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What sort of Frenchmen are they?
Haaretz ^ | 11/19/5 | Dror Mishani and Aurelia Smotriez

Posted on 11/19/2005 12:54:43 PM PST by SmithL

PARIS - The first thing the French-Jewish philosopher Alain Finkielkraut said to us when we met one evening at Paris' elegant Le Rostand cafe, where the interior is decorated with Oriental-style pictures and the terrace faces the Luxembourg Gardens, was "I heard that even Haaretz published an article identifying with the riots."

This remark, uttered with some vehemence, pretty much sums up the feelings of Finkielkraut - one of the most prominent philosophers in France in the past 30 years - ever since the violent riots began on October 27 in the impoverished neighborhoods that surround Paris and spread with surprising speed to similar suburbs throughout the country. He has been following the events through the media, keeping up with all the news reports and commentary, and has been appalled at every article that shows understanding for or identification with "the rebels" (and in the French press, there are plenty). He has a lot to say, but it appears that France isn't ready to listen - that his France has already surrendered to a blinding, "false discourse" that conceals the stark truth of its situation. The things he is saying to us in the course of our conversation, he repeatedly emphasizes, are not things he can say in France anymore. It's impossible, perhaps even dangerous, to say these things in France now.

Indeed, in the lively intellectual debate that has been taking place on the pages of the French newspapers ever since the rioting started, a debate in which France's most illustrious minds are taking part, Finkielkraut's is a deviant, even very deviant, voice. Primarily because it is not emanating from the throat of a member of Jean Marie Le Pen's National Front, but from that of a philosopher formerly considered to be one of the most eminent spokesmen of

(Excerpt) Read more at haaretz.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: frenchriots; frogwithaspine
Alain Finkielkraut. "When an Arab torches a school, it's rebellion. When a white guy does it, it's fascism. I'm 'color blind.' Evil is evil, no matter what color it is. And this evil, for the Jew that I am, is completely intolerable." (Hannah/Opale)
1 posted on 11/19/2005 12:54:43 PM PST by SmithL
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To: Alice au Wonderland; Tolik; neverdem

interesting


2 posted on 11/19/2005 12:57:57 PM PST by King Prout (many accuse me of being overly literal... this would not be a problem if many were not under-precise)
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To: King Prout

"It's impossible, perhaps even dangerous, to say these things in France now."




Sound familiar,guys? Freedom of certain kinds of speech is dead,even in the oh-so-perfect France.

Vive le jihad?


3 posted on 11/19/2005 1:27:37 PM PST by Mears (The Killer Queen)
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To: SmithL

People never believe they can live in a fascist state without knowing about it and rejecting it openly.

They think they will know when they live in a fascist state because life will be somehow lose its color and everything will become black and white, or dulkl shades of gray.

They think fascism means that large men in black uniforms will be goosestepping up and down streets asking for "papers please".

They think we will start using words like "comrade" or "fuhrer", and that all laughter will stop.

When fascism comes it will use the common language; it will be spoken by familiar trusted faces; people will still laugh and play. The sun will still shine brightly and no haze will descend.

"Political correctness" is fascism.

Confiscation of property for financial gain is fascism.

"Hate Crimes" laws are fascist laws that punish thought, not just action.

100% control of the government by two private associations is fascism.

Fascism is never 100%. It is always incremental. It is insidious. It saves the most cherished freedoms while eliminating every other less popular freedom...until the last.


4 posted on 11/19/2005 1:37:54 PM PST by Mark Felton ("Your faith should not be in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.")
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To: SmithL

Never fear, France. You've got Johnny Depp on your side, and if there's ever a good man in a tight corner, its Johnny Depp.


5 posted on 11/19/2005 1:38:55 PM PST by Vince Ferrer
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To: dennisw
The problem is that most of these youths are blacks or Arabs, with a Muslim identity
6 posted on 11/19/2005 1:46:26 PM PST by Eurotwit (WI)
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To: Mark Felton
An excellent post.

"Fascism is never 100%. It is always incremental. It is insidious. It saves the most cherished freedoms while eliminating every other less popular freedom...until the last."
7 posted on 11/19/2005 1:46:54 PM PST by MaryFromMichigan
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To: King Prout; SmithL
We're living in a post-national society in which for everyone the state is just utilitarian, a big insurance company.

He looks like Bill Maher, but he sounds like he has much more common sense.

8 posted on 11/19/2005 1:56:08 PM PST by neverdem (May you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows that you're dead.)
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To: SmithL
"No, I've lost. As far as anything relating to the struggle over school is concerned, I've lost. It's interesting, because when I speak the way I'm speaking now, a lot of people agree with me. Very many. But there's something in France - a kind of denial whose origin lies in the bobo, in the sociologists and social workers - and no one dares say anything else. This struggle is lost. I've been left behind."

May this "something" he speaks about not take over in America.

9 posted on 11/19/2005 1:57:48 PM PST by TotusTuus
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To: SmithL

This is a very ingteresting article, and there is much in it that is instructive for the U.S.


10 posted on 11/19/2005 2:35:43 PM PST by Bahbah (Free Scooter; Tony Schaffer for the US Senate)
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To: SmithL

Thank you for posting this. b.


11 posted on 11/19/2005 2:50:02 PM PST by Barset
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To: Mark Felton
"Hate Crimes" laws are fascist laws that punish thought, not just action.

And prohibition of smoking is fascism.


12 posted on 11/19/2005 3:43:22 PM PST by A. Pole (CEO of CISCO: "What we're trying to do is outline an entire strategy of becoming a Chinese company.")
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To: SmithL

ever since the violent riots began on October 27


My Birthday is oct 27th, I cant think of a better present than to watch the scumbag French leaders try to explain why the City of Lights is being lit up by Car fires.


13 posted on 11/19/2005 4:58:26 PM PST by LtKerst (Lt Kerst)
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To: SmithL
This remark, uttered with some vehemence, pretty much sums up the feelings of Finkielkraut - one of the most prominent philosophers in France in the past 30 years - ever since the violent riots began on October 27 in the impoverished neighborhoods that surround Paris and spread with surprising speed to similar suburbs throughout the country.

Now that's one MO FO sentence. Are these guys journalists?

14 posted on 11/19/2005 5:24:42 PM PST by Rudder
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To: Eurotwit


French rioters were mostly black?

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/europe/article_1061670.php/Walker`s_World_France`s_black_anger?page=1


15 posted on 11/19/2005 9:18:23 PM PST by dennisw (You shouldn't let other people get your kicks for you - Bob Dylan)
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To: dennisw

I don't think so. My clear impression was that the majority was north african arabs, but that a healhty chunck also consisted of blacks....

I took a look at a few of the earlier wire stories from the riots and they basically said the same as this guy:

Mostly muslim black and arab africans.....


16 posted on 11/19/2005 9:23:59 PM PST by Eurotwit (WI)
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To: SmithL
"....since on...[French] radio, on television and in the newspapers, or in most of them, they're holding a prettifying mirror up to the rioters. They're `interesting' people, they're nurturing their suffering and they understand their despair. In addition, there's the great perversion of the spectacle: They're burning cars in order to see it on television. It makes them feel `important' - that they live in an `important neighborhood.' The pursuit of this spectacle ought to be analyzed. It's creating totally perverted effects. And the perversion of the spectacle is accompanied by totally perverted analyses."

The very definition of decadence. France can not even name it's enemies. I never imagined that I would live to witness the death of a civilization, but Europe is perishing before our eyes.
17 posted on 11/21/2005 4:06:39 PM PST by mojito
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To: SmithL

As others have said, thanks for posting this. It is a very serious, thoughtful, and interesting article. I found it oddly encouraging to read the gloomy reflections of M. Finkielkraut. As bad as things are, at least there are a few Frenchmen who get it.


18 posted on 11/25/2005 12:39:04 AM PST by LK44-40
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To: SmithL
"We're living in a post-national society in which for everyone the state is just utilitarian, a big insurance company. This is an extremely serious development."

This little nugget bears a closer look.

19 posted on 12/06/2005 1:09:36 PM PST by Chuckster (Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoset)
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