Posted on 02/04/2006 2:44:05 AM PST by WKB
ENID, Okla.
A Southern Baptist pastor being removed from a national board governing worldwide evangelism says he doesn't speak in tongues himself but is defending missionaries who do to keep the denomination "broad in our cooperation."
The Rev. Wade Burleson, the senior pastor of Emmanuel Baptist Church in Enid, said that the board of trustees of the Southern Baptist Convention's International Mission Board wants him to be removed because of his criticism of a policy change enacted by the IMB in November 2005. It stated that any candidate speaking in tongues, even privately, "has eliminated himself or herself from being a representative of the IMB of the SBC."
In a statement, the International Mission Board says it wants him removed not because of the tongues issue, but because of "broken trust and resistance to accountability." Burleson's removal depends on a June vote of the entire Southern Baptist Convention, but the controversy is being watched beyond Baptist circles, largely because of the dispute over tongues, an issue that has rankled many religious groups.
Tongues is described in the Bible as a spiritual language used by early Christians, enabled by the Holy Spirit. The issue of whether it is still relevant, or appropriate, for modern times has divided many denominations.
Burleson says he is not most concerned about tongues, but a willingness to remove ministers who disagree with what he and others consider "nonessential doctrines." Since the changes in the mission board's policy were made official, Burleson has been writing open letters and explanations of his position on his blog, kerussocharis.blogspot.com.
He has repeatedly referred to those who wanted the policy changes as "crusading conservatives."
"Crusading conservatives seek to convince you that their interpretation of the Bible on nonessential doctrines must be accepted by all conservatives, and if someone chooses to not conform to their specific interpretation, then he/she is removed from service," Burleson said.
Burleson says he considers himself a "cooperating conservative," which he defines as a person who is in agreement on the major doctrines of the Bible but gives freedom in areas of interpretation regarding nonessential doctrines. The SBC has long considered the Reformation's rallying cries of faith alone, grace alone, Scripture alone and Christ alone as summing up the major doctrines of Scripture.
The use of the spiritual gift known as tongues or glossolalia would fall into the nonessential category. Southern Baptists have a policy that prohibits their ministers from using tongues in a public setting.
"I do not want people to lose sight of the real issue," Burleson said. "It is not about the new policies. It is the direction we seem to be moving as a convention that shuts out dissent and desires conformity in the interpretation of minor doctrines."
Burleson said he does not practice a "private prayer language," the phrase some use for speaking in tongues, nor does anyone he would consider a close friend or family member. The issue, he said, is one of principle and "is not personal."
Leon McBeth is a retired distinguished professor of church history at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in Fort Worth, Texas. He said that the SBC has a long-standing antipathy toward what some call the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit.
"In my day, our concern over the tongues issue was a biblical one," McBeth said. "In the Bible, tongues is always associated with conflict. And tongues isn't exclusive to Christianity. The practice goes at least as far back as the Oracle at Delphi.
"Sometime in the 1970s, as a way of ameliorating opposition to tongues, some Southern Baptists began to talk about private prayer language. They believed it was less offensive than calling it tongues."
Lyle Story, a professor of biblical languages and New Testament at Regent University School of Divinity in Virginia Beach, Va., said that the Southern Baptist resistance to tongues is tied to their belief that all the miraculous gifts (healing, prophecy, tongues, miracles) ceased with the death of the original 12 apostles and the completion of the Bible.
Burleson said he is resistant to the policy change because so many Christian men and women throughout history would have violated it.
"Some of our greatest missionaries of all time had a private prayer language, including Miss Bertha Smith of China, who led thousands of people to Christ and died an ambassador of the Southern Baptist Convention at the age of 100," he said.
Jerry Rankin, the president of the International Mission Board, has acknowledged that he has practiced a private prayer language for 30 years.
"We have become so intolerant that everyone must now march in lockstep with us or we kick them out," McBeth said. "I believe this (the policy change) was part of a power play to force Rankin into retirement."
The IMB made the policy change non-retroactive, so Rankin's position as president will not be threatened.
The trustees of the IMB deny that Burleson's criticism of the policy changes had a bearing on their decision to work to remove him. In an official statement released Jan. 11, board chairman Tom Hatley said: "In taking this action, trustees addressed issues involving broken trust and resistance to accountability, not Burleson's opposition to policies recently enacted by the board."
Burleson will remain on the board until the Southern Baptist Convention meets in Greensboro in June. The convention must vote to remove him, as the IMB has no power to do so. Burleson said he remains a strong supporter of the SBC and IMB.
"The International Mission Board of the Southern Baptist Convention is doing the greatest work in our 161-year-old history," Burleson said. "I and my church support the IMB. We will continue to support the IMB."
They couldn't go AOG without switching their views vis a vis Calvinism
Lord please don't bring that bunch to this thread.
Amen! :>)
Cat got your tongue?
And some people wonder why we have all those epistls....
Anyone who would like to get the real scoop on the subject needs to read 1 corinthians ... the whole thing would be good , but if your short on time start at chapter 12 and go all the way through chapter 14
I recommend the KJV.
I really like the last few sentences.
and I quote ..
If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spirtual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.
Wherefore, brethen, covet to prophsey, and forbid not to speak with tongues.
Let all things be done decently and in order.
... But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant .
..If that doesnt sound like a freeper ...
You must have the gift of tongue-in-cheek.
You must have the gift of tongue-in-cheek
tongue-in-cheek
or
foot in mouth?
"Southern Baptist are wrong in kicking people out of Church for something Biblical, while Pentacostals are wrong for making it much more than it is."
You Southern Pentacostals are always mucking it up. :O
I suppose that speaking in a tongue that is understood is for the benefit of the person who understands, and that the tongue that nobody understands is for the person who speaks. In both cases it is a sign for the non-believer.
Is your church charasmatic yet?
My wife and I visited a pentacostal church for a while,
and within a few weeks we were asked if we would be willing to be "coached" in learning to speak in tongues.
The nonsensical babbling is NOT speaking in tongues.
If someone starts speaking in a language he doesn't know,
as was the case after Pentacost, that is truly speaking in tongues.
I saw a show on the Angel network where an older lady was
babbling phrases and getting her partner to repeat them over and over to "get the "feel" of "speaking in tongues".
Disgraceful.
whole without disturbing everyones feelings
Binkies are located at the back everyon....
I like the first part of Chapter 15
What's REALLY important
1 Cor. 15:3 For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance£: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
1 Cor. 15:4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,
But beyond that.... what got him voted off was the blog site that I posted a link to. It's one thing to disagree.... and it's another to state what he states on his blog site. (that's my opinion)
By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.
I used to think about this scripture when I fell in love with little Susie as a nine-year-old.
They're not kicking anybody out of the church
Moog was quoting "always right"
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1571598/posts?page=10#10
Speaking in tounges always sounds like spiritual Tourette's Syndrome.
You're telling me. When I lived in Korea, I lived upstairs in a house with some friends. The landlady and her friends would get together for prayer services downstairs. They would sound so weird and freaky (sorry, my vocab's limited today) when they did their tongues stuff that we would stay upstairs for a while sometimes until they were done.
Oh no. A good mix of believers, but it is on the conservative side. It has been that way for the 6 years my family has been going there.
Chip
they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all
Go kick some asp!!
From Luke 24, it is clear that women were the first ones instructed to preach the good news to the people:
10 Now it was Mary Mag'dalene and Jo-an'na and Mary the mother of James and the other women with them who told this to the apostles; 11 but these words seemed to them an idle tale, and they did not believe them. 12 13 14 and talking with each other about all these things that had happened. 15 While they were talking and discussing together, Jesus himself drew near and went with them. 16 But their eyes were kept from recognizing him. 17 And he said to them, "What is this conversation which you are holding with each other as you walk?" And they stood still, looking sad. 18 Then one of them, named Cle'opas, answered him, "Are you the only visitor to Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened there in these days?" 19 And he said to them, "What things?" And they said to him, "Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, who was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people, 20 and how our chief priests and rulers delivered him up to be condemned to death, and crucified him. 21 But we had hoped that he was the one to redeem Israel. Yes, and besides all this, it is now the third day since this happened. 22 Moreover, some women of our company amazed us. They were at the tomb early in the morning 23 and did not find his body; and they came back saying that they had even seen a vision of angels, who said that he was alive. 24 Some of those who were with us went to the tomb, and found it just as the women had said; but him they did not see." 25 And he said to them, "O foolish men, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
Done either lately.
Or did you choose the buffet?
Depends on the staff. :)
No, was I commanded to somewhere? I missed that part.
Heck, give me your food. I'll take the buffet any time.
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