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The Forget Hell! crowd
Townhall.com ^ | February 27, 2006 | W. Thomas Smith, Jr.

Posted on 02/27/2006 6:14:47 AM PST by SuzyQ2

I love history. I’m proud of my Southern heritage. But for me to be angry to the point of protesting a moment in Southern history that happened nearly a century-and-a-half ago would be just, well, nonsensical. And would in some ways tarnish that heritage.

(Excerpt) Read more at townhall.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Government; News/Current Events; US: Georgia; US: South Carolina; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: army; bigots; black; chivalry; civil; confederate; creeps; damnyankee; dixie; doctorow; hammond; honor; keywordsfromadumbass; kkk; klan; lincoln; losers; moore; neoconfederate; neonazi; nostalgiaforslavery; pcfreepersonparade; racists; rebs; sherman; skinhead; slavery; south; union; us; war; white
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To: reagandemo
I don't sit kindly with Sherman apologists any more than I would those supporting radical Islam...

YMMV


BUMP

121 posted on 03/01/2006 8:43:09 AM PST by capitalist229 (Keep Democrats out of our pockets and Republicans out of our bedrooms.)
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To: derllak

If northern liberals and their southern collaborator allies were not trying to force this new one generation old warped view of Southern heritage on us down here we would be perfectly fine to let sleeping dogs lie. We long ago came home to the Union but that doesn't not mean we will EVER reject our kin....NEVER....would you? I hope not.

But the PC forces at work want to extinguish all Southern regional pride and demonize my ancestry.

What would you do under the same pressures?

We have no choice....especially when these same folks are the enemy on every other cultural issue in our time. Scratch a South basher and you find very little real conservativism and a whole lot of identity based ideology.

The fact that some FReepers join in this PC revision chorus is not very encouraging.

We are defending out heritage...good or bad.

I know of no Southerner wishing to push our views on Southern heritage on others. It's our's anyhow. Non-Southerners are welcome to move on to getting cranky over Indian affairs or mistreating immigrants or some other cause to latch on to.


122 posted on 03/01/2006 8:47:01 AM PST by wardaddy ("hillbilly car wash owner outta control")
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To: capitalist229

BTTT....good for you!


123 posted on 03/01/2006 8:47:39 AM PST by wardaddy ("hillbilly car wash owner outta control")
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To: F.J. Mitchell

As CDB says: "We might have done a little fightin' among ourselves, but you outsiders best leave us alone"


124 posted on 03/01/2006 8:50:44 AM PST by stainlessbanner (I miss Mayberry)
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To: wardaddy
inasmuch as sherman & his pack of scoundrels/thieves/war criminals

a. looted & burned churches, hospitals & synagogues,

b. made a routine practice of torturing & killing NON-white & Jewish CSA prisoners,

c. looted & burned public buildings/farms/crops in the field/private residences &

d. committed numerous other criminal acts against The Law of War & COMMON decency,

i cannot understand why ANYBODY defends him.

sherman deserved to hang for his "crimes against humanity" & "crimes against peace".

free dixie,sw

125 posted on 03/01/2006 8:52:12 AM PST by stand watie ( Resistance to tyrants is OBEDIENCE to God. -----T.Jefferson)
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To: capitalist229

"I don't sit kindly with Sherman apologists any more than I would those supporting radical Islam..."

Read my posts and you will have no beef with me. I was only stating what Sherman did after the war and his thoughts of what he did during the war.


126 posted on 03/01/2006 8:52:44 AM PST by reagandemo (The battle is near are you ready for the sacrifice?)
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To: wardaddy
Scratch a South basher and you find very little real conservativism and a whole lot of identity based ideology.

It is interesting the same "might makes right" crowd shows up on other FR threads. They claim the high moral crowd and look down their noses at the Southerner conservatives they seem to drag around like a weight on their ankle.

The "rent-a-mob" group is nothing more than thinly disguised wolves in sheeps clothing: money hungry, globalists who care for little else.

127 posted on 03/01/2006 8:55:32 AM PST by stainlessbanner (I miss Mayberry)
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To: wardaddy
WELL SAID!

one of the MAIN reasons for secession was that the DYs just wouldn't "tend their own patch" & leave dixie & her people ALONE.

they still WON'T!

free dixie,sw

128 posted on 03/01/2006 8:57:25 AM PST by stand watie ( Resistance to tyrants is OBEDIENCE to God. -----T.Jefferson)
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To: wardaddy
You don't seem to know the meaning of total war.

Sherman was forced to march through Georgia/South Carolina and destroy everything of military value to the South. There were no murders, no deliberate killings of civilians, most houses were not burned. Nothing he did was against the laws of war in place at the time.

Hood and the Confederate army would not surrender or fight. Sherman spent most of Oct 1864 chasing Hood around Georgia. He brought the war home to the civilians to force them to make peace. Once Sherman marched through, all the "die in the last ditch" types changed their tune and began speaking for peace, if only to prevent Sherman from coming back.

I have no sympathy for the South. They could have recognized reality in 1864 and made a compromise peace that would have gotten them everything except slavery and a separate nation. As Lincoln said, the south could have peace on any terms they wanted as long as "Union" was on first word on the list.

Instead, they prolonged the war, yapped about "fighting to the last man" and kept on fighting for their "honor". Davis wanted to keep on fighting as late as April 1865.

Davis was in fact of typical Southerner, talking about how he would "die in the last ditch, etc.". Of course, at the end of the war he hightailed it to Mexico and was caught wearing a women's dress.
129 posted on 03/01/2006 9:10:50 AM PST by rcocean (Copyright is theft and loved by Hollywood socialists)
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To: rcocean; All
PITY that you "know NOT & know NOT, that you know NOT".

there were HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of rapes,robberies,lootings,arsons, tortures, assaults & COLD-BLOODED murders committed against UNarmed civilians in the southland.

if you were Asian,Black,Female,Indian,Jewish,Latino, Roman Catholic, a recent immigrant and/or POOR, you were an especial target of the "filth that flowed down from the north". (FEW of the "planter aristocracy" were victimized.)

fwiw, at least 92 of my family were raped/robbed/tortured/murdered by the yankee cavalry, ONLY because they were UNarmed, poor & NON-white.

free dixie,sw

130 posted on 03/01/2006 9:26:46 AM PST by stand watie ( Resistance to tyrants is OBEDIENCE to God. -----T.Jefferson)
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To: stand watie

You must be reading different history books.

If you want war crimes, see Andersonville.

BTW, shooting and hanging lone Union soldiers out foraging was considered a war crime as was planting "torpedoes" (now called landmines).


131 posted on 03/01/2006 10:20:45 AM PST by rcocean (Copyright is theft and loved by Hollywood socialists)
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To: lentulusgracchus
My dad told me that Sherman's route was still visible on aerial photographs taken in the 1930's, the damage from the sown salt was that severe.

My understanding is that the whole "sown salt" thing is another myth that doesn't stand up to the slightest scrutiny. How much salt would it take to destroy a swath of farmland that extensive? How many wagons to haul it? How many men to spread it?

132 posted on 03/01/2006 10:50:30 AM PST by Heyworth
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To: rcocean
Of course, at the end of the war he hightailed it to Mexico and was caught wearing a women's dress.

Utterly false. Davis was captured near Irwinville, GA, and he was not wearing a dress. His wife Varina threw a shawl over his shoulders (Lincoln habitually wore a shawl as well, as did many of the period). The garment alleged to be a dress was an overcoat. Here's what Capt. James Capt. James H. Parker, a member of Union General Wilson's staff stated in the Argus of Portland, Maine. [The text was on display at the Museum of the Confederacy in Richmond as are Davis' garments when he was captured].

I was with the party that captured Jefferson Davis; saw the whole transaction from its beginning; I now say -- and hope you will publish it - - that Jefferson Davis did not have on at the time he was taken any such garment as is worn by women. He did have over his shoulders a water proof article of clothing -- something like a "Havelock." It was not in the least concealed. He wore a hat, and did not carry a pail of water on his head, nor carry pail, bucket or kettle in any way. To the best of my recollection, he carried nothing whatever in his hands. His wife did not tell any person that her husband might hurt some body if he got exasperated. She behaved like a lady, and he as a gentleman, though manifestly he was chagrined at being taken into custody. Our soldiers behaved like gentlemen, as they were, and our officers like honorable, brave men; and the foolish stories that went the newspaper rounds of the day, telling how wolfishly he deported himself, were all false. I know what I am writing about. I saw Jefferson Davis many times while he was staying in Portland several years ago; and I think I was the first one who recognized him at the time of his arrest.

When it was known that he was certainly taken, some newspaper correspondent -- I knew his name at the time -- fabricated the story about his disguise in an old woman's dress. I heard the whole matter talked over as a good joke; and the officers who knew better, never took the trouble to deny it. Perhaps they thought the Confederate President deserved all the contempt that could be put upon him. I think so, too; only I would never perpetrate a falsehood that by any means would become history. And, further, I would never slander a woman who has shown so much devotion as Mrs. Davis has to her husband, no matter how wicked he is or may have been.

I defy any person to find a single officer or soldier who was present at the capture of Jefferson Davis who will say, upon honor, that he was disguised in woman's clothes, or that his wife acted in any way unladylike or undignified on that occasion. I go for trying him for his crimes, and, if he is found guilty, punishing him. But I would not lie about him, when the truth will certainly make it bad enough.
[Also cited by Burke Davis, The Long Surrender, New York: Random House, 1985, p. 145].

The War Department instructed the union military to appropriate the clothing in question - obviously no such garment was found. It was simply the furtive imagination of Union soldiers and the media in a feeble attempt to discredit the President of the Confederate States of America. Thankfully, the Union officer noted above stepped forward to repudiate the ludicrous and inane claims.
133 posted on 03/01/2006 12:22:29 PM PST by 4CJ (Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito, qua tua te fortuna sinet.)
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To: 4CJ
Well, Jeff Davis wasn't wearing a dress.

What about "dying in the last ditch"? Why was he fleeing to Mexico? Why did he still want to continue fight in April 1865?

He supported drafting old men and young kids to fight & die in the trenches out Petersburg, yet he tries run off with his wife. He didn't even resist capture. What a blowhard and a coward.

Here's his address to the People of the Confederate States of America:

Danville, Va., April 4, 1865.

"The General in Chief of our Army has found it necessary to make such movements of the troops as to uncover the capital and thus involve the withdrawal of the Government from the city of Richmond."

"Relieved from the necessity of guarding cities and particular points, important but not vital to our defense, with an army free to move from point to point and strike in detail the detachments and garrisons of the enemy, operating on the interior of our own country, where supplies are more accessible, and where the foe will be far removed from his own base and cut off from all succor in case of reverse, nothing is now needed to render our triumph certain but the exhibition of our own unquenchable resolve. Let us but will it, and we are free; and who, in the light of the past, dare doubt your purpose in the future?"

Of course, Jeff was about to run off to Mexico at this point.

"... I announce to you, fellow-countrymen, that it is my purpose to maintain your cause with my whole heart and soul; that I will never consent to abandon to the enemy one foot of the soil of any one of the States of the Confederacy; that Virginia, noble State, whose ancient renown has been eclipsed by her still more glorious recent history, whose bosom has been bared to receive the main shock of this war,...and by the blessing of Providence, shall be held and defended, and no peace ever be made with the infamous invaders of her homes by the sacrifice of any of her rights or territory."

"If by stress of numbers we should ever be compelled to a temporary withdrawal from her limits, or those of any other border State, again and again will we return, until the baffled and exhausted enemy shall abandon in despair his endless and impossible task of making slaves of a people resolved to be free."

What BS, Davis knew the war was over at that time

Let us not, then, despond, my countrymen; but, relying on the never-failing mercies and protecting care of our God, let us meet the foe with fresh defiance, with unconquered and unconquerable hearts.

Jeff'n Davis.

Pretty bold talk, from a man about runaway with his wife and servants

134 posted on 03/01/2006 12:57:10 PM PST by rcocean (Copyright is theft and loved by Hollywood socialists)
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To: rcocean
well, i'm certainly NOT reading the LIES propounded by the REVISIONISTS & DAMNyankee apologists wrote to fool the IGNORANT. i read the actual records.

according to the US ARMY's own official records, there were NO INTENTIONAL war crimes committed at Camp Sumpter,Andersonville, GA (NOT EVEN ONE!).

there was much privation, disease & death, but NO war crimes committed by CSA guard forces.

SORRY, but you & the other DY liars/lunatics/fools LOSE again!

otoh, the north DID have CONCENTRATION CAMPS, where MANY THOUSANDS of CSA POWs & innocent civilians were INTENTIONALLY starved,denied medical attention,denied food & shelter,raped,assaulted,abused, tortured & frequently murdered (just because it was less expensive to kill them than to feed the POWs.)

at just ONE DAMNyanklee DEATH CAMP (Point Lookout,MD), over 15,000 CSA POWs & other "detainees" "mysteriously disappeared" in about 18 months.

free dixie,sw

135 posted on 03/01/2006 2:19:56 PM PST by stand watie ( Resistance to tyrants is OBEDIENCE to God. -----T.Jefferson)
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To: rcocean
fwiw, i also read the GRAVE MARKERS at the cemetery where the 92 members of my family, who had been slaughtered like cattle by DY forces,are buried.

free dixie,sw

136 posted on 03/01/2006 2:22:35 PM PST by stand watie ( Resistance to tyrants is OBEDIENCE to God. -----T.Jefferson)
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To: stand watie

I don't suppose you'd care to tell us just were this alleged cemetery is, would you?


137 posted on 03/01/2006 2:43:46 PM PST by Heyworth
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To: stainlessbanner

LOL! Amen to that!


138 posted on 03/01/2006 2:52:12 PM PST by F.J. Mitchell (Let's make government a liberal free zone.)
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To: rcocean; stand watie; stainlessbanner
"Political correctness is the natural continuum from the party line. What we are seeing once again is a self-appointed group of vigilantes imposing their views on others. It is a heritage of communism, but they don't seem to see this."

Familiar?

139 posted on 03/01/2006 4:08:46 PM PST by wardaddy ("hillbilly car wash owner outta control")
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To: F.J. Mitchell; stainlessbanner; stand watie; rustbucket; Ohioan

Get a load of the keywords these PC bootlickers put up....that about tells it all doesn't?

If you don't bow at their race altar then you are all of that.

man.....and this is conservatism...God help us.

Redress for racial injustice will end us one day. It overwhelms up all truth and serious discussion like a fart in a crowded locker room.


140 posted on 03/01/2006 4:15:06 PM PST by wardaddy ("hillbilly car wash owner outta control")
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