Posted on 12/09/2004 6:49:31 PM PST by mysonsfuture
On Hannity and Combs, Sean responded to the liberals keeping the declaration of independence out of the schools, by calling for parents to take thier kids out of government schools. Home school bump.
"Now, would you care to make bets on which kids from which schools will be running things in 20 years?"
Now why do you have to go and crash a perfectly good party? Hmmm.........? :)
I agree with you. We need to dismantle it. It's gotten way out of control. Here's what gets me. I'm shocked that all parents aren't dedicated. That's the biggest stunner.
I'm not for taking it apart. Whenever you take something apart you better have an excellent idea of how to get it back together again. I learned that when I was six years old and an antique mantle clock came into my possession via a well-placed chair.
It's not enough to say "I hate it, let's dismantle it." Anyone can say that. You have to have a plan for what you intend to replace it with...without a plan to replace something that is broken, it's not progress, it's vandalism.
But if you can't come up with a valid point to counter-act with.. bring in the straw man.
The difference between what I have stated here and socialism is that socialists want everyone to pay so that few can have power. They do so under the guise of everything is equal. I never said I want everyone to have the same education. I said I want everyone to have the ability to get a decent education. And I believe that every one of us benefits from and educated and skilled citizenry. And we do.
Because I have more money than many people do- I reserve my options to get the very best education money can buy for my kids. It will be better than many can afford- some will afford better than I can. That too is our system. I am not saying I would change that one bit.
I want most to pay so many can have personal power. Huge.. Huge difference. The American dream is given to you by poor people. I say let the poor people go get an education too. Socialists don't ever want people to better themselves or get smarter then they think they themselves are.
"Because I have more money than many people do- I reserve my options to get the very best education money can buy for my kids. It will be better than many can afford- some will afford better than I can. That too is our system. I am not saying I would change that one bit."
Are you one of those rich people that homeschool your children and laugh at the poor? One of those evil, conservative women that homeschool in your fur coat and tiara. Aren't you? :)
"It's not enough to say "I hate it, let's dismantle it." Anyone can say that. You have to have a plan for what you intend to replace it with...without a plan to replace something that is broken, it's not progress, it's vandalism."
You milktoast conservatives have run roughshod on the party long enough. It's time for us to take it over. :)
There is a benefit of home school that is not mentioned enough. When my boys interact with adults who don't know, often, the adults will compliment them on their manners and behavior.
Also, having a home with a mama and two able sons has allowed us to keep 90 year old Edward at home, when without that, he would have long ago been off to the care facility, and prolly died in six months.
The boys have been taught that serving Grandy is a part of our life. He's blind and needs to be led through the house now - from bed to toilet to rocking chair. The boys can do that.
He is still a good eater, and if he wants a cup of coffee, a baloney sandwich or some peanut butter and saltines, they can provide.
Academics is one thing. Learning that it is natural to take care of the helpless is quite another.
Uh-oh...
and just when I thought that Bill Buckley might invite me to the annual Christmas party.
Yep. You people disgust me with your Mercedes and your snobbish children. We're going to get you rich evil conservatives, if it's the last thing we do, lady! :)
How is life today?
:)
I'm in the subway about three or four months ago and this group of school kids get on. Three muslim girls with the headscarves, etc. and a couple of black girls. About three stops into the ride, the six or seven of them break into that "Hey Yea!" song -- the one that starts, "My baby don't mess around, because...." Now, maybe I'm naive, but I'd say the chances of them becoming radicalized by the time they finish high school are significantly less than girls that attend a fundi school.
My oldest son is in the process of designing something that he thinks will benefit all mankind. IT is a money tree. Teaching him how to temper charity and capitalism is a very fun interesting event.
They can do whatever they want. The problem with vouchers is that they are essentially government credits, and whenever government funds are used, the government has a say in how that money is spent.
Poor people are no more or less entitled to an education than anyone else. Why not let them homeschool? Why do they need education vouchers?
We have a Christian school in our church and we're looking to expand it in another area where we can reach more kids. The teachers don't get paid what government teachers do, but they are dedicated, hard working and loving. We always seem to run in the red so having vouchers would be a big plus for those who want to send kids to this school. We're cheaper than most but the quality of their education is tops.
You're missing the entire point.
If the government school systems were doing their job, there would be no demand for school vouchers, homeschooling or widespread demand for choice in schools. People would gladly put their kids in public schools! After all, they did for 150 years or so when secondary schools were decent places to send and educate growing children who you deeply care about.
Believe me. It is much cheaper and easier.
The Christian school movement (and later the homeschool movement) got started as a reaction against increasing secularization of teachers and curriculum, unionization (almost impossible to hold teachers and administrators accountable) and moral and educational decay of the public school culture. Parents saw bad things happening to their children. They wanted their kids to have the best education - not be put in a John Dewey straight jacket of PC indoctrination, Liberal cultural agendas and academic leveling as the norm, Their kids were essentially taken completely out of any semblance of parental control and supervision and put under those whom they grew to suspect had other than their best interests at heart.
American public schools were once either without peer or on a par with the very best public school systems anywhere in the world. Can anybody claim with a straight face today's public schools are by any measure even as good as decades ago even with the enhanced technology? Ask yourself, what happened about 40 or so years ago to change all this?
But, few want to "ask" the question. They would rather throw barrels of money at a monumentally failing system or blame concerned parents for pulling their kids out of these failed institutions mainly because they saw their kids being psychologically damaged and given a mediocre to poor education at best.
Sure, there are a few excellent public schools around, but they are mostly the exception not the rule. "Average" by 1950s standard is mostly unattainable today in even the best of public schools.
Today most schools are primarily educational warehouses cast to the lowest common denominator of standards as well as ersatz day care centers where so many kids go to get screwed up instead of educated. They are indocrination centers manned by Liberal ideologues who want to change the culture, not educate children to a high standard and make them independent thinkers.
When that changes, the concerned consumers will gladly return to the public schools. Not until.
"Madrassas" and "Wiccan" schools are entirely beside the point and are strawman arguments meant to divert concern over what has happened to our once great public school system.
I think you're great, no matter what they say about you, DBR. :)
I didn't mention the wiccan and fundie schools as strawmen. I mentioned them as an example of unintended consequences of vouchers.
What it boils down to is this: people want to educate their kids the way they want to educate their kids. And many of these people either cannot afford to pay for that kind of "custom built education" or resent paying for a system that they perceive as failing their children.
Now, where most people on this thread talk about and focus on eliminating a system they dislike, my point of view is, very simply: what kind of system will be replacing the old one and what the social, monetary and educational consequences of this new system.
In looking at what is proposed -- a decentralized, disparate and market-based system -- I don't see good things in store.
Now, I could be wrong -- I'm just some guy at the keyboard mouthing off. But so far none of the arguments have convinced me that I'm wrong.
Always remember, there is no free lunch.
Vouchers seem to be the fair thing. But there is poison in that cup.
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