Proposed I-69 truly mammoth (TEXAS)

The Associated Press ^ | an. 01, 2005 | Jim Vertuno

[Dubya]

AUSTIN - In what sounds like another tall tale told by a Texan, the Lone Star State has embarked on an audacious project to build superhighways so big, so complex, that they will make ordinary interstates look like cow paths. The Trans-Texas Corridor project, as envisioned by Republican Gov. Rick Perry in 2002, would be a 4,000-mile transportation network costing $175 billion over 50 years, financed mostly if not entirely with private money. The builders would charge motorists tolls.

But these would not be mere highways. They would be megahighways -- corridors up to a quarter-mile across, consisting of as many as six lanes for cars and four for trucks, plus railroad tracks, oil and gas pipelines, water and other utility lines, even broadband transmission cables.

Supporters say the corridors are needed to handle the expected NAFTA-driven boom in the flow of goods to and from Mexico and to enable freight haulers to bypass urban centers on straight-shot highways that cut across the countryside.

The number of corridors and exactly where they would run have yet to be worked out for the proposed I-69. But the Texas Transportation Commission opened negotiations Dec. 16 with the Spain-based consortium Cintra to start the first phase of the project, a $7.5 billion, 800-mile corridor that would stretch from Oklahoma to Mexico and run parallel to Interstate 35.

"Some thought the Trans-Texas Corridor was a pie-in-the-sky idea that would never see the light of day," said Perry, who has compared his plan to the interstate highway system, which was started during the Eisenhower administration.

But as the plan rumbles along in the fast lane, some have called it a Texas-size boondoggle. Environmentalists are worried about what it will do to the countryside. Ranchers and farmers who stand to lose their land through eminent domain are mobilizing against it. Small towns and big cities fear a loss of business when traffic is diverted around them.

Even the governor's own party opposes the plan. The GOP platform drafted at last summer's state convention rejected it because of its effect on property rights.

Perry is undeterred. "I think it will be a model for future infrastructure construction in the world," he predicted.

The tolls would represent a dramatic departure for Texas, which has traditionally relied on federal highway funding from gasoline taxes to build roads. But supporters say the combination of tolls and private money would allow Texas to pour concrete at a rate that would not be possible through gasoline taxes alone. ONLINE: ww.dot.state.tx.us www.keeptexasmoving.com www.corridorwatch.com

[Smartaleck]

"the NAFTA import boom, shifted to ports in California where the chinese stuff come in."

No, just China crap, not Nafta.

Even so, some of that Asian freight is being re-routed through Mexico where it's still cheaper and faster to offload, put it on rail and bring it into the states. Strikes by the stevadores and outrageous wages being paid out there are making it so......guy gets $90.00 for carrying a clipboard and counting containers!

[Straight Vermonter]

I'm a Vermonter so I don't really have a dog in this fight but it seems to me that even if Texans never used this highway they would still get a great benefit from it. If all of the truck traffic on your current highways is shifted to I-69 would that not make your travelling easier?

If it kept the Mexican truck drivers of questionable competence off your highways is that not also a good thing?

[endthematrix]

What's wrong with private profit? It's what drives the Texas economy. What do you think the road is being built for?

[endthematrix]

Re: I got my fill of toll roads

Try Illinois. Our Rat Gov DOUBLED the tolls. Of course you could get an I-PASS RFID transponder that monitors when and where you go via the toll roads (which I hate) but I can't afford my values. I commute and it would cost me $1000 yr in tolls.

[HarryCaul]

There's nothing wrong with private profit, but there is something wrong with the government forcibly taking private property (via eminent domain, as mentioned in the article) and awarding that property to another private enterprise for profit.

This will be a pure case of good ol' boys making money from government connections, at the direct expense of private land owners

Either run the roads via public authority or let the private company purchase the property at whatever the owners wish to sell at.

Don't force the land from the hands of the citizens into the hands of government cronies.

[neb52]

"I'm a Vermonter so I don't really have a dog in this fight but it seems to me that even if Texans never used this highway they would still get a great benefit from it. If all of the truck traffic on your current highways is shifted to I-69 would that not make your traveling easier?

If it kept the Mexican truck drivers of questionable competence off your highways is that not also a good thing?"

Looking at the map of I-69, it tells me that this is nothing more than Canadian/Mexican companies wanting to move goods back and forth as easily and cheaply as possible, by staying on one transit system and bypassing many towns/cities. I really don't see any benefit for the US in this, but that depends on how many off and on access points there will be.

On a Macro level this looks great if you are the Federal Government. It makes foreign shipping easier to control. On a Micro level this could be very devastating by rerouting the flow of commerce. But that would depend on the amount of commerce that is just passing through like the State of Texas and the other states that are in the path of this "Corridor". To validate spending this much just to reroute out of state commerce, then the amount of traffic better be huge. But then again how does one collect taxes on the trucks and etc. that use this transit system. If they do not stop in any towns/cities. Then no taxes are collected, nor is any money made by local businesses.

Also taking Texas for an example. DFW is essentially a hub or were most of the traffic and commerce from the Coast or South pass through to then cross the Red or Sabine River. This would redirected that traffic away from DFW and Austin/San Antonio areas. It could be very economically devastating for these two large market areas.

A town's/city's economic impact is dependent on its access to main arteries of the flow of goods. You can research the changes starting with the railroad up to the invention of the airplane to see how once prosperous towns declined by the movement of goods changed to a different method.

[leadpenny]

Maybe not in this century but at some point the planet is going to say it has had enough concrete and asphalt poured on it's surface.

If it makes me an Environmentalist for saying that - so be it.

[neb52]

I wouldn't call you an Environmentalist, just common sense or Conservationist. Projects that we build should adhere to the land not the land to the projects. The "Moat" that is being built around Fort Worth by redirecting the Trinity is a perfect example. Rivers tend to go were they want, irregardless of where or how Man redirects them.I can see the Trinity redirecting itself right down through Downtown. :P

[endthematrix]

I'm no fan of eminent domain. In IL we are dealing with O'Hare expansion and a Peotone Airport. What private companies are you referring to?

[leadpenny]

I wouldn't call you an Environmentalist . . .

. . . but I've composted yard and kitchen waste since I don't remember. And I'm an avid birdwatcher. Rush would probably call me an 'environmental wacho.'

Here in Nothern Virginia, they are about six years into an eight year project called the Springfield Interchange. When completed it will be about 26 lanes wide and will incorporate the Beltway, I-95, I-395, and associated HOV lanes. I believe you'll need a pilot's license for one of the 'flyovers.' Some projections show continued gridlock for both rush hours when it is all completed.

[neb52]

"I'm no fan of eminent domain. In IL we are dealing with O'Hare expansion and a Peotone Airport. What private companies are you referring to?"

Specific I think he is refering to the companies that want to build the toll roads. In general many businesses in "Redevelopment Zones" are handed for free or very cheap land that was taken via eminent domain by the local governments. That isn't as big as a problem in Texas as I hear it is in other Northern States.

[neb52]

LOL! I think many conservatives knee-jerk and run away at the mention of conservation or environmental. This is due to 30-40 years of abuse by the Wacko's that base their environmentalism on junk science and uneconomically policies. It was OK until Clinton became President and then they got a strong voice in the Federal Government. Now its hard to dislodge them. Funny thing is, my Best Friend who is a traditional Democrat(not a Marxist) is a Concrete the World member. He is also a Bush Hater. Essentially he is a walking paradox since most Bush Haters are from the Marxist side of the Democrats Party and most Democrats are "Way To" environmental.

[leadpenny]

Very true. Each of our two main parties co-opt (is that the right word?) certain issues over time. Years later memories of 'why' are lost on the general population. A hundred years ago, maybe less, the family farmer would have been considered the prime environmentalist if there had been such a popular word.

When someone asks me if I am conservative or liberal, I alway answer with a question, "Does one hand clapping make a sound?" Give me the issue and I may be able to tell you where I stand. For now, the parties try to put us in various boxes and I refuse to go along.

[tbird1]

ping

[deport]

I didn't know it was a planned extension of the same I-69 in my state.

---

Good, bad or indifferent, the road systems have to be continually upgraded to carry the increased traffic load. And part of this system upgrade is designed to carry the load expected from NAFTA, assuming it materializes over the years. If you look a the TTC web site you'll see there are four major entry points from South America coming through Texas.... That is what this proposed system is about here in Texas.

I'm not sure what the final outcome will be. You'll read a lot of discussion back and forth but in reality it's mostly in the talking stages for much of it at this time. The existing Interstate system will remain in place so those that don't want to use the TTC system will still have that system to use. However parts of the Interstate system here in Texas is very congested and needs relief via some method.

Whether people will pay tolls to travel the roadway is yet to be determined. But the fact that tolls are to be charged doesn't force those that don't want use the roadway to do so.

Cintra just recently proposed to invest some $7.2 million in the I-35 phase of this system..

[KC_for_Freedom]

As a winter texan, I think the new roads are a good idea. Texas is well known to travelers as a highway friendly state. Don't know about tolls but with 5 axels I will get hit harder than cars, but I also doubt the roadway will be open very soon, who knows where I will be by then. But I would avoid LA and stay on good highways.
BTW, Texans are still free of an income tax, and toll fees if used on roads and not poured into the general fund are a form of taxation that at least makes sense.

[deport]

I also doubt the roadway will be open very soon

---

Correct... most of this is in early planning stages with lots of steps to complete before the first yard of concrete can be poured. My guess is that some of the roads will be built and others not. I think the overall project is pie in the sky wishing but some will come to fruition. Increased congestion over time on the roadways has to be addressed and this is a step in doing that.

I'm sure you have an interesting life style living out of a travel unit full time. I couldn't do that. I have a neighbor who's father retired, sold his home and lives full time in a travel unit moving were the urge takes him and his wife. I've also known some people that go south into Mexico around Guadalajara for about six months at a time... Cost of living is very low or so they claim.

[KC_for_Freedom]

Yes, some of our friends travel into Mexico. We have not yet, pets & firearms restrictions are a part of it. But you can get much of the reduced cost of living in the Rio Grande Valley.

I do love Mexico and we will eventually venture farther south. A good guide is "The Peoples Guide to Mexico". We have not missed our house yet, although our son is forced to find friends who will take him in when he does not want to visit his parents in an RV park. (And he doesn't) But we have had some great adventures and have met him in Las Vegas and Key West to have some adventures for him. The average age of our co-winter Texans is dropping, and we are having more fun as a result. The first several years we ran into more of our parents generation, but it is changing. We started with vacation camping, you never know. But some people must keep a home base. Our stuff is in storage and we don't have to worry about the homestead while we are away.

[SolidSupplySide]

Also keep in mind that this company is not exactly the Peace Corps - meaning that they do have their own agenda - which is profits

This kind of rhetoric would seem to be more at home on DU than FR.

[kittymyrib]

Rick Perry better find himself a gig in D.C. because he will lose if he runs for re-election. He's really a Democrat who loves any big-spending plan that will help his cronies. Every highway in Texas is down to one lane somewhere along its course, making travel in the state not only inconvenient but dangerous. I would like to know the number of fatalities caused by road construction in the state. And they NEVER finish a project. The addition of lanes to I-45 linking Dallas to Houston has gone on for the SEVEN years we have lived near Corsicana! You'd think the fat-cat construction companies would be ashamed of their perpetual rip-off of the taxpayers of Texas. It's the Texas version of Boston's Big Dig.