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'What have Americans ever done for us?'
The Times ^

Posted on 03/07/2005 8:30:32 AM PST by Alex Marko

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To: Alex Marko

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21 posted on 03/07/2005 9:42:37 AM PST by TASMANIANRED (Certified cause of Post Traumatic Redhead Syndrome)
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To: rudypoot
I don't think it's any coincidence, either, that after the November election, seeing that America has the resolve (even if only barely) to see the fight through, much of this starts happening.

I seriously doubt that if Kerry had won, that we'd be seeing any of this happen.

22 posted on 03/07/2005 9:45:48 AM PST by kevkrom (If people are free to do as they wish, they are almost certain not to do as Utopian planners wish)
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To: rlmorel

:) Excellent!


23 posted on 03/07/2005 9:55:09 AM PST by Convert from ECUSA (tired of all the shucking and jiving)
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To: tollytee

What I think of the French and the Dim-Dems are probably best not put in print in this forum. Let's just say I have about as much use for both as a submarine has use for a sun porch.


24 posted on 03/07/2005 9:57:04 AM PST by Convert from ECUSA (tired of all the shucking and jiving)
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To: elbucko
I was assigned to the US Mission Berlin (1983-87) and was present for Reagan's speech at the Wall. No one (Statre, CIA, DIA, etc.) at the US Mission even in 1987 ever predicted what happened just two years later. It was unthinkable.

The State Department wanted Reagan to delete the Tear Down this Wall statement because it was too confrontational and might damage US-Soviet relations even more. So much for listening to the experts

25 posted on 03/07/2005 10:03:45 AM PST by kabar
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To: tollytee

"On the point made about the dynamics occuring in the Middle East, I have already heard several Democrat pointy-heads on the sunday shows imply that our actions in the region have nothing whatsoever to do with what is happening there now. In fact, they imply that our actions in the last 3 years actually postponed this 'natural phenomena'. "

Lefties will never get it, because whether they admit it or not, they're all Marxists, and one of the fundamental tenets of Marxism is that history IS inevitable, basically that whatever happens had to happen, so no individual or group of individuals really affects any outcome. And, a true Marxist will never allow any of his study of history to contradict this belief. It's not open to contradictions, because it is a RELIGIOUS belief.


26 posted on 03/07/2005 10:13:13 AM PST by walden
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To: kabar
So much for listening to the experts

Yes. However, Reagan was his own "expert". I do believe, and history proves, that Reagan knew the dynamics of the Soviet Union better than anyone in State, Defense and CIA/NSA. I understand that Nathan Scheranski (sp?) would agree.

27 posted on 03/07/2005 10:16:17 AM PST by elbucko (A Feral Republican)
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To: Convert from ECUSA; Alex Marko; All

One thing to keep in mind about Europe; its easily as polarized (in more than 2 ways too) as the USA. Currently, politically, for the most part, the European countries are now as if Bill Clinton were still in power here.

Imagine thinking of America as nothing but Clintoon, Hollywood, Ted Kennedy, Monica Lewinsky, the Million Man March, Planned Parenthood, and Ward Churchill--of coures its absurd. So too when we think Europe is nothing but Chirac, protesting Italians, Labour party idiots in the UK, German Green party weenies or neo-Nazis, or Islamic immigrant honor killers.... MOST Europeans are NOT these things and are as appalled by them as any FReeper.

I have European friends that are as conservative and sensible as the most Conservative Republicans I know. Unfortunately they don't control things (for the most part) over there now. Show some conservative tendencies and BAM, the European press will brand you as a Fascist (since there are a few still around) -- its just the way it is there. Slowly as the truth of Islamism in immigration sinks in, as well as the LONG TERM intelligence of American democratic strategies, I think (and hope) sensible solutions will be found--and not the usual historic European cateclysms of violence.

I'm just bringing this up so that we don't slander the good and friendly Europeans with the bad (and stupid) anti-American ones.


28 posted on 03/07/2005 10:23:34 AM PST by AnalogReigns
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To: elbucko
However, Reagan was his own "expert". I do believe, and history proves, that Reagan knew the dynamics of the Soviet Union better than anyone in State, Defense and CIA/NSA. I understand that Nathan Scheranski (sp?) would agree.

I don't think Reagan knew the dynamics of the Soviet Union better than the so-called experts. He certainly did not have the same grasp of the details. What Reagan did have was the vison and a powerful idea that reasonated throughout Eastern Europe and the Soviet Union. I was stationed in Poland during the Solidarnosc days and martial law. Reagan's evil empire appellation for the Soviet Union struck a very responsive chord among the Poles, who considered the Pope and Reagan their heroes.

Sometimes the experts get so emeshed in the details that they don't see the forest for the trees. One man with a vision can change history. I was in Berlin when Natan Sharansky was released. When he was released on Glienicker Bridge, Sharansky rode in Ambassador Burt's car to Templehof. He received a telephone call from Reagan while in the car. People lined the route cheering and waving to him. Sharansky asked Burt if he could wave back. Burt responded that he could anything he wanted. He was a free man now. I got to shake his hand at Templehof. It was hard to believe that this little man could cause the Soviets to tremble just because of his ideas.

29 posted on 03/07/2005 11:15:39 AM PST by kabar
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To: kabar
I don't think Reagan knew the dynamics of the Soviet Union better than the so-called experts. He certainly did not have the same grasp of the details.

Respectfully, I beg to differ. As a Californian who was aware of Reagan from his first "Goldwater" speech and having the privilege of listening to his weekly radio broadcasts in his "out years" of the 70's, Reagan was no mental lightweight. He knew what the experts knew and thought, he just didn't agree with their conclusion and rightly so. From putting Pershing II missiles in Europe, to increasing the gold production of Canada (Brian Mulrooney) and of South Africa, and oil production of South American countries, Reagan began his systematic, economic, destruction of the Soviet Union. It was purposeful, it was deliberate, as was his rhetoric and it was effective. Historians will look back upon Reagan's policies as being as every bit as masterful as Alexander's sword being the solution to the Gordian Knot. I think Sharansky would agree.

30 posted on 03/07/2005 11:55:01 AM PST by elbucko (A Feral Republican)
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To: elbucko
Reagan was no mental lightweight

Nobody every said he was. My point was that the experts could run rings around him in terms of the details. Many were fluent Russian speakers, knew the intricate workings the Poliburo, names of the dissidents, history, etc. What Reagan brought to the table was an overall vision and the determination to carry it through. He believed in the power of his ideas.

No great leader needs to get down into the weeds and learn all the details. That was Carter's problem. He spent time scheduling the WH tennis court.

I have great admiration for Reagan. I served on four Presidential advance teams supporting his visits to Rome (twice), Bitburg, and Helsinki. I saw his management style up close. He was not afraid to delegate authority and had great confidence in his staff. He had some very good people working for him.

31 posted on 03/07/2005 12:03:57 PM PST by kabar
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To: Convert from ECUSA
But what would those Eurabians be living under if D-Day had never happend?

or


32 posted on 03/07/2005 12:05:52 PM PST by Polybius
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To: Polybius

You've got that right! But too many of them seem to forget!


33 posted on 03/07/2005 12:27:25 PM PST by Convert from ECUSA (tired of all the shucking and jiving)
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To: kabar
It was always the express goal of the Bush Administration to change the regime in Baghdad, precisely because of the opportunities for democracy it would open up in the rest of the Arab world. George Bush understands the simple but historically demonstrable thesis that freedom is not only the most basic of human rights, but also the best way to ensure that nations do not go to war with each other.

Incredible article, as are many this last two historic weeks.

FREEDOM!

34 posted on 03/07/2005 12:53:07 PM PST by AFPhys ((.Praying for President Bush, our troops, their families, and all my American neighbors..))
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To: Alex Marko

This is one heck of an article! Great read!


35 posted on 03/07/2005 3:13:51 PM PST by hershey
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To: rudypoot

Interesting analysis, esp. in regard to Pakistan. But...with other countries nearby achieving unheard of democratic freedoms, even baby steps, how long before Musharraf is forced to follow suit? You're dead on about Iran, too. Something will spark a revolution, some event, something to start Iranians thinking, 'Hey, why not us, too? What are we...Swiss cheese?' These certainly are amazing times.

It's quite amusing to see the dems on tv, twisting themselves into knots, trying to climb on GW's democracy/freedom bandwagon for the Middle East, at the same time not granting him one iota of praise. A little slimy double talk. No integrity, no ideas, no morals, no nothing.


36 posted on 03/07/2005 3:28:01 PM PST by hershey
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To: tollytee

Gee, I missed the Sunday shows. No loss, clearly. But the dem's latest spiel shouldn't be surprising. "Natural evolution of democracy". Sure. It would have happened faster and without a single loss of life if AlGore had been elected. Uh huh.


37 posted on 03/07/2005 3:30:02 PM PST by hershey
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To: tollytee

As to the removal of American wardead from France, that land is part of America, not France. I don't quite see how France would be able to deed the land back to themselves, but if they do, we'd either have to shoot invading French graverobbers, or decide our heroes would rest more comfortably back home.


38 posted on 03/07/2005 3:32:02 PM PST by hershey
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To: hershey
In the case of Iran there are people who think, 'why not us' but when they do try to stand up against the mullahs they are quickly crushed. This was mainly because all the fence-sitting Iranians never thought it would work. No one was willing to stick their neck out for something they thought was futile. But that was back during the status quo era. The Iraqi elections showed the Iranians that yes, there is hope. There is a chance for change and the mullahs are not infallible. The Iranian regime is walking on eggshells and they know it. Who knows, maybe that 'trigger event' is when the mullahs reveal they have a nuclear weapons program.

Only time will tell but I worry if we can afford to wait.

39 posted on 03/07/2005 4:08:58 PM PST by rudypoot
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