Pastor admits molesting 2 girls

Monterey Herald ^ | 1/20/06 | GEORGE B. SANCHEZ

[MamaB]

A youth minister I know, had a window put in his office door and had a silent alarm to his secretary. He did not want to take any chances that something like that would happen.

[MineralMan]

"Didn't mohammad marry a seven year old? (To his credit he waited until she was nine to consummate the marriage)..."

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That's the story, from what I hear. If so, then what he did was wrong, by my ethical rules. Was it OK in his day and place? I do not know.

[MamaB]

Our minister has been at our church since 1978. It is going to be hard on all of us when he retires. He had a pacemaker inserted and he was back at church that Sat. performing a wedding ceremony. We all love him. BTW, I am a Southern Baptist.

[MineralMan]

I looked around a bit on marriage ages in medieval Europe, and found this. Apparently it was OK back then for girls to marry at age 12. I find that strange, since I live in modern times, but apparently it was OK with the Catholic church of the day. Much has changed in terms of ages of marriage, but molestation is wrong, whatever the age.:

"The following were causes for dissolution of an already established marriage: one of the parties was not of legal age (12 for girls, 14 for boys), if the woman was incapable of sexual relations, if one was in religious orders or bound by a vow (as above), if one married a servant one had formerly had sex with; if one of the parties was not a Christian, or if there was a mistake

[gimme1ibertee]

Agreed. I would take it one step further: I believe that anyone of any age that has a student-teacher relationship should not interact romantically.Teacher to teacher,fine.Student to student,whatever.But between mentor and protege,no.It's something that just should not be encouraged.Boundaries should be drawn and adhered to.As you say,ethical people do not give in to such things.

[The_Republican]

Wow - girls.

That it itself is shocking.

[Tamar1973]

I wonder, sometimes, if this hasn't always been going on, but wasn't really reported.

I am sure it still goes on and much of it is still not reported to the authorities.

[GraniteStateConservative]

What a bizarre thing to say. If he had molested boys, would you have replied "Well at least he just molested the boys, not as sick as dismembering & eating them"?

I bet he was the spin doctor for the Dems in 1994.

[Protagoras]

I am not going to get into a discussion on this with you in this thread.

Of course not. Light is the best disinfectant.

I will say just this, and will not respond to any more of your attacks on me:

Nice try, you get to make a statement, but no further discussion will be allowed because your words always come back to haunt you.

Further, I have made no attack. I respond to your troll and your subtle attack on Christianity only by reposting your own posts from the past which clearly state what you have said and believe. Nothing more. Of course, such revelations that show the intent and agenda of your participation here must feel like an attack.

I will take it very unkindly.

And you can't really believe that I care whether or not you take the truth "kindly". I take it that is a another "not so subtle" threat to whine to the mods.

Posting this article under your screen name, ABSENT your usual troll (godless atheist) and then adding it after you got your audience is an amazingly transparent tactic.

So I'll take your threat seriously, given the somewhat uneven moderating that occurs here on occasion, and cease to talk to you. I've said my piece and your words are there for all to see.

[Celtic Conservative]

MM, I understand that the Catholic church has a problem. I'm not in any way trying to be an apologist. Defrock 'em , lock em up, case closed. But it seems a little disproportionate in the way the MSM goes after the Catholic chrurch. It is not just the church which has a problem, it's our society in general. but let's face it , long before the current crisis there have been lurid tales of lecherous priests, and nuns going back centuries. but no religion is exempt from sin and depravity. Pedophilia seems to have been a huge problem in the Church of England in the late victorian to early edwardian period. I guess it plays into the hands of those who reflexively hate the Catholic church, and who are just looking for a reason (any reason will do) to tear it down. as a religion and as a society, Catholics have to face up to its problems and confront them. but there is enough stupidity in the human race to go around, and Catholics have no corner on sin and depravity.

/rant> CC

[MineralMan]

"Posting this article under your screen name, ABSENT your usual troll (godless atheist) and then adding it after you got your audience is an amazingly transparent tactic."

Just a note. When you post a new article on Free Republic, your tagline does not appear in the original posting. I did not remove my tagline, then re-insert it. Try posting an article and you'll see that I'm telling the truth about this.

As for the rest, I let my words speak for me, and expect those who dislike my atheism to quote me correctly and not imply that I have said anything I have not said.

[MineralMan]

"But it seems a little disproportionate in the way the MSM goes after the Catholic chrurch. It is not just the church which has a problem, it's our society in general."

I agree with you that the problem of child sexual abuse is a nationwide problem, and in all walks of life.

As for the massive amount of press that the Catholic priests got, I think that was primarily due to so many stories coming out all at once, each triggering other stories.

Many of the stories involved long-past abuses, now come to light. I've never believed that the Catholic church was worse than any other organization, religious or otherwises, where adults come into close contact with youngsters.

[WVNan]

It's impossible to know whether sexual abuse is more of a problem than in times past. I do know that churches are trying to deal with the problem proactively for the first time. My own Conference recently held mandatory "Sexual Abuse" all-day workshops. They meant it too. We were told there would be no excuses allowed. There has recently been two pastors relieved of duty in the WV Conference for sexual misconduct.

It's true that social mores change over time. Within my lifetime it was perfectly permissable for a 40 year old man to marry a 13 or 14 year old. By nature, females are ready for procreation at age 12-13-14. Our society has imposed an artificial barrier against such early activity. It's come about because of wealth increase and because of the uncommon freedom we enjoy. We train our girls for other things besides child-bearing. The freedoms that Western Civilization offered to women has changed many things in culture. There are still many cultures in third world countries where girls still marry at puberty. It's natural, but we have created laws that say it's a no-no.

That being said, it's especially onerous for men (or women) to take advantage of position to prey on children. And doubly so when one is a pastor/priest. But we Christians know that satan works overtime within the Church. He's already got those outside the Church.

[joesbucks]

I think the press also has another reason for this to be on their radar. When the priest stories started breaking, there was extreme denial by Catholics and claims of media bias. As more and more of the stories came to light, the claim of bias and the ability to deny became more difficult to defend. In addition, the Catholic church is the largest demonination in the US as well as the world. It's an easy target vs the little 20 memeber church in the back woods that had a similar issue.

Add to that the way the church is organized and the movement rather than defrocking of so many priests and the story not only got legs, it got wheels. Also rememember, wasn't it in the mid 80's when it was the evangelical daycares that were having the physical and sexual abuse claims brought forward? So it hasn't alwasy been the Catholics.

[MineralMan]

"Within my lifetime it was perfectly permissable for a 40 year old man to marry a 13 or 14 year old."

You're correct, of course. It is only in very recent years that the age of consent in a number of states was raised above 14. It's pretty uniform now at 16 or 17, which makes a lot of sense.

Still, however, for someone in a position of authority or trust to take sexual advantage of any young person is a terrible wrong. The medical profession simply prohibits it at any age, as do most universities, finally.

This story was about a pastor. There are stories every day of people abusing their position to take sexual advantage of other people. It's not limited just to ministers and priests, by any means.

[MineralMan]

" Also rememember, wasn't it in the mid 80's when it was the evangelical daycares that were having the physical and sexual abuse claims brought forward?"

I believe so, except that some of those claims ended up being false. We must always be on our guard not to infer guilt based only on charges. Many cases have been proven to be bogus. Sadly, many have been proven to be true, as well.

Again, this is not a matter just of religious leaders. Every group that has access to youngsters has molesters in its midst, I'm afraid.

My difficulty is in how we can trust anyone with our children these days. It doesn't seem to matter where they go, they are at some risk of this. It's a real dilemma.

[WVNan]

It's not limited just to ministers and priests, by any means.

That goes without saying for sure. I can't even recall the number of "bosses" I had to contend with over the years. Of course I wasn't a child, but the "position of authority" issue was still in play.

As a child, I did encounter problems with older men. I had a great uncle who would fondle me whenever I got within arms reach of him. I learned right off to keep a respectable distance when no one else was around. When I was 15 I made the mistake of accepting a ride home from play practice at the high school with a deacon in my church. He tried to rape me, but I was a fiesty one and fought like tiger and screamed like a banshee. He backed off and I never told a soul. I'm not sure that our girls today are as aware of the predatory nature of men. My mother and grandmother talked to me about the need to be alert for such things. I don't wish to offend any men (I love em), but my sainted grandmother told me that men have "urges" they "can't" control, and so it would be up to me to be in control. I still think it was good advice.

[joesbucks]

You related the story of the deacon in the church.

I can't remember the exact scripture, but isn't there one that says when the Holy Spirit comes into a persons life they are sealed against sin? I've got to wonder if many of these folks have not really gone through the process of salvation, but believe they have.

[MineralMan]

" I'm not sure that our girls today are as aware of the predatory nature of men. "

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Well, sensible parents teach their children to be wary. There's lots of info out there for parent to learn how to do this effectively.

I'm sure your experiences are not all that unusual. I imagine a lot of women could tell stories of attempted stuff that was never told to anyone. And I'm not talking about awkward pimply-faced boys groping them in the car on a date.

There was one old fart in the church I attended in childhood and in my teen years. He was a deacon, and was about 75 years old. All the junior high and high school girls knew to keep some distance from him. He had was was called, back then, "roman hands," and was forever trying to "accidentally" grope the girls.

As far as I know, nobody ever complained about him to anyone. The girls just kept their distance.

[WVNan]

You're right. Smart girls learn pretty early on to keep distance between self and roman hands. LOL

The pimply-faced boys were another matter altogether. (I ain't talking)