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Bush’s triumph conceals the great conservative crack-up
Times on Line (England) ^ | 3/19/05 | Andrew Sullivan

Posted on 03/19/2005 7:42:20 PM PST by Mobile Vulgus

It should be the best of times for American conservatism. Republican majorities in the House and Senate, a re-elected Republican president, an increasing number of Republican governors and a rightwards tilt in the judiciary. While the British Tories and German Christian Democrats flounder, America’s right seems to flourish.

Well, that’s the cover story. Beneath the surface, however, American conservatism is in increasing trouble. The Republican coalition, always fragile, now depends as much on the haplessness of the Democrats as on its own internal logic. On foreign and domestic policy alike the American right is splintering. With no obvious successor to George W Bush that splintering will deepen....


TOPICS: Editorial; Government
KEYWORDS: britrash; bs; bushhate; crap; democratindisguise; dutroll; fullofit; horseflop; instigator; laughable; lie; loadofcrap; newbie; newtroll; nottrue; poppycock; rat; troll; trollalert; usahate; wishfulthinking
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To: Mobile Vulgus

ROTFLMAO!


21 posted on 03/19/2005 7:57:35 PM PST by drt1
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To: byteback

I agree. the Religious are not all there is to the GOP. It is a huge mistake to think so. But, usually people who DO think that are trying to pretend that the GOP does NOT have a giant toehold in the homes of Joe SixPack and his family! It is their reflexive attempt to imagine that regular Americans are really still on their side and jsut need a "good candidate" for them to vote for.

They are completely unable to admit that it is their MESSAGE that is killing them.


22 posted on 03/19/2005 7:57:57 PM PST by Mobile Vulgus
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To: Mobile Vulgus
The Republican coalition, always fragile,

WTF is this "coalition"? The 'Rats are a coalition of every leftist and anti-American group out there; however, the GOP is, IMHO, as united and focused as any political party in American history. It is the GOP unity that obviously has the left frightened.

23 posted on 03/19/2005 7:58:18 PM PST by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
First, they said there would be a crackup following the collapse of the USSR due to the fact that anti-communism was what held the movement together. Over a decade later, we're going full tilt.

Then, they said Gingrich would scare off the moderate wing and the coalition would collapse. Nearly a decade to the day of the Revolution of 1994, the party is winning at the polls as good as ever.

Now, you've got the former governor of New Jersey who shall remain nameless as well as this dunce saying variants of the same thing again. Anyone want to place bets on the validity of the assessment given the history?

EVERY party, EVERY movement, and EVERY Family has a little fighting now and then, and it usually proves harmless in the long term. Since when did healthy debates become bitter infighting? Folks have their sensitivity cranked up too much.
24 posted on 03/19/2005 7:59:08 PM PST by AZ_Cowboy ("Be ever vigilant, for you know not when the master is coming")
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To: Mobile Vulgus

It is certanly not the equivalent of the Tories or the CDU.


25 posted on 03/19/2005 7:59:30 PM PST by sanchez810
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To: Mobile Vulgus
To: Andrew Sullivan
From: M Kehoe

Conservatism in America is ascending. Liberalism in America is declining. Ain't it cool?

Plus, there's a good chance we won't see CWII here.

Life is good.

5.56mm

26 posted on 03/19/2005 8:00:56 PM PST by M Kehoe
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To: Mobile Vulgus

The Democrats are so much more fragmented than Republicans on every level, that we have to worry more about self sabotage then Democrats.

The only way a Democrat gets the Presidency in 2008 is if Bush blows the war, doesn't work on what he said his agenda was and if Republicans throw an unelectable candidate at the voters.

The next worry is the House and AGAIN we need the Republicans to DO what they said to get elected.
If we have to throw new candidates in open races and to challenge Democrats, FOR GOD SAKE, MAKE THEM ELECTABLE.


27 posted on 03/19/2005 8:01:55 PM PST by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: byteback
I'm so sick of the "Religous Right owns the party" line.

I kinda just glossed over that part, considering the source.

The homosexual activists, like Andrew, always say "the religous right runs the party" everytime the homosexual activists get knocked back in their box a bit.

They don't realize that even the socially moderate conservatives, who have no desire to monitor anybody's bedroom activities, also have no desire to have homosexual activists teaching third graders about sexual tolerance and teaching high school kids the joys of fisting.

And we see no need to have society sanction homosexual unions as some sort of norm. It's abnormal. It's unhealthy. And if you want to do it, have a party. But don't demand our approval and praise.

28 posted on 03/19/2005 8:02:39 PM PST by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
Our conservative movement is a modern, progressive one

Excuse me? Conservative and progressive don't belong in the same sentence, let alone in the same party.

29 posted on 03/19/2005 8:03:05 PM PST by garandgal
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To: Mobile Vulgus
They are completely unable to admit that it is their MESSAGE that is killing them.

Then why not say so? this article said the right was fractured. Basically the left is intolerant so the middle is voting with us. If the Democrats ever figure out that they should be Pro America they could take some seats.

30 posted on 03/19/2005 8:03:43 PM PST by byteback
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Comment #31 Removed by Moderator

To: Mobile Vulgus
Sullivan's work is spotty. Sometimes he is right on. Sometimes he gets a burr under his saddle and wanders off into left field. This is one of those times.

The Republicans are not monolithic. They are having some debates over certain aspects of domestic and foreign policy.

On the other hand, the Democrats are squabbling over more difficult ground. They are arguing about whether they have any ideas, and if so, what those ideas might be.

The Republican dilemma is the normal one of a healthy political party. The Democratic dilemma is the one of a political party that is dying. It is not a difficult choice to make as to which one is better.

Congressman Billybob

Latest column, "Condi Rice & Pierce Flanigan's Father's Hat"

32 posted on 03/19/2005 8:04:16 PM PST by Congressman Billybob (Proud to be a FORMER member of the Bar of the US Supreme Court since July, 2004.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
"This is where we need to ship extremist righties like Pat Buchanan..."

National socialism is more lefty, and national socialism would be absolutely necessary for Buchananite/Raimondo politics to hold onto power. But it's really a non-issue, as such groups don't have enough voter numbers to even be a threat to Republican politics at all.
33 posted on 03/19/2005 8:04:36 PM PST by familyop (Essayons!)
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To: AZ_Cowboy

It's the same mindset that cannot understand why G.W. encourages his cabinet to bounce off each other in spirited, and yes, sometimes heated dialogue. They take that as a sign no one is control. They assume nothing can possibly come together, everything is in disarray.

IMO, it is the Left in serious trouble and I can state why. they've lost their hold on principle. Morality. They have positions they hold deeply, true, but nothing is more important than power. For power they will not just compromise but ABANDON those principles.

That is why they are on the verge of collapse. When denied power, the very thing they defied their beliefs for, they are left with nothing to fill the void.


34 posted on 03/19/2005 8:05:43 PM PST by Soul Seeker
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Posting some cut-and-paste, because this certainly applies...


-----
Consider the 30 year cycle; it goes 10 years of conservative strength, 10 years of liberal spending of that strength (ie wasting of peace dividends), and then another 10 years of suffering under liberal socialism until people snap and say enough is enough, then re-elect conservatives.

This pattern fits perfectly going all the way back to the 1880s, at least. In keeping with it, this decade is essentially a version of the 1970s. We may have yet to elect a "President Carter" and collapse for 4 years before a decade of true conservatism takes hold. (Bush resembles Nixon in some respects, and I mean that as nothing but a positive thing.)

It's a strange factor to consider Bush as a moderate (somewhat debatable), as that could either blunt the strength of a reactionary movement against liberalism (Carter didn't just suck, he sucked ROYALLY), or perhaps it could actually enhance republican policy, with the greatest danger being our own tendency to become moderates and even 'liberal republicans' as we gain power.
-----


35 posted on 03/19/2005 8:06:03 PM PST by SteveMcKing
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To: dead
Concerning homosexual issues, Almost all conservative support the representative process of "rights entitlement" not the judicial fiat process which liberals favor.
36 posted on 03/19/2005 8:06:14 PM PST by sanchez810
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To: dead

Good point. Somehow those who think that we need to accept the Homosexual agenda don't also feel that they need to accept those with a Christian agenda. If they would be as tolerant as they want us to be then maybe they'd have a point.


37 posted on 03/19/2005 8:07:15 PM PST by byteback
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To: undercover brother
Even if the Pakistani electorate voted in a pro-Bin Laden regime, giving AQ the bomb?

If any country provides AQ nuclear materials, they are our enemy.

Their form of government is irrelevant.

38 posted on 03/19/2005 8:07:31 PM PST by dead (I've got my eye out for Mullah Omar.)
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Comment #39 Removed by Moderator

To: Mobile Vulgus

BTW, Buchanan is a great man with sound ideas, but he has cost the right votes in a strategic sense. That's the price of being right.

Considering his pseudo-retirement, he is a non-factor and I don't see why you are bringing him up and calling him a racist.


40 posted on 03/19/2005 8:12:50 PM PST by SteveMcKing
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