Fateful flight: Pilot of Nagasaki atomic attack dies

Patriot Ledger ^ | Saturday, July 17, 2004 | CHRISTOPHER WALKER and DIANA SCHOBERG

[A.A. Cunningham]

Your panties, as well as your ignorance, are showing again, sugar.

[COEXERJ145]

Bump

[Joe Hadenuf]

I watched 'the Last Misson' on the History channel last night

That was outstanding.

[MEG33]

I salute him and all who served us so gallantly in WW2.

...AMERICA ..HOME OF THE FREE BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE.

[Law is not justice but process]

"bonesmccoy" is clearly so dug in on a position that is indefensible that he is hiding behind ad hominem attacks to divert attention from his lack of a logical response. It is clear from the responses of those who do not agree with "the boner" that we all are well versed in the facts of WWII history and have put substantial thought into our interpretations. Since our interpretations do not agree with those of "the boner," he calls us "pathetically uninformed." Our sin is not a lack of familiarity of the facts, but a failure to see things "the boner's" way.

The facts are clear: Japan started a war of conquest it was not able to finish. Japan showed no signs it would surrender without several more months of bloody war and brutal occupation of Southeast Asia. An invasion was most likely going to be required, and the death toll just of Japanese citizens probably would have greatly exceeded the casualty toll of the atomic attacks. There were strong suggestions the Japanese would have slaughtered several hundred thousand Allied POWs and civilian internees before admitting defeat. Faced with this, Truman acted correctly AND humanely in ending the war quickly through atomic warfare.

Was the attack on Japan a horrible example of war and destruction? Clearly yes. Did Japan reap what it sowed in Nanking, at Pearl Harbor, during the Bataan Death March, in the construction of the bridge on the River Kwai, and in the thousands of other atrocities the Japanese inflicted upon the civilians and military personnel of China, the U.S.A., the UK, Siam, Burma, Malaysia, etc.? Even more clearly, yes.

[El Gran Salseron]

I disagree with with you AND most of the posters on this thread.

I believe that in time of war that the TOTAL death and destruction of the enemy is the only answer. Definition: Take NO prisoners. Kill ALL enemies. Kill the offspring of ALL enemies. Kill the fathers and mothers who created and bore the EVIL. Kill their relatives. Kill their pets. Kill their farm animals, if any. You get the idea.

I am wondering, to this day, why we left ANY Japanese alive. I am puzzled as to why there is still an island in the Pacific named "Japan." It should be a desolate pile of radioactive ash or just more Pacific ocean albeit a bit shallow.

Likewise for Germany despite being of German extraction.

With my approach do you think that the Soviets would have considered entering into a cold war with us? I think not. They would have been shivering in their boots and 50 years of attempted Soviet world domination would have been eliminated.

If the USA would use my approach in the war on terror it would send a very strong message.....

Don't Eff with the USA.

Get a clue or maybe just surrdender now.....you'll be one of the first infidels they kill.

[ChevyZ28]

Both this post you sent to me as a response, and your previous post clearly demonstrates you have not fully studied the History of WWII in regards to the US and Japan fighting each other. I do not believe you fully understand the mind set of the Japanese at that point in time in history. Further I want to say, no matter what you think, I am not racially biased against the Japanese. I have had the distinct pleasure of knowing 2 Japanese people in my life, and have found them both to be very gracious and honorable people. The Japanese were no different during WWII than our Nation was during the Civil War. Our Nation was very misguided during the Civil War and so was Japan during WWII.

Yes the use of nuclear weapons was tragic, as was the the deaths of 250,000 men, women and children civilians. However, compare 250,000 deaths to the literally millions that were predicted to die in an all out invasion of not just Americans but Japanese as well. The Japanese Government did in fact plan to send literally millions of Japanese civilians armed with little more than garden rakes and hoes to attack soldiers armed with weapons of all sorts. THIS IS A FACT AS TRUE AS THE SKY IS BLUE.

The Japanese were not going to just admit defeat and surrender, nor were they going to at least leave the fighting to trained soldiers. They were going to send every able bodied man, woman and yes child in to combat without a gun. All you have to do is go to the Library of Congress and look through the old WWII documents, read news paper articles from the time, and watch the old videos from that time. If you do this, you will see everything I said about the Japanese Government's determination to fight to the last man, woman or child standing is true.

In closing, I agree the use of nuclear weapons was tragic. These weapons were rightly used to end an already long and bloody war that was promising to become far more bloody before finally and mercifully ending. I do not think anyone on our side realized just how powerful atomic weapons were until they were used the 2 times in Japan. I believe that is why we can say they have only been used 2 times in the history of war and combat. My sincerest and deepest prayer is that we never find ourselves backed in a corner to have to decide to use these weapons ever again.

[Fiddlstix]

R.I.P
Bump

[ChevyZ28]

Me thinks "the boner" would more appropiately be called "the stoner".

I just read his response to me a few seconds ago. I responded back. I think it is very clear "The boner" has either not studied the historical facts surrounding the decision to bomb Nagasaki and Hiroshima with atomic weapons, or does not understand the gravity of the situation that existed in that moment in time. Perhaps both are true. The Japanese went through a time during WWII much like our Nation did during Civil War times. They, like us, were very misguided.

[JockoManning]

Meg33 says,

AMERICA ... HOME OF THE FREE BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE


well put Meg.

[4.1O dana super trac pak]

BTTT

[Professional Engineer]

Bump

[tet68]

Well put, BMC's anti nuclear stance precludes any mitigating
use of those bombs.

Anyone who has studied the plans for Operation Olympic realizes that hundreds of thousands of innocent japanese would have committed suicide either by attacking our troops or by other means as they did on Okinawa, Tinian or Saipan.

IN ANY EVENT, THERE IS NO DOUBT THE JAPANESE OR THE GERMANS
WOULD HAVE USED THESE WEAPONS AGAINST US IF THEY HAD DEVELOPED THEM FIRST.

[Dark Knight]

I've heard that they have recently released more of the documents that show there was a major problem with Operation Olympic. Top Allied brass was planning for a defense strength of about 360,000 troops maximum in Kyushu. These secret documents show that Truman and his planners found that the Japanese defense forces had 579,000 in Kyushu. This included 10 combat divisions. The numbers were rising. This was in the summer, for a planned invasion on Nov 1. Operation Olympic forces totalled 770,000 including the Naval personnel that would not be going to the beach.

We had a planned invasion, that was roughly equal to the repelling forces on the ground. And they were armed, military forces, not farmers. The defense forces were three times the numbers planned on, and roughly equal to our own forces.

You make the call as Truman. You can:

1) Call the operation off. Hope that conventional bombing and the blockade will make a people with the will to defend their island beyond our our ability to predict their behavior will quit. Of course millions of Japanese will starve. Hundreds of thousands of their POWs may either starve or be killed.

2) Continue with the operation. Hope that we get "lucky" on a macro level. Iwo Jima was one for one. Hope the Japanese homeland will be less? Hundreds of thousands of Japanese military will die. Hundreds of thousands of Allied troops will die. The house to house fighting may still take place, with much smaller force on the Allied side than planned. We will have to use more conventional bombing and continue the blockade. Millions of Japanese may die, from starvation or war. Hundreds of thousands of Allied POWs may be starved or killed.

3) Upset everyone's apple cart. Use nukes. Make the Russians fear us. Take Patton seriously. Make the Japanese realize they are DEFEATED. With a big D. Make the Japanese realize that victory is not the goal, continued existance is. Of course the Japanese still did not have to surrender, but now we could have made more nukes by the time of Operation Olympic, and been able to use them tactically, if necessary.

Of course Truman made the right decision for our country. Japan sensibilities were not his worry. We won the war. Japan surrendered, Russia did not interfere, we did not have to do Operation Olympic. We've been respected (feared) by our "friends" and foes in the world for the last 60 years.

So what part of success are we arguing about?

DK

[Dark Knight]

Please, this is a forum of people that can take the truth. Go ahead, say what you really believe, don't sugar coat it! All kidding aside, I think we are going to be forced back into the bad old days of warfare. We've been in the "military does the war" mindset too long. Terrorism brings it back to the population, and we need to deal with that. I'm hoping our population can, but I'm not convinced we will. I just have one piece of advice though, don't mess with my cat. It would be bad! DK

[bwteim]

Ever read Japan's Imperial Conspiracy by David Bergamini?
If not, you might consider doing so.

[Archie Bunker on steroids]

I attended a conference with his son last year. I regret never reading his book.

[Basilides]

From August 6-14 my father was in a troop carrier in the Panama Canal on his way to Japan to be part of a first-wave paratroop strike force that would be dropped into a battlefield on one of the Japanese homeland islands AFTER a tactical nuke had been dropped there.

Thank God for the bomb...I would not be here if it had not been dropped strategically on civilian populations as opposed to being used later as a tactical battlefield weapon.

[Dark Knight]

It was not dropped on a civilian population, it was dropped on two cities that had heavy war industrial production, and Hiroshima even had an Army HQ in it.

I'm glad it stopped the war too. My uncle was driving the landing craft to those battles. He doesn't talk about it much.

DK

[DuncanWaring]

Dream on.

Are you naturally that stupid or do you have to practice?