Oh wait, you said John AdamS....never mind....
Posted on 03/15/2005 10:12:50 AM PST by quidnunc
Is the US still at war? Fighting as vague a conflict as the war on terror is hard, polarizing citizens and rendering difficult Washington's decisions about civil liberties at home. Washington is also preoccupied with sustaining its alliance with London. The US is aware that Britain may eventually opt for the Eurosphere over the Anglosphere. But these tensions are not new, as James Grant points out in a new biography of John Adams, America's second president. Compare the Adams presidency to the current one and several truths emerge.
The first is that quasi-wars split electorates more sharply than traditional wars. Napoleon Bonaparte was not about to sail into Boston harbor. Still, in the late 1790s, France's Directoire — the latest in a series of increasingly extreme regimes — was granting privateers license to attack foreign ships. In 1797 French corsairs intercepted more than 300 American merchant vessels. At what point, the young US debated, do such acts of violence become war? Like President George W. Bush, who created the Department of Homeland Security, President Adams created a government department to handle the new brand of conflict: a Department of the Navy.
The uncertain status of the Franco-American relationship polarized America's two big parties. Thomas Jefferson and his Republicans refused to vilify the French, whom they knew, after all, as fellow revolutionaries. Adams and his Federalists viewed the pro-French Republicans as reckless — much in the same way that Realpolitiker view the Bush administration's nation-building as reckless. Sounding for all the world like Henry Kissinger, Adams wrote of the Jeffersonians that by "their King-killing toasts" as well as "their everlasting brutal cry of tyranny, despots and combinations against liberty" the Jeffersonians might "involve us in a war with all the world". …
-snip-
(Excerpt) Read more at techcentralstation.com ...
LOL. Thanks for the link.
GEE now days if you want to hate the french you'll have to get in a long line, it was so much simpler for John Adams and his contempories............................
The whole Hamiltonian-Anglophile-Federalist vs. Jeffersonian- Francophile-Republican thing in Washington's first two terms is eerily reminiscent of our present situation of Republicans vs. Democrats.
Thanks for the clarification
Al Bundy's Negative Statements about the French
Whose Room Is it Anyway? (0106)
Peggy: So, what are you gonna spend your refund on?
Marcy: Well we were thinking about taking a romantic trip to Paris.
Peggy: Oh, I've always wanted to go to Paris.
Al: Oh yeah Paris - where they hate Americans... where they won't let our bombers fly overhead, oh yeah, until they get invaded, and then they come crawling back, beret in hand, for us to bail 'em out - with "my" tax dollars! That's where your going??
Steve: No, no... we just said that... you know... to kid you. We hate the French.
Al: You know what I would do if I had a few extra bucks?
Marcy: Bomb the French?
Al: No, no, I was talking about a 'little' extra money.
Whose Room Is it Anyway? (0106) again
Al: "Oh, sure, our rights are not important? Anything a woman says is fine with us? Gee, when did men become such losers? It used to be so great to be a man. Women were there to please us. They'd look after the kids and we'd go out and have a good time. That's the natural order of things. What happened, Steve? I'll tell you what happened, Steve. Somebody told women they should start enjoying sex, too. That was the beginning of the end. Now they like it but it's work for us. Everything's work for us. It's this equallity thing, it's killing us. You know who I blame?"
Steve: "The French?"
[ Al nods his agreement ]
Johnny Be Gone (0113)
[ Al reads a an assembly manual ]
Al: "Ah! Here it is, er, Attention vous avez... Oh hell! More people we should have killed!"
[ He comes across another French instruction ]
Al: "Oh, my friends the French again".
Fair Exchange (0406)
Al: "A toast to the French. It's a foul little country but they sure do know how to write a check."
Look Who's Barking (0513)
[ Al is on the phone, trying to find the German chef Hans ]
Al: Listen, you French moron! We saved your cowardly wine soaked behinds in the war! In all the wars!! Every stinkin' war you've ever been in. Now you tell me where you're hiding Hans, before I... Hello!?!
[ He hangs up ]
They really are rude to Americans!
A Man's Castle (0515)
Al: ... running like a Frenchman from a cap gun.
All Night Security Dude (0516)
Spare Tire Dixon to Al: "I dropped you like third period French."
Looking for a Desk in All the Wrong Places (0605)
Al, to Jefferson: "She's got you running like a Frenchman in a thunderstorm."
The Mystery of Skull Island (0614)
News anchor: "Until further information is uncovered, scientists will continue to sift through the giant hole that was until yesterday the Republic of France."
England Show, Part 1 (0624)
Al at Speakers Corner: "Am I alone in hating the French?"
Crowd: "No!"
Al: "I thought not."
England Show, Part 2 (0625)
[ A family screams at the Bundy's and runs away ]
Peggy: "We're only Americans. Why'd they run?"
Al: "They must be French. It takes so little."
England Show, Part 3 (0626)
Upper-Unctonian: "We're not barbarians. We're not the French."
The Chicago Wine Party (0707)
A reporter about riots against a beer tax increase: As if they need to be told, all Frenchmen should stay in hiding.
Death of a Shoe Salesman (0710)
[ Al decides to take a spot to be buried next to Fuzzy McGee ]
Undertaker: Let me know if you DON'T want it. I hear Fuzzy is a big in France, I believed they called him "Le Grand Fuzz".
The Old Insurance Dodge (0724)
Peggy: Listen, Honey, I'm having a little trouble with the insurance company. Did you know that the French claim that the real Mona Lisa is theirs, just like we did?
Al: You know, it's a dark day when someone will believe the French over me!.
The Proposition (0726)
Kelly: "Mom, when you say 'we,' I hope you mean 'oui,' as in French for 'Hell yes we'll sell daddy and collaborate with the Germans.' Ergo, which is French for 'Yes take our country but please let us live to make our creamy sauces,' I say we take the $500,000 and bid daddy adieu, which is French for 'A deer,' 'A female deer.'
Legend of Ironhead Haynes (0821)
Al's voice booms out over the mountains: Don't eat the croissant!"
Legend of Ironhead Haynes (0821)
Commandment #2: It's wrong to be French.
Driving Mr. Boondy (0902)
Bud, to German Heidi: "Pretend like my pants are France and invade me!"
Business Sucks, Part 1 (0905)
Kelly: Some warbreaks out in some country I can't even pronounce.
Bud: That could be France!
Kelly: I said "country".
How Bleen Was My Kelly (1005)
[ Peggy tries to find someone who makes less money than a shoe salesman. ]
Bud: Check "French deodorant salesman."
Dud Bowl II (1009)
TV News Reader: Hundreds of organisations are claiming credit for the bombing of the Al Bundy Scoreboard, including The National Organisation of Women, The National Organisation of Fat Women and The Government of France.
The Agony and the Extra C (1019)
Peg: Al, I'm in Paris. Everyone here is just so rude and smelly. I'm thinking about you all the time.
T*R*A*S*H (1114)
Al: Well family, I'm off to fight the forces of evil.
Peggy: Mmm, that's nice dear.
Al: Hey! Will someone pay attention here, they're having me go out to fight horrible people - probably the French! You may never see me again!
Breaking up Is Easy to Do, Part 1 (1116)
Peggy: Why won't you go to therapy!?
Al: Maybe it's 'you' who don't know 'me'! Because If you knew me, Peg, you would know there are certain things I do not do:
I do not floss, I do not eat vegetables, I do not like French Pastry, I do not like the French...
Damn Bundys (1120)
[ Al is playing "hang-man" with Napoleon in Hell. ]
Napoleon: Could it be the letter "P"?
Al, laughing: Hang-man, I win! It's "French fries" you idiot! You're not too smart, are you Nap?
[ Nap puts his hand in his coat, then Al puts his hand in his pants. ]
Huh? Jefferson founded the Republicans. Adams was a Federalist, along with Washington, although Washington had a better rapport with Jefferson than he did Adams. Jefferson wanted to support the French during their revolution, but Adams accurately foretold the Regin of Terror that was going to follow. They both served as ambassadors in Paris, but Jefferson was decidedly more in favor of riding the coattails of the French Revolution to offset the British. Adams correctly determined that our future belonged with expanding trade with the British and establishing a working relationship with them, and that the French were not to be trusted.
The Reign of Terror eventually claimed the freedom of one of the heroes of the Revolution - LaFayette...
Interesting. Though, Hamilton was a real loose cannon. He reminds me of the Bob Barr of the left - yeah, he called himseld a Federalist, but he wanted more power given to the presidency than anyone was comfortable with. Barr was a favorite Republican during Whitewater, but now he seems way too libertarian for a lot of people.
But you're right - it's very similar...
Oh wait, you said John AdamS....never mind....
Bravo, great post!
Ah, France had fallen low--so low! For more than three quarters of a century the English fangs had been bedded in her flesh, and so cowed had her armies become by ceaseless rout and defeat that it was said and accepted that the mere sight of an English army was sufficient to put a French one to flight. --Mark Twain Personal Recollections of Joan of Arc
Thanks I missed that one.
I agree about Jefferson. My opinion of him changed also. Plus he was very petty about a lot of things, and would write, anonymously, in the pamphlets about Adams being a monarchist and king lover.
Ben Franklin also.
He Also Hated the French
By Amity Shlaes Published March 15 2005
Is the US still at war? Fighting as vague a conflict as the war on terror is hard, polarizing citizens and rendering difficult Washington's decisions about civil liberties at home. Washington is also preoccupied with sustaining its alliance with London. The US is aware that Britain may eventually opt for the Eurosphere over the Anglosphere. But these tensions are not new, as James Grant points out in a new biography of John Adams, America's second president. Compare the Adams presidency to the current one and several truths emerge.
The first is that quasi-wars split electorates more sharply than traditional wars. Napoleon Bonaparte was not about to sail into Boston harbor. Still, in the late 1790s, France's Directoire -- the latest in a series of increasingly extreme regimes -- was granting privateers license to attack foreign ships. In 1797 French corsairs intercepted more than 300 American merchant vessels. At what point, the young US debated, do such acts of violence become war? Like President George W. Bush, who created the Department of Homeland Security, President Adams created a government department to handle the new brand of conflict: a Department of the Navy.
The uncertain status of the Franco-American relationship polarized America's two big parties. Thomas Jefferson and his Republicans refused to vilify the French, whom they knew, after all, as fellow revolutionaries. Adams and his Federalists viewed the pro-French Republicans as reckless -- much in the same way that Realpolitiker view the Bush administration's nation-building as reckless. Sounding for all the world like Henry Kissinger, Adams wrote of the Jeffersonians that by "their King-killing toasts" as well as "their everlasting brutal cry of tyranny, despots and combinations against liberty" the Jeffersonians might "involve us in a war with all the world". Adams feared the US might go the way of France. To forestall another revolution, Congress passed the Alien and Sedition Acts.
Under the Sedition Act the president might unilaterally imprison or deport anyone he deemed dangerous. The Jeffersonians charged that the laws were designed to put Jefferson and his allies down -- true. Anti-Adams newspapermen were jailed for libel. Then, as today, both parties lost their cool. In words worthy of Michael Moore, Jefferson called the measures "an experiment on the American mind to see how far it will bear an avowed violation of the Constitution".
Still, to say the nation endured a Federalist Reign of Terror is to exaggerate. Adams expelled no one. There was no guillotining.
The second truth that emerges when we glance back at the Adams presidency is equally relevant. It is that, when the cause is a moral one, the US usually wants Britain for a partner. Adams, recall, had been a revolutionary: he led the struggle to spare the people of Massachusetts from the "serpentine wiles" of Britain's colonial governor, Thomas Hutchinson. Yet he also loved the rule of law. In 1766, a Falmouth, Massachusetts man named Richard King defended the British on the Stamp Act; a crowd burst into his home and destroyed it. Adams defended King, writing to his wife Abigail that "these private mobs, I do and will detest".
In Adams' view, the godless French revolution shared "not a single principle" with the American one, the latter in its essence a Protestant event. Equally off-putting to Adams was the cynical fashion in which the French monetized diplomacy. (They in turn regarded him as naive.) Foreign minister Talleyrand's demand that US emissaries pay £50,000 for face time with him disgusted Adams. That disgust had something in common with the American disgust at the UN oil-for-food scandal of today.
By 1785 Adams found himself in a room with George III, arguing that Britain join the US in restoring "the old good Humour between People who, though separated by an Ocean and under different Governments, have the same Language, a similar religion, and Kindred Blood".
The US, through Adams, reconnected with Britain -- and that connection was to a good measure a religious and moral one. Their common culture was born in absolutism: the Puritans who were Adams' forefathers hanged Quakers. But that same culture evolved to include religious tolerance. After the revolution Adams helped to consecrate the first American bishops of the Episcopal Church.
Within a generation Britain and the US would be at war again -- the war of 1812 -- but in retrospect that conflict seems an interlude in a long conversation about government and morality. The most important outcome of that relationship was the end of the Atlantic slave trade. Britain's abolitionist salons made a deep impression on Adams' New England.
The point here is not that the US and France are always at odds, or that war policy is all we should remember Adams for. Bond traders will find the fact that he saved his insolvent government by promoting its junk bonds in Europe more relevant. The point is that our modern diplomatic strains are part of a pattern. Foam-mouthed politicians, uncertain wars, France-hating, US courtship of Britain: as Adams' life makes clear, we have been here before.
The author is a columnist with the Financial Times.
Copyright © 2005 Tech Central Station - www.techcentralstation.com
LOL, I think Mortisha was French.
Or was that the Munsters, I can’t remember.
Oops. Jefferson didn't found any political party. In fact he was rather adamantly opposed to political parties and wanted to ban them in the Constitution. Jefferson's supporters finally convinced him to join the Democratic Republicans saying he couldn't possibly be elected and defeat the Federalists without a party affiliation. Sound Familiar?
If you want to give any President credit for founding the Republicans, it would be Abraham Lincoln. By abandoning the Whig party and getting himself elected President as a member of the fledgling Republican party, Lincoln propelled the GOP into serious political status and consequently nailed shut the Whigs' coffin.
Washington didn't like them much either, but he kept it private.
Ah...an anti-American loyalist/Euro-identity thread.
It is fun to watch all of you Europeans in this thread ganging up on your French neighbor, though.
In the French, what is not to hate?
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