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Stories of the Week: ACLU concerned about 'pervasive' LDS presence
Salt Lake Tribune ^ | 3/13/2005 | Tribune Staff

Posted on 03/13/2005 7:11:33 AM PST by Excuse_My_Bellicosity

MARTIN'S COVE SUIT

Charging the federal government has allowed the LDS Church to create a "state-sponsored sectarian religious enclave" on public land in southwestern Wyoming, the American Civil Liberties Union brought suit Wednesday to revoke a lease giving the church control over a historic pioneer handcart disaster site.

The ACLU, Western Land Exchange Project and four Wyoming residents are suing Interior Secretary Gale Norton and Bureau of Land Management Director Kathleen Clarke to overturn a lease of 933 acres of federally owned land known as Martin's Cove to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints for rent of $16,000 annually.

The 25-year lease signed last year gives the church management authority over visitors to the historic site and as a result, the suit claims, created an "LDS presence" that is "pervasive, unavoidable and unremitting."


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Utah; US: Wyoming
KEYWORDS: aclu; churchandstate; lds; martinscove; mormons; turass
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I'm not a member of the LDS church myself, but I'm a lot more worried about the prevalence of illegal aliens, Hispanic gangs, and meth addicts than LDS church people, call me crazy.
1 posted on 03/13/2005 7:11:34 AM PST by Excuse_My_Bellicosity
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity
You can add environmental activists to that list. they will not stop until there is a grizzly bear and pack of wolves in every yard, and every one is forbidden to drive anything with an engine.....except of course themselves to get to their hiking spot.
2 posted on 03/13/2005 7:16:12 AM PST by midwyf
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity

Cholera, childbirth, Indian attack, drowning at river crossings, accidents even cannibalism. There were lots of ways for emigrants to die on western trails in the 1800's. However, mother nature was perhaps the most efficient killer of all. The largest, single disaster ever recorded on the Mormon Pioneer Trail, befell two parties of Mormon converts who were pulling handcarts in the late fall of 1856, and this time, it was weather that was the grim reaper.


http://www.tourwyoming.com/articles/handcart.htm


3 posted on 03/13/2005 7:17:45 AM PST by razorback-bert
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To: midwyf

"Historic pioneer handcart disaster site"? What, Laurel 'n' Hardly railroad chase scenes filmed here?


4 posted on 03/13/2005 7:18:49 AM PST by MoralSense
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity

This is interesting. After going after small churches and medium sized towns and school districts, the ACLU feels strong enough to take on the LDS Church. I'm no huge fan of the LDS but this time the ACLU may have bitten off more etc. Smack down time.


5 posted on 03/13/2005 7:18:57 AM PST by Mercat (smeeeeee)
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity
I'm more concerned about perversive 'pervasive' ACLU presence
6 posted on 03/13/2005 7:20:53 AM PST by null and void (Check Horsel Commons...)
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To: Mercat

Sounds good to me, I'd like to see the ACLU get cracked a good one.


7 posted on 03/13/2005 7:21:16 AM PST by Excuse_My_Bellicosity (Please leave a message after the burp....)
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Comment #8 Removed by Moderator

To: Mercat; Excuse_My_Bellicosity
After going after small churches and medium sized towns and school districts, the ACLU feels strong enough to take on the LDS Church. I'm no huge fan of the LDS but this time the ACLU may have bitten off more etc. Smack down time.

I'm not a fan of the LDS, either, as their religious beliefs are contrary to mine; however, my personal experience with those who are of that faith are, generally speaking, extremely positive as concerns family and values and my children became friends, with my blessings, with numerous Mormons. I also think the ACLU has bit off more than it can chew this time and I hope they're more than smacked down by the LDS....I hope they're smacked out of the ball park.

9 posted on 03/13/2005 7:26:34 AM PST by nicmarlo
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To: Mercat

They have no chance, especially in the west. The LDS church is very rich and would take the ACLU to town in my opinion.


10 posted on 03/13/2005 7:31:23 AM PST by zkbeta51
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To: zkbeta51
You got that right and I don't think they will mind spending a bit of it to grind the ACLU under their heel. Whoever thought this little boondoggle would go over will be regretting the day they got this bright idea. The sight is a memorial and education center for the LDS who pushed the hand carts from the Midwest to Utah. Look at a map that's a long way from Missouri to walk. 966 acres give it to them. This sight is just as meaningful to the LDS as a Native American burial grounds are to them. I doubt that there is anything there that can't be found in the next thousand acres. This is just the ACLU and 4 Wyoming citizens with chips on their shoulders.
11 posted on 03/13/2005 7:45:57 AM PST by MKM1960
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity
The 25-year lease signed last year gives the church management authority over visitors to the historic site and as a result, the suit claims, created an "LDS presence" that is "pervasive, unavoidable and unremitting."

The history of that area of the United States is inextricably bound up in the history of the LDS Church. There is no way to know that history without its LDS component. What happened at Martin's Cove is part of the rich tapestry of American History. If the LDS component of the history is taken out, about all that is left is geological history.

My wife's ancestors were part of the handcart company that suffered at Martin's Cove. Her great-great-great grandfather died on the banks of the Platte River near Casper a few days before the company reached Martin's Cove, and his frozen body was found by her great-great grandfather, then only seven years old.

When Brigham Young heard of the plight of the stranded companies he sent a rescue party by horseback through the blizzard and deep snows. Among this vanguard were several young men, about 19-20 years old, some of them sons of prominent LDS leaders. There at the Sweetwater River, ice cold and waist deep but not completely frozen over, these young men carried sick and weak members of the stricken party through the ice cold river waters on their backs, one by one, until all were safely on the other side. These young men then took ill and died from the exposure.

It is the telling of this history that the ACLU finds offensive.

12 posted on 03/13/2005 7:46:12 AM PST by JCEccles (If Jimmy Carter were a country, he'd be Canada.)
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To: Mercat

Let's hope that Salt Lake City and the Mormon Theater Armies CRUSH the ACLU into the ground!


13 posted on 03/13/2005 7:50:55 AM PST by SandRat (Duty, Honor, Country. What else needs to be said?)
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To: zkbeta51; lady lawyer
The LDS church . . . would take the ACLU to town in my opinion

The ACLU certainly hasn't picked patsy to bully, that's for sure.

There are some first-rate legal scholars in the LDS Church. Its ruling body, the Council of the Twelve, includes Dallin Oaks who was a fixture at the University of Chicago as one of the country's leading trusts and estates professors before serving as president of BYU and on the Utah Supreme Court.

One of Oaks' University of Chicago fellow alumni, Rex Lee, was Reagan's Solicitor General and argued more cases (and won more cases) before the Supeme Court than any other solicitor general in the history of the United States.

Oaks and Lee were instrumental in establishing BYU's law school (the J. Reuben Clark Law School, named for Coolidge's LDS undersecretary of state and author of the Clark Memorandum, a one of the most important and influential documents in US diplomatic history). Because of the exceptional quality of teaching there, and the high quality of its students, BYU's law school has vaulted into the upper tier of national law schools in less than 30 years. Almost every year a graduate of BYU's law school is selected by Scalia, Thomas, or Rehnquist to clerk on the Supreme Court.

As a result, the LDS Church has assembled a stable of superb legal thoroughbreds to fight for the traditional values that made this nation great.

14 posted on 03/13/2005 8:52:43 AM PST by JCEccles (If Jimmy Carter were a country, he'd be Canada.)
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity

HA! I'd live among one hundred Mormon folk for every one urban piece of liberal human debris...


15 posted on 03/13/2005 8:56:13 AM PST by riri
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity

The ACLU has bit off more than they can chew this time. LDS has money, and they are fighters. By, By, ACLU on this one.


16 posted on 03/13/2005 9:53:20 AM PST by Logical me (Oh, well!!!)
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity

I'm going to enjoy watching the ACLU being taken to task on this one. :)

This aint the boy scouts they're messin with.


17 posted on 03/13/2005 9:59:37 AM PST by FourtySeven (47)
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To: Excuse_My_Bellicosity
I've visited this site and found it extremely well done and moving.

The LDS presence is definitely there, as it totally should be, but not overdone in any way.

I wish the rest of our historical sites honored our ancestors and the faith that led them as the LDS people have done.

18 posted on 03/13/2005 10:23:06 AM PST by Red Boots
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To: nicmarlo

this isn't the first time the aclu went after the LDS church. A few years back they went after them because the purcased about a block of main street in SLC. The LDS church fought them to the end and won. Wonder if the ACLU is going for revenge.


19 posted on 03/13/2005 7:37:36 PM PST by The Chosen One
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To: The Chosen One
Wonder if the ACLU is going for revenge.

Well, looks like they're ready for more lickins! : )

20 posted on 03/13/2005 7:39:37 PM PST by nicmarlo
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