[T-Bird45]

The final paragraph says it all for me. If you mess with the bull, you are likely to get the horns. Given the Pearl Harbor sneak attack, how can the Japanese expect that they would not get that back, many times over, if we had the opportunity? Morality must also contain a component of justice, in my opinion.

[adam_az]

Tibbets was unavailable for comment, but in a 2002 interview he insisted that he had no regrets: 'You're gonna kill innocent people at the same time, but we've never fought a damn war anywhere in the world where they didn't kill innocent people. If the newspapers would just cut out the shit: "You've killed so many civilians." That's their tough luck for being there.

[Redcloak]

I had almost forgotten that it's coming up on National Pretendwedidntstartthewar Day in Japan.

Konichiwa! Have a happy Pretendwedidntstartthewar Day!

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

But I just hope you will be able to mourn the victims of Hiroshima and have a drop of tear for the victims.

And you weep for Nanking? How about Pearl Harbor? The prisoners in your camps that you did horrible things to? For developing biological warfare weapons to use against us?

Do you weep for that?

I am sorry that you were so determined to be such a barbarous bunch that such measures were necessary.

[steveegg]

Did it truly face the prospect of a full-scale invasion of Japan which some estimated would result in a million casualties?

Yes. A group of junior officers led a force of over 1000 in search of Emperor Hirohito's recorded surrender the night before it was to be broadcast; they ransacked most of the Imperial Palace before they were finally driven off. Had the found them, or killed Hirohito, Operation Olympic would probably have happened, to the tune of millions of dead.

[DBrow]

LeMay's bombing of Tokyo killed more people and utterly destroyed 16 square miles of city, while the total destruction zone of Hiroshima was on the order of 8 or 9 square miles.

LeMay also bombed at least twenty other Japanese cities, I think the total death toll was close to three hundred thousand (150,000 for Tokyo alone). He was told to save Hiroshima and Nagasaki for special operations, he was not told why.

In this light, why is atomic bombing any worse? Those civilians are not less dead, were not made dead more pleasantly, and families and friends did not mourn them less for having been killed with nonnuclear incendiaries and HE bombs.

It is a terrible decision to make, to decide to bomb population centers, moms, dads, kids, dogs, cats, houses. Once you decide that I think the choice of "which bomb" has much less moral weight than the decision to go ahead. 20,000 tons of TNT is just as bad as, and no worse than, a 20KT nuke.

[Congressman Billybob]

Anyone who thinks for a nanosecond that the "Japanese were on the verge of surrender" before the second bomb was dropped is one of two things. Either he is too stupid to swallow his own spit, or he is too dishonest to be trusted with a $5 bill. Either way, anyone who takes him seriously is making a grave mistake.

Congressman Billybob

Latest column: "Re: John Roberts, Supreme Court Nominee"

[doug from upland]

HAVE FUN SINGING THE ATOMIC BOMB SONG

[Brian Allen]

<< 'I don't blame them but I hope they mourn the dead' >>

Sure we did and sure we do.

Right after we get done celebrating the millions of American and other innocents' lives that descend from our having brought to its knees the manifestation of evil that was then Japan and that earned its place in igonomy as Human history's fouth most prolific mass murderer.

[ASOC]

I had occasion, a couple of years ago, to tour the 'Peace Park' in Hiroshima. I was with a group of teens from Anchorage. At the Park, we were pestered by a local who wanted us to sign a petition to have the US pay reparations to the "children of the survivors" of the A bomb attack. I told him to get welfare from someone else.

A young lady in the group, with pink and green hair no less,(dont ask, she was a teenager) as hit up by the same local.

In a *very loud* voice she said (in fluent Japanese I would add) "Your daddy should have thought more before he attacked Pearl Harbor!" The rest was pretty impolite as well. I bought dinner. Seems not all teens are brainless nitwits.

[wardaddy]

Sixty years later, the debate still rages

Liberal self loathing bullshit.

The "debate" didn't even start till the mid 80s....40 years after we gave them the buttkicking they asked for.

[lawgirl]

However, if roles were reversed do you think the Japanese would have used the bomb on the United States?

Exactly. There's nothing more to say.

[BikerTrash]

When the Atom Bomb Fell

Oh, it went up so loud, it divided up the clouds,
And the houses did vanish away.
And a great ball of light filled the Japanese with fright
They must have thought it was their judgment day.
Smoke and fire, it did flow, through the land of Tokyo.
There was brimstone and dust everywhere.
When it all cleared away, there the cruel Japs did lay.
The answer to our fighting boys' prayers, yes, Lord,
The answer to our fighting boys' prayers.

There was no atheist in a foxhole,
And men who never prayed before
Lifted tired and bloodshot eyes to heaven
And begged the Lord to end that awful war.
They told him of their homes and loved ones.
They told him that they'd like to be there.
I believe the bomb that struck Hiroshima
was the answer to our fighting boys' prayers.

Oh, it went up so loud, it divided up the clouds,
And the houses did vanish away.
And a great ball of light filled the Japanese with fright
They must have thought it was their judgment day.
Smoke and fire, it did flow, through the land of Tokyo.
There was brimstone and dust everywhere.
When it all cleared away, there the cruel Japs did lay.
The answer to our fighting boys' prayers, yes, Lord,
The answer to our fighting boys' prayers.

Karl & Harty, Columbia Records, 1945

[solitas]

This was during the war, when people become mad to kill the enemy.

S'a funny thing about wars - generally, you win them by killing the enemy to the point where what's left gives up. A proven technique.

Pressed on whether he would have done as Tibbets did, Mr Matsushima raised his hands and said: 'This time I will reject that. I know that some of the pilots of the Enola Gay say, "If I was told to carry the A-bomb again I would do it, because that was our job." But I don't think I can welcome this opinion. ... 'If I see them on Tinian Island, what shall I tell them? "I understand you did your job during the war so I don't blame you. But I just hope you will be able to mourn the victims of Hiroshima and have a drop of tear for the victims. Please co-operate to stop the third use of it in this world".'

Question: they're supposed to respect your opinions and "give you the time of day" exactly...WHY?

'Sixty years ago maybe the pilots of the Enola Gay had to do that because it was their duty but, after all, they killed men and women, young and old, and even children and babies.

Someone please remind me again: what were the ricers doing to the populations of the countries and islands that THEY invaded during the war?

[CWOJackson]

"Sixty years later, the debate still rages."

Not really, there's nothing to debate.

[TailspinJim]

My wife and I had the great pleasure of meeting and having our photo taken with Gen. Tibbits last July after waiting three and a half hours in line under the wing of a C5-A to buy his book "Return of The Enola Gay" (great book),at last years Experimental Aircraft Asso. annual convention at Oskosh, WI.
What a wonderful patriot he is. That evening he was featured speaker for all EAA lifetime members and volunteers, and some nitwit asked him how he felt "killing all those innocent civilians". He said that he "had NO regrets, that it was necessary to bring a swift end to the war and to SAVE many lives", had we needed to invade the Japanese homeland. "It needed to be done to stop the killing". Indeed, on the way out, after the dinner, one EAA member mentioned to us that his dad, a POW in Japan, wouldn't be alive had we not dropped the bombs. Jim EAA 6886 lifetime

[A.A. Cunningham]

Between the time Truman was sworn in as President in April of '45 and the dropping of the bomb on Hiroshima on 6 August, about four months, the United States suffered over 50% of its total casualties in the Pacific theater. Any person who argues that the bombs weren't necessary and that the Japs were already defeated is a fool.

[Mr. Silverback]

Just a little note...it has nothing to do with whether the A-Bomb drop was right or not, just something interesting.

Pearl Harboe was not supposed to be a surprise attack. Tokyo had sent a message to their embassy in Washington using the "Purple" diplomatic code that was to be decoded and delivered to the Secretary of State by a certain time on December 7th. The message was a declaration of war, and would have arrived as much as an hour prior to the Pearl Harbor attack. The crypto staff at the embassy decoded it late, and by the time it was delivered, the attack had already begun, and IIRC, the second wave was in working the place over.

I'm not sure how much that extra hour or two would have mattered in the minds of the American people, but it's worth noting that Yamamoto was horrified to learn the attacks had been carried out without a declaration. It was then that he said he believed all they had done was wake a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve.

[HereInTheHeartland]

I just wish we could have had the bomb sooner.
Every day that the war went on American men died.
Dec 8th, 1941 would have been a good time to start dropping them.

[Blue_Spark]

One other item that is rarely brought up is that the USSR declared war against Japan a few days before the surrender. Japan lost 4 small islands that have yet to be returned. I wonder if the Japanese ever considered what would have happened if the USSR had taken over Hokaido?

[muir_redwoods]

Hiroshima and Nagasaki were simply Pearl Harbor repaid with interest. The Japanese made it a point of honor that they would never surrender so they were telling us that total destruction was the only solution.

We totally destroyed them. They got what was coming to them. If the civilians had been prudent, they never would have allowed war Lords to run things. All through the '30's the average Japanese lived pretty well on the plunder wrought from the rest of Asia. Pay-back's a b!tch.