Posted on 11/09/2005 4:50:09 PM PST by zbigreddogz
Let's just be honest about it: 2005 was a disaster for Republicans and conservatives.
No, we never really had a chance in Jersey, even though it looked like it, but we got beaten even worse then we should have.
Kilgore blew the Virginia race. Yes, Warner's popularity was big, and yes, it's an off year election, and no, Bush isn't at the height of his popularity, but this race was mainly Kilgore's fault. Why did this happen though? What made him think he could run Hitler ads and piss off the NRA and get away with it?
California was almost a complete disaster. We lost every initiative. Sure, we made the Unions blow their wad to beat it, but they got what they paied for.
Washington State was a disaster too. I-912, repealing the outrageously expensive gas tax hike to fund undefined, unaccountable transportation projects appears to have lost, and King County Executive Ron Sims, who essentially fixed the last Governor's race for Christine Gregoire (D), was re-elected as well.
Sure, there were bright spots. Bloomberg coasted to re-election (yes, I know he's a RINO on a lot of issues, but he's still FAR better then NY D's.), we won the Mayor's race in San Diego, which isn't a small matter, and the Manchester, NH mayor's race is very interesting too, seeming as how Kerry, Biden and such campaigned for the D.
But all said and done, it seems to me that this was a much worse year for us then 2001. This is like 2003 was for the Dems. Sure, they got a few neat things (Lousiana Governor's mansion, although I think they regret that now, and Philadelphia Mayor's race), but overall, it was a good year for us going into a very important year. It seems to me, we need to think of the implications of this year, and figure out what do to from here.
I don't think I'm being overly pessimistic, I'm not. I don't think the Dems are going to get either house back next year, but to make sure they don't, I think we need to reflect a little. These aren't simple 'Drive the RINO's out!' questions, or 'Run more moderates' or any such BS. Top down, what do we need to do differently?
Most thoughtful post I've read all day. You are right, we shouldn't just laugh this off.
I don't think nominating a Jesse Helms clone in NJ would have worked, but you are right that Forrester running ads touting his liberal positions was stupid. You are also right that the 'ex-wife' ads were about as low as you can go.
That along with Kilgore's Hitler ads, represented mind-boggling stupidity on the part of both our G candidates.
I think, perhaps, that we've gotten a little too cocky. We are playing it too 'safe', in an ideological sense, and too dangerous in terms of mudslinging. I'm not sure why that is the case, but it's something we need to keep in mind.
We need New Jersey to find a way to merge with Louisiana.
Pot kettle.
YOU have added nothing to this thread except to take issue with wolfstar.
BTW, who is Hackett?
Doubt it. In the days leading up to the election, you couldn't get away from the media blitz on TV of ads from the unions telling voters to say "NO" on each proposition, hell I even saw McCain in one. The Democrat unions carried California, it has nothing to do with when the elction was held, and has everything to do with the deafening silence from the Republicans.
With regards to California, I'll take a RINO over a flaming liberal any old day.
Wrong. Polls showed 68% for them until out of staters started calling Ohio voters. They lost because Ohians resented the outsiders mixing in their state. This was a big loss for Soros because they now can't rig elections as easily as they could have had they passed.
You're also discounting Prop 1 in NY. It was a huge Dem loss as they would have controlled budget making power in NY and taken it away from the Repub Gov.
The bottom line, is we lost virtually every important race.
How is this a huge loss? There were NO important national races. Just a bunch of small fights which we mostly won.
Face it, virtually ALL the California initiatives would have passed a year ago.
I definately don't agree. Calif is one of the MOST liberal states there are. Nothing Conservative is a sure thing there.
The fact that they are blue states is relevant,
No. That's exactly the point.
I'm sorry you see these as such important losses because they aren't. And you expected miracles in liberal land. There are few.
Btw, historically, if there's a Repub in the WH, Virginas Govenor has always been a Dem.
I'm not saying you have to agree with them 100%. Third parties aren't viable unless the rules of voter access are changed, which the Dems and Pubbies would never allow. I mean, with McCain/Feingold, they don't even want opposition from within their own parties now. As for US or THEM, that's false when it's both THEM and THEM. Conservatives are getting tired of not even half a loaf. The only way to change that is to stop sending money to the party but instead to individual candidates. When a false Republican is put up, vote 3rd party or sit it out. Don't keep validating their bad offerings or you can never expect better. It's the same principle with education.....when you have high expectations the kids will rise to that level. If we keep holding our noses and voting for frauds in Republican clothing, we exert no pressure whatever to get better quality candidates.
Onyx, what was it I said in an earlier post about missing a huge forest for a tiny twig on a small branch of a little tree, or something to that effect? Here we have a thread about yet another atrocity committed by Jihadists waging a world war against us, and THIS is what some folks find to get their knickers in a twist.
Again, I have no problem with so-called negative ads that address a candidate's record. I think that is valid and even to be encouraged. It is because those ads are so often characterized as negative that we've got the "issue-less" sound-bite driven campaigns that we have now. Everything is media packaged and so no real debate ever occurs. Now, if the ex-wife was speaking about her witnessing Corzine accepting bribes or subverting his office in some way (and could offer proof since she might just still be TO'd at the settlement) then that would be a different story.
The phrase in that last post should be ballot access, not voter access.
I've never had to hold my nose to vote for any candidate.
As for conservatives --- it seems almost everyone here has their own myopic idea of what constitutes a conservative, and the rest of us are RINOS.
In some states, RINOS are the best that can be elected. I'll say it again --- a Republican moderate is one hell of a lot better than a democrat, save for Zell Miller.
To be honest about this election cycle one has to understand that:
1) New Jersey is a blue, blue state that isn't bloody likely to turn GOP.
2)Kilgore in VA ran a mind numbingly bad campaign. I mean c'mon, his competitor was part of an administration that cried wolf that the state was going bankrupt unless taxes where hiked and then the day after the hike said "oops, I guess we have a surplus after all..oh well, we'll put the money to good use somehow." Not to mention the hair brain Hitler death penalty ads. Kilgore's loss though had nothing to do with the GOP nationally. It had to do with Kilgore. The other two GOP candidates running statewide with Kilgore seem to have won. (A next pick up of one for the GOP in VA BTW. You won't see the media talking about that much).
3) The CA ballot issues...you think the union is going to lose in CA?
4) The ballot defeat in OH stung the Dems a lot more than any of the other defeats in other states stung the GOP. The media is spinning wildly.
5) In the end, 2005 was a "All Politics is Local" year. Extrapolating nationaly from these races makes as much sense as calculating Texas sales tax on groceries you are buying in Arizona.
The polls are as bogus as always, the MSM is FOS, national politics is as ugly as ever, and the Democrats control nothing except the minds of misfits and ignorant people.
Unfortunately, it seems that ignorance is becoming more popular these days, and the future does look bleak.
:) --- I know. I make errors too --- I figured it out on my own...lol.
Indeed, Wolfstar. I agree with you.
Did we quit after the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?
When did that happen or is it going to happen?
(whack!) Put the crack pipe down and PAY ATTENTION! :-)
New Jersey is just another California, even so, he can walk away knowing he came within a whisker to defeating that disheveled and dopey Corzine.
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