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Judge rules Confederate letters are state property
The Charlotte Observer ^
| Aug. 17, 2005
| AMY GEIER EDGAR
Posted on 08/17/2005 11:45:31 AM PDT by Between the Lines
COLUMBIA - A judge has ruled that a collection of rare, Civil War-era letters belong to South Carolina rather than the man who has had them in his family for generations.
The state sued after Charleston resident Thomas Willcox tried to auction off the letters. Willcox, a descendant of Confederate Gen. Evander Law, filed for bankruptcy soon after.
The collection includes more than 440 letters detailing life in South Carolina between 1861 and 1863.
Many letters are correspondence between generals or the Confederate government and S.C. Govs. Francis Pickens and Milledge Bonham during the Civil War. Three are written by Gen. Robert E. Lee.
Other letters are from residents asking for help defending their communities or for the return of their slaves, who were taken from plantations to help build fortifications. Some letters provide gory details on the realities of war.
U.S. Bankruptcy Judge John Waites issued an order Monday stating that the letters deal with the official duties of the governor and therefore are public records.
A large portion of the letters relate to the governor's military duties, Waites said in the ruling.
"These include information relating to military supplies and shortages, military preparations, the strength and condition of the military, documentation of troop movement, accounts and reports on results of certain battles, and use of funds for military purposes," Waites wrote.
Other provisions enacted during the period are mentioned in the letters, Waites said.
In 1861, the governor was authorized to issue bonds or stock in the name of the state to continue the construction of the new Statehouse. One letter, dated June 7, 1861, from Gov. Pickens to the president of the Bank of South Carolina deals with work on the capitol and the sale of state stock, the judge wrote.
Many of the letters have markings on them consistent with the docketing system of the day.
"Such a docketing system appears to indicate an intent to preserve the document as relating to the public office," Waites said.
State Attorney General Henry McMaster said it was important for the state to get the letters back because they represent "a unique historic and turbulent period in our country and state."
"We must do all we can to preserve the rich history and proud heritage of our state."
The letters will provide a link to the past for researchers, historians and students, said Rodger Stroup, director of the state Department of Archives and History.
"We owe a debt of gratitude to the Willcox family for preserving the documents all these years," McMaster said.
Willcox's attorney, Kenneth Krawcheck, said he learned of the ruling Tuesday and had not had time to examine it.
"We're going to review it in detail and then determine if we need to file an appeal," he said.
TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: South Carolina
KEYWORDS: billofrights; civilwar; constitutionlist; dixie; govtheft; govwatch; kelo; letters; libertarians; neoconfederate; privateproperty; southcarolina
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To: Vicomte13
"If it has docket markers on it, might these letters have earlier been lifted from the public archives at some ancient date?"
But the point is that nobody knows how or when the family obtained the documents. There is simply no evidence that the documents were obtained improperly. Keep in mind that these were not necessarily considered valuable or historical documents at the time they were created; they were basically routine correspondence of a kind which is usually disposed of after a mandatory minimal archival period. The state's case is built upon a series of assumptions, not facts. For all we know, the state put the documents up for auction a hundred years ago and the family bought them. I'm no lawyer, I think this case is very vulnerable to reversal at a higher level.
To: XRdsRev
If that's the story, then the judges decision was the correct one. If your grandfather is in possession of stolen property and passes it on to you, that inheritance doesn't make the property any less stolen.
In this case, the guys ancestor was entrusted with state property to protect it from the union army. When the war was over, the guy should have returned the papers to the state. The fact that he didn't makes him a thief, and doesn't grant his descendants any kind of claim to the papers.
To: Between the Lines
Given that the southern states that seceded from the Union were not considered a part of the United States for the purpose of the Emancipation Proclamation and the passage of several Constitutional Amendments after the war, I think he could argue that the letters involved a foreign nation that no longer exists.
To: tallhappy
WTH !
This guy needs a better lawyer.
To: E. Pluribus Unum
"This article raises more questions than it answers, the primary question being 'how did he or his predecessors come into original possession of these letters?"
I don't think anyone knows. The state claims they are official documents, but can't prove it. Maybe 130 years ago, the state sold the documents to a scrap dealer or an auction house. Maybe the family PAID for the documents. The point is, I don't think the state can just claim ownership when there's no proof the family didn't obtain the documents legitimately.
Here's a comparative example: public libraries routinely sell off old books that are deemed of no lasting significance. Suppose I buy one of these books and it stays in my family for 100 years, and it turns out to be worth $100,000. Then my descendent files for bankruptcy and the $100,000 book goes into court and someone sees a Seattle Public Library stamp on the book, so the City finds out about this and claims title to the book. That's not too different from what's happening in this case.
To: Steve_Seattle
The Confederate discontinuity argument is interesting, but it doesn't work for the states.
Decisions of the state courts before, during and after the War Between the States are all binding precedent without distinction. By contrast, the decisions of the Supreme Court of the CSA (assuming there was such an entity) have no legal force, although I suppose they could be cited as "persusasive authority".
The States did not cease to exist. Their citizens entered into a state of rebellion, the rebellion was put down, the state continued to be a state in unbroken continuity, at least legally speaking.
66
posted on
08/17/2005 1:51:23 PM PDT
by
Vicomte13
(Tibikak ishkwata!)
To: atomicpossum
THAT is an AWESOME idea!
Get a shark, and use the fallout from Kelo up in Conn. to give weight to their claim!
I believe that 130 years of "storage fees", including compounded interest due to a history of "lack of payment" might be worth MORE than the letters at auction!
Then use the proceeds to buy some tar and feathers, and grab that P.O.S. Judge, and re-introduce him to "Pre-Declaration of Independence" local justice!
67
posted on
08/17/2005 1:51:26 PM PDT
by
Itzlzha
("The avalanche has already started...it is too late for the pebbles to vote")
To: Steve_Seattle
I agree with your assessment that the burden ought to be on the STATE to prove ownership of these documents.
It will be interesting to see what the appellate courts do.
68
posted on
08/17/2005 1:53:14 PM PDT
by
Vicomte13
(Tibikak ishkwata!)
To: XRdsRev
"These letters had been part of the official correspondence of the State of South Carolina. The letters were part of a group of documents that were entrusted to a CS government official for safekeeping near the end of the war. His job was to prevent these and other documents from falling into enemy hands so they could be returned to the government once a safe location for their storage could be found. Since the war ended shortly thereafter, the documents remained with the man who had been entrusted with them. He kept them hidden from the Federal authorities who most certainly wanted to investigate them as part of the compilation of the Official Records of the Rebellion."
Is this scenario a proven fact, or just a theory? The article doesn't mention any of this. Is there a proven "chain of evidence" between these documents and a specific person acting in the aftermath of the Civil War?
To: XRdsRev
If that is the case, I would still think that since the papers were entrusted to the family by a state of the CSA that no longer exists, it would not apply to the current state of SC now part of the USA.
70
posted on
08/17/2005 1:55:24 PM PDT
by
Between the Lines
(Be careful how you live your life, it may be the only gospel anyone reads.)
To: tallhappy
71
posted on
08/17/2005 1:57:22 PM PDT
by
OKIEDOC
(There's nothing like hearing someone say thank you for your help.)
To: Between the Lines
Hey - If it serves the public good there's no such thing as private property - it all belongs to the "collective".
[/sarc]
72
posted on
08/17/2005 1:57:51 PM PDT
by
patriot_wes
(papal infallibility - a proud tradition since 1869)
To: HEY4QDEMS
In big agreement.
73
posted on
08/17/2005 1:58:13 PM PDT
by
OKIEDOC
(There's nothing like hearing someone say thank you for your help.)
To: longtermmemmory
The poor guy should sue his bankruptcy attorney.Why?
Bankruptcy courts are basically courts of equity, which means that you better have clean hands when you ask the bankruptcy court for relief.
Based on this story, which is not very well done, I can't tell if the court was correct or incorrect in its conclusions. In fact, there is some question in my mind if the reporter is correct when they call Krawcheck "his attorney".
74
posted on
08/17/2005 2:00:24 PM PDT
by
PAR35
To: Vicomte13
"The States did not cease to exist. Their citizens entered into a state of rebellion, the rebellion was put down, the state continued to be a state in unbroken continuity, at least legally speaking."
That's kind of what I thought (post #58), but I wasn't sure so I left myself a little wiggle-room. But in another post, XRdsRev suggests that the history of these specific documents is known, and that they can be traced to a particular individual. If that is true - and this article does not say anything about it - the state's case would be stronger. I had had the impression from the story that no one really knew where the documents came from or how they were obtained.
To: Vicomte13
"I agree with your assessment that the burden ought to be on the STATE to prove ownership of these documents."
XRdsRev claims that - apparently based on something else he/she has read - that these documents have a pedigree and can be traced back to a specific individual and a specific post-Civil War scenario. If that is true, the state may have a better case than you would assume from this article. Still, there are some old legal cliches and principles that seem to be violated here, e.g., "possession is nine-tenths of the law," statute of limitations, chain-of-evidence, proof of ownership, etc.
To: Question_Assumptions
"Given that the southern states that seceded from the Union were not considered a part of the United States for the purpose of the Emancipation Proclamation and the passage of several Constitutional Amendments after the war..."
I think we need to question some assumptions here.
The southern states were part of the United States for the purpose of ratifying the post-Civil War Amendments. Here is how Southern states voted to ratify, and when:
Tennessee, April 7, 1865; Arkansas, April 14, 1865; Connecticut, May 4, 1865; New Hampshire, July 1, 1865; South Carolina, November 13, 1865; Alabama, December 2, 1865; North Carolina, December 4, 1865; Georgia, December 6, 1865.
Ratification was completed on December 6, 1865.
The amendment was subsequently ratified by Florida, December 28, 1865 (Florida again ratified on June 9, 1868, upon its adoption of a new constitution); Texas, February 18, 1870.
The amendment was rejected (and not subsequently ratified) by Mississippi, December 4, 1865.
77
posted on
08/17/2005 2:06:21 PM PDT
by
Vicomte13
(Tibikak ishkwata!)
To: nikos1121
So if I come across a catch of letters written by Abe Lincoln when he was in the Illinois House of representatives I would have to give them to the State of Illinois rather than be able to sell them or even receive a tax credit for the donation. If they were personal correspondence they belong to you.
If they were official correspondence, they belong to the Government.
78
posted on
08/17/2005 2:07:40 PM PDT
by
Polybius
To: Polybius
"If they were official correspondence, they belong to the Government."
Unless the government sold them, auctioned them, or officially disposed of them, which they do with millions of documents.
To: Steve_Seattle
80
posted on
08/17/2005 2:20:36 PM PDT
by
E. Pluribus Unum
(Islam Factoid:After forcing young girls to watch his men execute their fathers, Muhammad raped them.)
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