Posted on 11/08/2005 8:01:14 AM PST by TBP
Before the divorce rate began its inexorable rise in the late 1960s, the common wisdom had been that, where children are concerned, divorce itself is a problem. But as it became widespread -- peaking at almost one in two first marriages in the mid-1980s -- popular thinking morphed into a new, adult-friendly idea: It's not the act of divorcing that's the problem, but simply the way that parents handle it.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
Very nice post.
I agree completely with your post #170...I knew a woman who endured years of emotional and physical abuse at the hands of her husband...no one can tell me that she and her two boys were better off staying with this bum...she stayed with him for so long, because she tried to live her Catholic faith, and was opposed to divorce...
But after a number of broken bones, and watching her two boys become more and more unstable, she figured enough was enough, and she divorced this husband...a few years later she met a wonderful man, who adored her, and loved her two boys...my friend married this man, had a wonderful marriage with him, and the two of them were able to help her two boys heal...
Best thing she ever did was get a divorce from her first husband...if she had stayed with him, she probably would have wound up beaten to death, and her two boys were be mentally impaired for the rest of their lives...
Divorce should never be entered into lightly...but there are times, , when divorce is the only true rational course to take...
I can agree with you that divorce should be less routine, but if as you say we should make divorce an extraordinary circumstance, well, who gets to decide what those circumstances are? I mean, one could say addiction or abuse, but is that limited to physical abuse? What if one partner insists there is addiction and the other insists there isn't? What if there is no cheating, abuse or addiction but one partner states flatly "I don't love you, I've never loved you, we'll never have any kind of loving or physical relationship, but we can live in the same house as roommates for the kids' sake", should the other partner be legally bound to stay married to this person for the rest of his or her life? Is it better for the children and their future relationships to live in such a dysfunctional, if not violent or abusive household?
I just don't see how any kind of divorce restrictions could be decided upon or fairly enforced. Like most things this is a case where the government ought to stay out of it and let the individuals involved decide. I know that same argument is used by the PCers, but in that case it's a life or death situation for the unborn child so it's not quite the same thing.
Nobody says you shouldn't divorce if your husbands abbusive, but some people here are saying your husbands abandoning because he doesn't go to after school soccer games.
As a 20 year old male i see no benifit in getting legally married. You have a 50/50 chance of losing more than half your assests and a large part of your income for the rest of your life. Get married by your priest and thats it. You might lose a deduction on your tax form but 10 years later when your wife gets bored, and decides your ignoring her, stops sleeping with you, and starts with some one else, you can kick her out of your house, and maybe keep the kids. I mean what kind of judge is going to give kids to a person with no job, no car, and no income.
Do not have kids before your 30, in today culture you aren't an adult til your 25, and you aren't mature, and financially ready til much later.
My younger son is 31, and he also sees no point in getting married...he figures, when he is ready to settle down and have children(if that day ever comes), then and only then will he get married(or when he falls madly in love)....
My hubby and I had both our boys by the time I was 28...my son says he cannot imagine having two children at that age, which was younger than what he is now...
My son has a fabulous job, ,makes a lot of money, ,owns his own home, and is busy all the time, either with sports or traveling or doing those things he is interested in...says it would be selfish of him to get married and have children, when he is just not ready to settle down yet...so at least he is honest enough to admit, that he cannot and will not settle down until that time comes(and it may never come), when he himself is ready to do so...
My husband and I have been happily married for 36yrs, and my son does have that as an example...but he also knows what a sacrifice it sometimes was to raise children, and he knows himself what a 'rotten' teenager he was...he also saw us suffer when our older boy was dianosed with a usually fatal type of leukemia, and he saw what we all suffered as a result of that, and the grief we endured upon our sons death...that had a great impact on him, and altho he knows that children really are a blessing, he also knows the heartache that can come from having children, and sometimes I think he is a little gun shy, about having children...
So my younger son says, until he is ready to really be as ready as he can be, to assume all the responsibilites associated with raising children and supporting a wife, he will continue to stay single...when he feels the time is right, then and only then, will he settle down and get married...
. . .
What I am trying to say is that there is a function, or role that marriage has to play in society at large. It is NOT just a personal decision, but rather a PUBLIC decision. As a result, marriage strengthens the fabric of society. Divorce weakens that fabric..not just the lives of the people directly involved.
Perfectly spoken.
Lol, at our age, everyone thinks we're married anyway. We are thinking about maybe a religious ceremony(sans civil license) down the road.
It's different for young people, especially if children are involved.
Thanks. One cannot reason with fanatics. Particularly when they know what is best for everyone else.
Again, nice plattitudes but very little substance.
Yes, a child exposed to what abortion is, inately knows it is wrong. You continue down a false path. A child knows that a mother killing her own child is wrong, period. Just as they know inately they are meant to have 2 parents. I have never once seen a child, whenever they are first exposed to what abortion is, be instantly repulsed. It is beyond their comprehension, they know inately it is wrong. It takes years of programming and rationalizing to get them from there to the state where its a "choice".
Your cavalier attitude, that hey, divorced kids are twice as likely as kids from stable homes to have problems, but hey at least its not as bad as OOW kids. Sets a low low bar indeed, and is hardly a counter argument.
You ask what happens when people loathe each other and can't stand to be around each other. Well the simple answer is, if you can't contain your behaviors in front of your own offspring you are selfish, pure and simple... not self-interested, but selfish. Mother and Father may not care for each other much, but they are damn well there, without hesitation, without reservation for their children. Not there with plattitudes, but THERE, physically every day and every night.. and No, you can't replace that. It may be the only thing they have in common, but it is far better than the alternative, and study after study bears it out.
Unless there is true abuse or neglect going on, divorce is purely selfishness.
If you loathe your spouse, but cannot keep your conflict out of the eyes and ears of your kids, they you are selfish. Life stopped being about YOU the day you became a parent, or at least that's the adult view. The childish view is "I'm not happy, I deserve more, I need more" I, I, I..... Selfishness.
NO it's not, and YOU need to stop looking at the world through those ROSE COLORED GLASSES to people for what they truly are.. DO you think people that are so extremly unhappy can be GOOD PARENTS??? Newsflash NO...they are not.
When you are so unhappy you know what it leads to? Alcoholism, Drug Abuse, Suicide, illicit affairs, apparently uou have had great parents and for that,GOOD FOR YOU, but don't discount the horrors of some people's problems from unhappy family upbringings.
Bump for later.
I was married first time in a Huge Church Ceremony this husband died, the second one I married him at the local City Hall it was quick and spur of the moment 10 years ago.
Jewish marriage customs are very interesting and I don't think they've been captured in these posts!
Well I think this thread is more about the effects of divorce rather than wedding customs..:)
I'm confused - I thought you were saying you didn't need a legal marriage, that a personal commitment between you and God is okay? But marriage before a JP is a long way from a verbal agreement with God IMHO. There are a lot of reasons why one would choose to be married before a JP.
I am saying a legal marriage is required for the Benefits the state allows you to have concerning Taxes, Insurance, etc..HOWEVER a ceremony pledging your love and commitment to GOD is a total different thing IMHO because you are asking him to bless a union that will ensure the commandments of a biblical marraige.
True Abuse and Neglect, are the only reasons. You think folks weren't raised in homes with all of these problems long before divorce was culturally encouraged? Please.
As to having great parents, you know nothing about my background, so to come to such conclusion is interesting. Lets just say my childhood was far from perfect, and I know from first hand experience whence I speak. I see the effects of divorce on my siblings daily... saw all of my siblings get caught in drugs, some more than others... saw my sister get pregnant just to get my dads attention.. See my youngest brother today still dealing with mental issues of divorce... Don't think because I don't buy your argument that I must not know anything.
You know what, YES I do believe unhappy people can be good parents, I know because I've seen it many times. Of course they are folks who are ADULTS and realize that their childrens life is more important than their happiness. THe notion that unhappiness inately leads to abuse, affairs and suicide is nonsense. Can it? Sure... Does it? no. There are pleanty of unhappy people throughout the world, and have been for eons... the idea that ones happiness is tantamount to all other obligations is beyond childish.
If there is abuse or neglect going on, then by all means divorce. Otherwise, just be honest about if you do divorce its for your satisfaction, not your childrens.
I don't "discount the horrors of some peoples problems from unhappy family upbringings"... But I don't overstate them either. Pleanty of folks have grown up in the history of humanity in less than the "perfect home life" and they don't, as a whole, show the same likelihood of problems as those from divorced homes. I can't tell you how many divorced women in particular I have to listen to say "he's a good father" about their ex.... that statement makes ABSOLUTELY no sense if you are an ADULT and your goal is to raise children.
Divorce, other than for abuse or neglect is selfishness, pure and simple.
Well maybe what you really need to state in your prose is:
WHAT encompasses *ABUSE* IYHO?
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