Republicans allege 737 illegal votes in governor's election (GOP gets what it deserves)

Seattle Post -Intelligencer ^ | REBECCA COOK

[DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet]

Well, Luis - I vote a straight Republican ticket, I campaigned for Dino Rossi, and I'm involved in King County politics.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you're telling me I deserve to be screwed over by lawbreaking Democrats because I didn't do enough.

In this country, even those in power are supposed to be held accountable to the law. I don't think it's right to blame the victims of the crime for the circumstances under which the crime was committed.

[Luis Gonzalez]

You did everything that you could do, but face it, you live in a Democratic controlled State. I live in a Democrat-controlled County, the biggest DNC numbers in Florida always come out of Broward County.

You have to break their hold however you can, but it must be resolved internally, not by calling on the force of the Federal government. This idea that the Feds need to be called in on account of a few hundred bogus votes (737 votes out of over 2 million) is just leftist sounding.

There is no way to assure a perfect election, where no one who isn't supposed to vote votes, after all, human nature still is a factor, and humans make mistakes.

"The victim"?

Unfortunately, we can't win ever place.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"I don't know if the people of Washington are jumping up and down protesting it but they obviously think they have an illegitimate governor."

we just went through four years of people jumping up and down because they thought that we had an illegitimate President.

Sh$t happens, and the system isn't perfect; you can't expect freedom to be devoid of flaws.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"They are bad laws and they do not have to be unconstitutional to be repealed."

The Washington legislature, the duly elected representatives of the people of the State wrote and enacted these laws in accordance to their State's Constitution.

Now, when the Courts overthrew the Texas anti-sodomy laws, which side where you on?

The side that said that laws duly enacted by the elected representatives of the people in the State of Texas shouldn't be overturned by the Federal government, or where you on the side of the people who said that anti-sodomy laws were bad laws, and in spite of the fact that they were not unconstitutional, they needed to be repealed?

How about Proposition #187 in California?

Where you on the side that wanted the laws approved by the people and passed by the legislature to stand, or the side who said that Proposition #187 was a bad law and needed to be repealed?

[bilhosty]

This is ridiculous Luis. Of course the Federal Government has the right and even the obligation to protect the peoples right to vote. And to insure the legitimacy of elections especially when Federal officers are elected. And to do so is in accordance with our FEDERAL Constitution. Apparently existing federal laws were violated in washington and in other states and as such the Federal government should enforce it's own laws against vote fraud. In addition the motor voter law I mentioned is a Federal law and as such only the Federal government can repeal it. Which incidentally were made by the duly elected representatives of the United States Government in according to the Constitution of the same. The first duty of the government is to defend the peoples rights and security and freedom's and it's own constitution. Obviously the state government in Washington is not doing it. And as such the Federal Government should step in. The examples you have stated have nothing to do with the public's right to vote being taken away. They are also examples of Judges deciding instead of the people's elected representatives which include the people we elect to Congress and the Presidency. Don't be an ideologue Luis. This is important,

[DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet]

Thank you. This conversation is unbelievable.

[Luis Gonzalez]

Whatever...call in the Feds, I'll stand with another American who seemed to agree with me.

"Government is not a solution to our problem, government is the problem." -- Ronald Reagan

[Luis Gonzalez]

"Of course the Federal Government has the right and even the obligation to protect the peoples right to vote."

Someone's right to vote was violated?

Am I now talking to Jesse Jackson?

"And to insure the legitimacy of elections especially when Federal officers are elected."

Correct me if I am wrong, but these laws are already on the books, are they not?

"Apparently existing federal laws were violated in Washington and in other states and as such the Federal government should enforce it's own laws against vote fraud."

Now, wait a minute.

The premise of this thread is that you claim that the GOP should enact laws to protect the integrity of elections, yet now, you are saying that those laws are already written, and that they should be enforced.

Here's your quote:

"The GOP has held congress for 10 years. Also the Presidency for 4 years. If they haven't passed legislation to protect elections from Dem vote fraud, then they deserve everything they get."

So, you think passing more laws is the answer here?

But the existing laws didn't stop this from happening..why would MORE laws stop it?

"If they don't send prosecutors around the country to prosecute these scandals then they deserve to have every election stolen from them in 2006 and 2008. It is time now for action."

That's the job of Washington State...not the Feds.

"...especially when Federal officers are elected..."

What "Federal officers"?

Are you talking about people elected to Congress?

Those are STATE Senators.

[bilhosty]

Yes Luis, the rights of all the people who voted for Dino Rossi were violated. It may sound like something Jesse Jackson would say, but he is a phony. Some laws are on the books that need to be removed state and federal(same day registration and motor voter) because they facilitate vote fraud. Only the Federal Congress can end them all by the time of the next election. But also vote fraud is a federal law punishable by up to 30 years in jail and these laws need to be enforced and enforced aggressively. So it is really a matter of enforcing current laws, repealing other laws and coming up with new legislation to defend the right to vote, which is stolen by fraud. We need to revamp the whole system.

As to your comments about federal offices. I am referring to members of Congress and the Presidency itself if you remember these were on the ballots as well, and they are not state Senators. Surely you can understand the interest of Congress to protect these races as well as the jurisdiction that was plainly given to them by the US Constitution. read article 1 and section 4 below.

"The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators."

Obviously defending the peoples right to vote and elect their own leaders is in the jurisdiction of the Congress as mandated by our constitution and our funding fathers.

Do you really think that no laws can be made to protect our Democracy? Would you repeal the Patriot act? Don't you think that by requiring id at the time of registration and making sure that people who register other people are not paid for it would plainly help? Also making sure that their are adequate poll watchers,wouldn't that help? We Americans can do anything. We go to the moon. We defeat Polio. We stop Nazi's and the Soviet Union. I am sure we will be able to end vote fraud if we make up our mind to do it.

[bilhosty]

""Government is not a solution to our problem, government is the problem." -- Ronald Reagan"

That is right and the problem here is the Washington state government. Remember how President Reagan superseded state laws to raise the drinking age back to 21.

[Luis Gonzalez]

The Washington State government was elected by the people of Washington.

The people of Washington State need to take their government to task.

[rwfromkansas]

There is a hearing Feb. 4.

The GOP is doing a heck of a lot. Of course, you would find that out if you read beyond the lede.

[bilhosty]

The people of the United States also elected the Congress and the President. They elected them to defend their property their constitution their lives and their rights. It would be good if the State government of Washington defended the rights of their own people but that is not happening. The defense of the rights of the people needs to take precedence. The President was elected to "Preserve protect and defend the constitution of the United States" and so to should be all officers elected in this land federal and state. ]

Men have fought and died for those rights at Khe Sahn, Gettysburg, and Iwo Jima the Federal government took action to defend those rights at those places and many more. there is simply no reason why the government should not defend the rights of our people at the battle of Seattle. Also Detroit, Seattle,St Louis and Milwaukee.

Remember it was also the states rights arguments the Dems used to try to steal the election in 2000. Our Supreme Court struck that down. I guess you think Rhenquist, Kenned, O'Connor, Scalia and Thomas are flaming liberals from blue states as well.

The jurisdiction is plainly set for the in the Constitution of the United States and the principle of federal supremacy is expressed deliberately in McCullough vs. Maryland by our great conservative Chief Justice John Marshall.

Republicans have always been willing to use the government to defend itself the Constitution when the State and Local Governments have failed. Witness George Washington taking the field during the whiskey Rebellion. Abraham Lincoln during the Civil War. Remember the Republican congress that passed the amendments to the Constitution to end slavery and insure the right to vote. Most Republican congressmen voted to insure the rights of black people to vote after they had been denied by the states they live in (including my own state of Georgia.) Don't you believe that the federal Government should ensure black people the right to vote? Then why not ensure Republicans the right to vote and not seeing it destroyed by having their votes flushed own the toilet by Dem vote fraud?

I am glad to see that you are defending the limited role of federal government. But, there are other values as well. And, we surely need to reconcile conflicting values. And surely if we send men out to fight and die for those values then we plainly should do everything we can at home to defend them. Especially went the remedy is plainly stated in the Constitution of the United States.

[gortklattu]

You're right, this is a stste issue.

Let's see if the politicians do the right thing:

1. The republicans prove their case
2. The Democrat Governor resigns because she wasn't the real winner.

I won't wait for either to happen.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"Yes Luis, the rights of all the people who voted for Dino Rossi were violated."

It sounds like Jesse Jackson because it's the exact same bullshit that Jackson spreads...your rights are not violated because your candidate did not win, which is the leftist view of the past two presidential elections. Laws were broken, rights were not violated...no one has a "right" to have their candidate elected.

"Some laws are on the books that need to be removed state and federal(same day registration and motor voter) because they facilitate vote fraud."

In order for your statement to be true, you would need to prove that vote fraud did not exist prior to 1993.

Learn a lesson from the people of Arizona, if you want laws overturned, work to overturn them at the ballot box. The Voters Registration Act of 1993 is only subject to fraud IF THE STATE ELECTIONS SYSTEM IS POPULATED BY PEOPLE WHO ARE LIKELY TO COMMIT FRAUD.

You want to somehow make this the GOP's fault, it isn't. It IS the fault of the people charged with conducting elections in the State of Washington, and the people of the State of Washington MUST NOT STAND FOR THIS; they need to do whatever it takes, including taking to the streets, in order to stop it.

Time spent demanding a revote is positive time, time spent demanding that the Federal government fix the problem is not.

[Luis Gonzalez]

Your entire argument is just another "someone needs to fix this" argument.

Pathetic.

[bilhosty]

"Yes Luis, the rights of all the people who voted for Dino Rossi were violated."

"It sounds like Jesse Jackson because it's the exact same bullshit that Jackson spreads...your rights are not violated because your candidate did not win, which is the leftist view of the past two presidential elections. Laws were broken, rights were not violated...no one has a "right" to have their candidate elected."

Come, come, Luis, Jesse Jackson, whether he means it or not, also publicly prays to god. Does that mean that is also "bullshit". Jesse Jackson is a total fraud as you know. He uses these lines when it benefits himself but not on cases like this. If it makes you feel any better you can bet that Jesse Jackson is on the Dem side in this matter and this is the same side you are on. It is very true that no one has the right to have their candidate elected. That is not the point, the point is that everybody deserves to participate in a free and fair election where the votes are counted accurately and the true winner elected.

"Some laws are on the books that need to be removed state and federal(same day registration and motor voter) because they facilitate vote fraud."

"In order for your statement to be true, you would need to prove that vote fraud did not exist prior to 1993."

Why would I need to prove that fraud existed prior to 1993? These laws plainly encourage vote fraud and make it much easier then it was before. there plainly was vote fraud prior to 1993 and now thanks to these laws there very probably more.

"Learn a lesson from the people of Arizona, if you want laws overturned, work to overturn them at the ballot box. The Voters Registration Act of 1993 is only subject to fraud IF THE STATE ELECTIONS SYSTEM IS POPULATED BY PEOPLE WHO ARE LIKELY TO COMMIT FRAUD.

You want to somehow make this the GOP's fault, it isn't. It IS the fault of the people charged with conducting elections in the State of Washington, and the people of the State of Washington MUST NOT STAND FOR THIS; they need to do whatever it takes, including taking to the streets, in order to stop it."

That is right! This is very important and the Democrat officials in Washington are the problem. And I agree that the people of Washington should not stand for this and one of there tools is the one in our bill of rights that grants the right to "petition Congress for redress of grievance." It is as you say the fault of the people who run the government in Washington and as such they cannot be trusted to do what is right. The people must find redress where ever it can be found.After all the Constitution plainly give the power as follows.

"article 4.section1 "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government."

article 1 section 4 " The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators."

Acting this way is perfectly in the scope of proper Consitutional and Federal powers. It would be good if the local government did it. But, what is most important is that Justice be done.

[bilhosty]

"Your entire argument is just another "someone needs to fix this" argument.

Pathetic."

But someone does need to fix this. And the sooner it is fixed the better.

[Sprite518]

You are right! I agree its an outrage, and the GOP deserves what they get. Since they were so scared to pass some meaningful legislation that would preserve the integrity of our voting process?

[sasafras]

The GOP and Bush are whimps - they are elitists who care more about being liked by NYT and the manhattan types than hardworking law abiding citizens. Notice Bush has said nothing of this travesty and continues to push the criminal elements ripping our society apart by allowing illegal aliens to almost freely walk across our border. This is what we should expect from the RINOs in our party. Social Conservatives are the only reason that the GOP isnt out their demanding homosexuals have marriage rights or that babies be murdered at any stage of development.