Posted on 05/05/2005 8:10:56 PM PDT by No Longer Free State
Wow, she should have been nailed to the cross
Don't yet ... the helicopter pilots that screwed-up were Marines pilots that were unqualified and not properly trained. The Marines worked their way in because they wanted the Marines represented on the mission. The best thing that came out of that mission was SOCOM and TF160....
First off, if you were on my side, your sure were awful quiet. Secondly, YASOTAY attacked me and the Marines when the subject of this thread an affirmative action Army reservist who not only embarrassed her branch, but the ENTIRE COUNTRY!!
My real beef is with the idiocy at the top levels of the Army that swallowed this PC crap pushed by Clinton. Claudia Kennedy is a fine example. A General officer who had to play 'victim' because she got a pat on the ass!! Ridiculous!! This is the Army's idea of leadership?? The COS of the Army, Shinseki, changing the black berets that were coveted by the elite group and giving it to all the Army as standard issue? I work with Army personnel in my job as a defense contractor, and every one told me of the decline in moral at that bonehead move. Yeah, there have been many fine officers and NCOs whose service in the Army is highly commendable, but Shinseki and Kennedy and Karpinski are notorious for their 'lacklusterness'.
YASOTAY has an ax to grind with the Marines, and that's his prerogative, but this Marine of the past 30 plus years isn't going to stand by and be berated and called a loser and liar BY ANYONE! The Marines are NOT LOSERS or LIARS, and we answer the call EVERYTIME!
Probably exactly what happened. But it will still be hard to swallow, especially as a number of lower ranking officers and EM are paying their dues for this debacle.
Karpinski should have been court-martialed and demoted to PVT! The Army is soooooo easy on her.
If she was wearing a Marine Corps uniform, (which she would have had a very difficult time in achieving), she would have lost EVERYTHING and had hard time as well as a dishonorble discharge!
Read posts 40 to 44 (in order) Please show me my half truths.
Please tell me the name(s) of the Marine Chain of Command held accountable in the listed incidents.
You should research what the Marines said about their M-60 MG team back left behind on Koh Tang Island in 1975 ..... or what the Marines told their families. Maybe a Marine General would like to answer to the families of the Ospery Marines.
Do I have an ax to grind, yes when a Marine wrongfully attacks the Army or makes a false or inaccurate statement I will counter it. I hope the Marines stop fooling themselves and the country.
And this 19-year soldier isn't going to let you do the same to us because you let someone who disagrees with you get under your skin. For every Kennedy or Karpinski I can name dozens of fine officers that made their grade. EVERY TIME!
I'm not going to argue with you about Clinton appointees except to say there's nothing we can do about it. When the likes of Wes Clark get to four stars because they're connected to the president, and then those yoyos go on to sit on boards for more junior generals, who are they going to appoint? The Marines are lucky it didn't affect them as much, but it's not like we have the lattitude to get in the way of the administration's goals. We do work for them, after all.
While I don't like Slate, it was the first article that I found. You can also Google: Marines Army Sunni Triangle and find many other articles on that subject where unfortunately the Marines were wrong.
The Marines that replaced the 82nd were publicly stating that the Army was too harsh and the Marines were going to use the "Soft Approach".
It looks like the Marines were wrong.
If I remember correctly a Marine unit was overrun in Ramadi in April 2004.
In Fallujah 1, the Marines did not have enough troops or combat power to win. Yes 2 Marine battalions might have taken Fallujah, but they did not. In Fallujah 2, I think it was two Marine Regiments that followed two Army heavy battalions into the city (2/2 Inf and 2/7 Cav).
At Koh Tang the Marines failed in their tactical mission.
Beirut. Is there is any doubt?
Fallujah. To be determined.
The Army has held it's Officers' accountable. Even with the most tragic Army incident, Pat Tillman, Officers' were relieved and reprimanded. Again the Marines appear to have started to reverse course, but their actions (and INACTIONS) over the last 30 years have shown otherwise.
That's the root of your problem right there. If that;s the case, why weren't the Marines as adversely affected by BJ Klintoon? Because they made it clear - the Marine Corps isn't a social experiment for some temporary Washington residents to play around with!
We didn't allow 200 plus years of leadership to be screwed up by a freakin' draft dodger crook and his broom ridin' wife from Arkansas!
If everybody could be a Marine, then we wouldn't be the Marines.
You guys keep on truckin' with your 'Army of one'. By the way, are you going for 4 months in row of missing recruiting quota? LOL!! Eat your hearts out fellas.
I'm sorry. Are you actually proposing that the Marines don't work for the president? That's your problem right there. You think you work for your own glory. BTW, the USMC is also having recruiting problems, in case you hadn't heard.
Correction. You OLD marines still think you work for your own glory. Currently, the services are working together better for common goals than they ever have before. Old attitudes simply don't work in today's shooting wars.
The USMC hasn't missed a goal this year, my friend. The Army missed the past three straight months. Hmmm....
By ERIC SCHMITT; THOM SHANKER CONTRIBUTED REPORTING FROM WASHINGTON FOR THIS ARTICLE, AND GRETCHEN RUETHLING FROM CHICAGO. (NYT) 747 words
Late Edition - Final , Section A , Page 12 , Column 6
ABSTRACT - Marine Corp misses its monthly recruiting goal in Jan for first first time in nearly decade; military officials call this latest troubling indicator of Iraq war's impact on armed services; Marines historically have had luxury of turning away willing recruits; recent failure seen as potential problem for service (M)
Only one of several other sources for the same story produced by a search on 'marine recruiting goal missed'. Sorry to burst your bubble, but it really needed bursting.
I heard or read somewhere that this shoplifting thing was "confirmed". Don't know exactly what that means, but the reports imply that the charge is undisputed.
That's the root of your problem right there.
You are correct .... about that being the root of the problem. If you were enlisted, You took an oath to "obey the orders of the President ..." Maybe you think the oath you took to the country isn't as important as the Marines (guess what .... you are wrong!). The loyalty that the Marines expect is all one way (and it is the WRONG way). Over the last 30 years why are so many Marine Officers openly lying? Do you want the classic example of a Marine Officer openly lying?
He said the army fell 32 percent short of its March recruiting goal of 6,800 recruits for the active duty force, which followed a 27 percent shortfall in February.
That put it 11 percent behind its goal for the year-to-date through March.
"The last time we had missed a monthly active army mission was in May of 2000," Smith said.
Recruiting for the army reserve was even more difficult, coming in 46 percent below the goal for March, according to the army's figures.
It was the third consecutive month of shortfalls in recruiting for the reserves, which now account for about 35 percent of the 145,000 US troops in Iraq. Smith said the army reserves were 1,382 recruits, or about 17 percent, behind their target for the year-to-date.
Read your freep mail and you'll know the answer. End if discussion. PERIOD.
Truman's Biggest Mistake:
Not abolishing the Marines when he said they should be abolished!
Hey assbag, you wanna get a hole stomped in you? Keep it up
Name the place and time and I'll be there.
I live near Portland, Oregon and you are welcome to come here anytime. I learned in the Rangers to fight to kill, not the bar brawl that you pounding your chest about. Go back to your bar.
That's the root of your problem right there.
If you were an Officer your oath is alittle different, BUT your Commission states clearly that you serve at the "Pleasure of the President". Is there a problem in the Marines obeying the President? He clearly had problems telling the truth, the Marines should have gotten along just fine....
Don't drink. Don't need it.
As for your comments about the President, it's obvious why you have such ill feelings about the Marines. General Pete Pace first EVER Marine Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, nominated by the president you have such enmity for. In his nomination speech President Bush said "Marines is shorthand for 'can do'".
You like Harry Truman and despise George W. Bush, but you are a FReeper??? LOL - you should be a member of DU, that's more your speed!!
Can you say jealousy?!!
You dogfaces are all sour grapes... but then again you weren't a member of the brotherhood of the world's finest fighting force.
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