages. Increased competition from overseas is disruptive and upsetting to those displaced, but smart, skilled people are better able to cope than less smart less skilled people.

H1Bs and other similar visas are like unfettered low-skill immigration, they are a form of protection for favored industries. That is, they alter conditions that would exist in a free-market (assuming we have a border and control who may live within it). I think the best policy is to decide how many people may enter (perhaps as a percentage of current population) and then issue visas in a manner like the AA1 "diversity visa" lottery. Do not be fooled by the term lottery, it involves a criminal background check, a health check, and some guarantee of ability to self-support (usually a job offer). This would allow for the invigorating effect of immigration, not favor any industry, not favor any existing ethnic group (although the AA1 is tilted towards countries with a low immigration rate), and not try to guess needed skills (e.g. If we had a points system they probably would just now have added "web developer" to needed skills - years after the "dot-bomb").

If we are going to tilt policy in favor of a particular skill level then that policy should be towards the higher ends. It is better for a country to raise its average skill level rather than lower it. I fear that current Mexico centered policy is lowering our average skill level with the potential for negative effects in the future. It also is building, indeed has built, a powerful ethnic bloc that distorts policy.

[jpsb]

OMG I gree with you, bumb.

Personally I am and open borders fan, kind of, I see no reason my someone from Mexico or Canada, should not have easy access to the usa for a vacation, shopping, visit friends/family or whatever. Visit then go home. But tens of million coming here and not going home plus drugs dealers/criminals/WOT make it impossible to have an open borders policy. So I oppose it.

[Just mythoughts]

What you say about the Unions is correct. However, why have they stayed so silent about these millions of 'workers' who apparently are not under their control?

Their lack of public face is most interesting, considering they are very much for legalizing the illegal workers.

Where are they making up the short fall of income?

Look what the liberals did to attempt to disgrace the Republicans into supporting the legalization of illegals, they wrapped it into a religious dress of Republicans making Jesus illegal.

Divide and conquer and there has to be a pay off for the Unions.

[evilC]

You are probably right.

I think there can be a lot of lying with statistics (on both sides). This might be one of them (i.e. under counting a negative effect). Of course the adults could be legal or the children could be legal ("anchor babies"), either way they would not be counted as illegal aliens using public schools. Of course the taxpayer feels the effects regardless of legality.

[Binghamton_native]

That's it! You've solved the problem. There is no such thing as an illegal. We all need to write our senators and congressman and tell them there is no need to continue debating an immigration reform bill. There are no illegals. /sarc. off

[Binghamton_native]

Oops. Tammy8, my post 598 was meant to be a response to post 544.

[Amerigomag]

Yes, there are several models, including the US's on experimentation which show that guest worker programs can work and don't burden local, social infrastructures.

The two enemies of this program would be:

1) Liberals, who, at the first opportunity, would demand services and benefits for the guests, a) way out of proportion to their economic contribution to our society, b) way out of proportion their basic, US, earning power and c) magnitudes above the capabilities of their native society, leading to unrest in their native country.

2) The price of the commodity which the guests helped to produce would rise slightly as the producers were forced to assume more of the common burden for their relatively cheap and abundant labor supply. The price of a head of lettuce, a hamburger, a hotel room, a blouse, a tract home and lawn care might rise slightly.

After 1) our immigration regulations are enforced, 2) illegal employment of unregulated immigrants has immediate, unattractive consequences and 3) our southern neighbors are convinced to participate in government reforms, a guest worker program is a win-win for the hemisphere.