Delphi Chapter 11 -- GM Next? (Vanity Business)

Me | 10/10/2005 | Me

[devane617]

CNBC stated that Bank of America swithed their position on GM to "SELL". It is being mentioned that GM will follow Delphi into Chapter 11. Although GM has 38 Billion in cash and assets, it may not be enough to cover what is certain to be a huge drop in sales during the next few months. If GM files, that will be extremly bad for our economy.

[devane617]

CNBC stated that Bank of America swithed their position on GM to "SELL". It is being mentioned that GM will follow Delphi into Chapter 11. Although GM has 38 Billion in cash and assets, it may not be enough to cover what is certain to be a huge drop in sales during the next few months. If GM files, that will be extremly bad for our economy.

[GungaLaGunga]

Agreed. And watch for the name of WILBUR ROSS. He bought the corpse of LTV and turned it into ISG/Mittal Steel. He and Steve Miller of Delphi have worked hand-in-glove.

[Paleo Conservative]

What's good for GM is good for America.

[brownsfan]

I recognize GM's importance to the US economy. For that reason, and the fact that I like cars, I'm slightly bitter about what's been done to the company.

But, it seems the best answer is let them pay for their sins, (as the rest of us are left to clean up the mess). Perhaps when the Japanese buy GM they will economize by not giving 25% bonuses to the CEO when sales slip, or giving golden parachutes to all of their cronies.

Much bashing goes on about the cost of labor and healthcare benefits. However, the Japanese managed to open auto plants without unions here in the US. Quality is good, and everyone wins. GM is a mess, and the upper management is raiding the dying companies' coffers.

Damn them.

[Thombo2]

Is there any new info about the Delphi execs accused of inflating their(Delphi)accounts receivable from GM?IE,how large was the mis-statement?How many execs involved?Indictments?Our company just purchased Delphi's domestic battery production and accounts,and i would assume the purchase price would be adjusted downward to reflect restatement of AR?Thanx

[Gay State Conservative]

American unions just won't come to grips with the fact that there are millions and millions of foreign workers that are willing and able to do work for $3/hr that their members are getting $30/hr (plus benefits) for.

The days of union retirees getting $40K/yr pensions, totally free health care and a free trip to Disney World every year are over....if American industry is to survive.

[RayChuang88]

I think you will see a very dramatic change in General Motors if they do file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy.

Expect GM in the USA to be down to three divisions: Chevrolet (family cars plus Corvette), GMC (light trucks and SUV's), and Cadillac (luxury cars). I expect many car models to be phased out, and don't be surprised if GM will lean a lot on its Opel division in Europe to provide new models in the future (that means we'll see the Meriva and Zafira multi-activity vehicles sold in the USA in the next 24 months, along with possibly the Astra small car to be sold to compete against the Honda Civic and Toyota Corolla lines).

[dakine]

"CNBC stated..."

Stop right there, you'll sleep better...

[MHalblaub]

"American unions just won't come to grips with the fact that there are millions and millions of foreign workers that are willing and able to do work for $3/hr that their members are getting $30/hr (plus benefits) for.

The days of union retirees getting $40K/yr pensions, totally free health care and a free trip to Disney World every year are over....if American industry is to survive."

I think there are also some CEOs from India or China who will work for $40K/yr. If you want your worker to work for less you shouldn't raise your own.

[ContemptofCourt]

GM will file..it was already hurting, and now must pick up Delphi's pension woes.

Ford will follow soon after...

[devane617]

As GM goes, so goes the rest of the economy. GM has failed to design efficient cars in favor of gas guzzler SUV( this time it is not a slam against SUV drivers :) ). Combine the facts that the unions, GM execs, product line-up, is way out of wack, it does not look good for GM and the economy as a whole.

I wonder is the Feds will prop up GM if a colapse occurs?

[HuronMan]

Look for Ford and GM to merge within next 18 months.

[Boundless]

I haven't studied the events in great detail, but at
first glance, the Delphi spin-off appears to have been
a way for GM to shed a large number of expensive
union workers.

The unions have yet to figure out that their
competition is not the non-union dude next door,
but teeming masses of laborers in China.

And yes, if GM doesn't get their costs under control,
they could get displaced in the market by Chinese
cars sold with pseudo-American names ... like those
"GMC" tools sold in home improvement stores (hint:
it doesn't stand for General Motors Corp [and I can't
figure out why the real GMC doesn't sue 'em]).

[ContemptofCourt]

From Forbes:

"We think GM's biggest supplier's [Delphi (nyse: DPH - news - people )] recent bankruptcy filing should raise GM's retirement liabilities by at least $6 per share," Banc of America said. "This, and our strong belief the UAW will be tougher on GM than Delphi, should get GM to more seriously consider bankruptcy protection."

That's not good at all.

[toddst]

I don't claim to be an expert on the auto business. However, I've owned GM products for many years, just purchased a new Yucon XL (by fourth) and it's an excellent vehicle for my purposes.

GM needs to rid itself of the union wages and benefits problem to be competitive IMO. I believe that will now happen. If the company needs help to come through this I would support a Fed loan for restructuring. Just my opinion.

[devane617]

ContempCourt, Thanks for the info and research. I suspect we will see this as major news in the next few days. Our entire economy pivots on the auto industry.

[brownsfan]

"American unions just won't come to grips with the fact that there are millions and millions of foreign workers that are willing and able to do work for $3/hr that their members are getting $30/hr (plus benefits) for."

I think it's wise to lay all the blame for this at the feet of the rank and file worker, and the union.

We wouldn't want to follow Henry Ford's model and actually pay people enough so that they could afford to buy what they make. That's silly. What an idiot Ford was, definately not a real conservative.

We all know that the executives at GM have to take those huge salaries without any connection to performance because they can't count on the workers. We also know that the design direction was laid out by the union. The workers wouldn't build Camaro or Firebird anymore, so they had to drop them. Meanwhile Ford is doing quite well with Mustang. (Must be renegades over at Ford). And everyone knows American workers are too stupid and lazy to build a decent car, have you driven a, (Marysville, Ohio), Honda lately?

Yep, let's hope GM just shuts down, and we get rid of all those nasty $40k a year jobs. Those unemployed people won't vote, and even if they do, they surely won't vote Democrat. And even if the Democrats are elected, they won't raise our taxes to pay for benefits they give those who elected them and are now making $4/hr at Arby's versus $40k a year at GM.

God forbid we should actually care about anyone who lives in the US more than anyone else. That's Socialism for cryin' out loud. (Not Nationalism, unless we're talking defense, then Nationalism isn't Socialism.)

Yep. Let's get them all unemployed, it worked for England didn't it?

[ContemptofCourt]

I've been following GM and Ford for the past few months...really been itching to buy some of their preferred shares, as the yeild on most of them is at or near 10%...a tremendous return.

But who would have thought that buying into GM's or Ford's debt would be such a risky proposition.

[Koblenz]

However, the Japanese managed to open auto plants without unions here in the US.

Yes, but the Japanese and Germans have been opening up plants in the US that aren't in non right to work states. Tennessee, South Carolina, Alabama, etc. Michigan is not a right to work state. GM can't get out from under the unions' thumbs. The unions have used their political muscle in Michigan to make it a closed shop state, which makes employers leave. Those that stay cannot be competitive in the long run.

Combine that with long term pensions and you've got yourself a disaster.

[Who dat?]

The days of union retirees getting $40K/yr pensions,…

$40K? I’ve known at least two that were receiving $6K month and a 13th “bonus” payment in December (supposedly to handle Christmas-related stuff). That’s closer to $80K.

That was in addition to health benefits you’d kill for. That was also when they were extorting things like 25-and-out at ANY age, so you could easily have a 45 or 46 year old “retiree” drawing it – for literally 35+ years.

Yes, they could very easily be collecting retirement longer than they worked. It’s a good gig if you can get it but you better make DAMNED sure you sell a s-load of expensive-assed cars forever or it won’t work.

I think it’s safe to say those days are O-V-E-R.