Posted on 08/20/2004 9:10:09 AM PDT by blam
Prehistoric Desert Town Found in Western Sahara
Thu Aug 19, 2004 01:52 PM ET
RABAT (Reuters) - The remains of a prehistoric town believed to date back 15,000 years and belong to an ancient Berber civilization have been discovered in Western Sahara, Moroccan state media said on Thursday. A team of Moroccan scientists stumbled across the sand-covered ruins of the town Arghilas deep in the desert of the Morocco-administered territory.
The remains of a place of worship, houses and a necropolis, as well as columns and rock engravings depicting animals, were found at the site near the town of Aousserd in northeastern Western Sahara.
The isolated area is known to be rich in prehistoric rock engravings but experts said the discovery could be significant if proven that the ruins were of Berber origin as this civilization is believed to date back only some 9,000 years.
"It appears that scientists have come up with the 15,000-years estimate judging by the style of the engravings and the theme of the drawings," Mustapha Ouachi, a Rabat-based Berber historian, told Reuters.
Berbers are the original inhabitants of North Africa before Arabs came to spread Islam in the seventh century.
The population of Western Sahara, seized by Morocco in 1975 when former colonial power Spain pulled out, are mostly of Berber and Arab descent.
Fewer babies survive when there are environmental stresses. Each woman needs to have 2.1 children just to break even population-wise. Currently, much of the Western world is below this replacement rate. By 2050, if things don't turn around, the population will plateau and then begin declining. You seem to ignore reality in your calculations.
I'm not sure whether I'd more recommend
a vocabulary enhancement course
or
anger control classes.
Show me evidence that man used birth control for 300,000 years and the argument about western birthrates might have bearings. Otherwise, current birthrate is completely irrelevant.
Only an evolutionist would expect people to believe human population stagnated in a hunter/gatherer mode for almost 300,000 years. And left no evidence of civilization at all.
Without agriculture there is no civilzation.
Not of civilization, but there's a record. They left a record of very grudging progress that must have been invisible to those living at the time. No doubt you are unaware of the details, but I'm going to bed.
Don't be thick. Life was much more iffy 300,000 years ago. Human beings, regardless of their beliefs, are not the top of the food chain. In addition to predators, disease, malnutrition, whatnot, took their toll. If we were to extrapolate your calculations to other species on this planet, we should be up to our eyeballs in flies, rodents, and guppies.
15,000 years ago that area of North Africa was not a desert, there were rivers, lakes, savannas, a lot of wildlife to hunt -- all arable land and habitable. (so what's with the rant?)
Except that fossils that were Argon dated at 160,000 years old, were found with lots of tools. This article from Berkley says they knew how to exploit plants. Maybe by exploit they don't mean agriculture. But still.
They had tools. They would have been at the top of the food chain. War, famine, pestilence could serve as limits to their population growth. But then again, pestilence would be less in a less populated world with less travel. Famine would be less in a less populated world.
There is absolutely no reason to believe man would be limited in his population growth.
It's a lot easier to believe that the argon test was wrong (and we now know that new rock can test very old due to excess argon), than it is to believe that man made no progress for 300,000 years and left almost no record.
Spears are tools. Arrows are tools. Gathering is exploitation of plants. Agriculture is quite another thing.
Did they find the Sphinx plans?
Did they find the Sphinx plans?
Except that they all have predators. They have limited breeding grounds, they are killed by changes in weather, etc. Man with tools is the top of the food chain except for disease and parasites.
Sure without agriculture man would be limited by the food supply and periodic famine. But the earth is still capable of supporting a lot of men without agriculture, and we just don't see the record of lot of men having been around for 300,000 years.
Spears and arrows put you at the top of the food chain though.
It wasnt always a desert.
How does being at the top of the food chain equate to civilization? Maggots are higher than us on the food chain, followed, I suppose, by birds that eat flies, followed, I suppose, by plants that are fertilized by bird droppings.
Two things. We are not the top of the food chain. Ask anyone who's come up against a shark, tiger or bear. Secondly, unlike other species, we tend to kill others of our kind.
And, don't discount diseases, famine or parasites. The Black Death claimed a third of the European population in the 1300s and a 19th century famine in China claimed millions.
Hell, people are one of the biggest hindrances to population growth. Even if you discount the 100 million or so who perished in the last century, you've still got the millions slaughtered by the Huns, the Mongols, the Saracens, the Crusaders. Then you have the tens of millions of Native Americans who didn't survive contact with the Europeans and their diseases.
Like I said, don't let reality interfere with your calculations.
Perhaps, but IIRC, many of the earliest civilizations show evidence that some of the grain was fermented and therefore, it is assumed that the inhabitants of these early towns had alcohol. Also available to hunter gatherers as wine when fruit was in season. It is suspected by some, (myself included) that a part of the reason permenent settlements were started around agriculture was the ability to make intoxicating drink.
It equates to population growth as long as there is enough food. Unless there is war, pestilence, global flood, etc. Even then man tends towards population growth. 300,000 years of no growth, doesn't sound realistic.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.