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1 posted on 06/18/2004 9:55:46 AM PDT by xsysmgr
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To: razorbak
Its most startling conclusion is that the Inquisition was not so bad after all.

Nope, not so bad at all. And Hitler just had an off day.

2 posted on 06/18/2004 9:58:23 AM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: xsysmgr

Just read this. Wonder if it will get a bite from the Catholic bashers.


3 posted on 06/18/2004 9:59:12 AM PDT by RobbyS
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To: Coleus; Ippolita


4 posted on 06/18/2004 9:59:50 AM PDT by farmfriend ( In Essentials, Unity...In Non-Essentials, Liberty...In All Things, Charity.)
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To: xsysmgr

Good article. I have saved it.


6 posted on 06/18/2004 10:00:53 AM PDT by sauropod (Which would you prefer? "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall" or "I did not have sex with that woman?)
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To: xsysmgr
The invention of the printing press scared the hell out of the Catholic church. The church was no longer the only source of spiritual information for the people.

As a result, the inquisition was invented to insure that the people were obeying the teachings of the Catholic Church and were not being contaminated by reading the actual scriptures.

This is a sad part of your history.

7 posted on 06/18/2004 10:01:25 AM PDT by Hunble
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To: xsysmgr

Not so bad??? LOL a bit of denial there I think


10 posted on 06/18/2004 10:04:17 AM PDT by cyborg
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To: xsysmgr
"Compared to other medieval secular courts, the Inquisition was positively enlightened."

Maybe, but that doesn't change the fact that the focus was to force people to believe very specific things. If nothing else, I hope they learned that you can't force someone to believe something. You can only force them to pretend they believe.

13 posted on 06/18/2004 10:07:07 AM PDT by MEGoody (Kerry - isn't that a girl's name? (Conan O'Brian))
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To: xsysmgr
The Spanish defeated Protestant armies on the battlefield? Where? As I recall, the Spanish attempt to invade England ended rather badly, and Spain was never the same afterward.

Also, he fails to point out that the primary reason for establishing the Spanish Inquisition was to hunt out Jews who had converted to Christianity *under duress* and were still secretly practicing Judaism, and that the Spanish Inquisition was at one point condemned by Rome for its brutality.

15 posted on 06/18/2004 10:11:12 AM PDT by valkyrieanne
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To: xsysmgr
Thank you for posting this.  Excellent and enlightening article.
 

Owl_Eagle

" WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
DIVERSITY IS STRENGTH"


19 posted on 06/18/2004 10:21:16 AM PDT by End Times Sentinel (Meat, it's what you're made of.)
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To: xsysmgr

Interesting article.


22 posted on 06/18/2004 10:22:50 AM PDT by Logophile
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To: xsysmgr

Finally, some true history on the subject.

Historians have known this for years, but the popular culture has so embraced the Inquisition myth that the facts are of no relevence.


23 posted on 06/18/2004 10:25:35 AM PDT by Skooz (My Biography: Psalm 40:1-3)
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To: xsysmgr

Thank God for Martin Luther.


28 posted on 06/18/2004 10:28:53 AM PDT by Blzbba
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To: xsysmgr
From the perspective of secular authorities, heretics were traitors to God and the king and therefore deserved death. From the perspective of the Church, however, heretics were lost sheep who had strayed from the flock. As shepherds, the pope and bishops had a duty to bring them back into the fold, just as the Good Shepherd had commanded them. So, while medieval secular leaders were trying to safeguard their kingdoms, the Church was trying to save souls. The Inquisition provided a means for heretics to escape death and return to the community.

This is a lie on it's face as attested to by Lateran IV and the prodding of the Pope that led to the Constitution of Lombardy.

I'll repost here:

We excommunicate and anathematize every heresy that raises against the holy, orthodox and Catholic faith which we have above explained; condemning all heretics under whatever names they may be known, for while they have different faces they are nevertheless bound to each other by their tails, since in all of them vanity is a common element. Those condemned, being handed over to the secular rulers of their bailiffs, let them be abandoned, to be punished with due justice, clerics being first degraded from their orders. As to the property of the condemned, if they are laymen, let it be confiscated; if clerics, let it be applied to the churches from which they received revenues. But those who are only suspected, due consideration being given to the nature of the suspicion and the character of the person, unless they prove their innocence by a proper defense, let them be anathematized and avoided by all 1-intil they have made suitable satisfaction; but if they have been under excommunication for one year, then let them be condemned as heretics. Secular authorities, whatever office they may hold, shall be admonished and induced and if necessary compelled by ecclesiastical censure, that as they wish to be esteemed and numbered among the faithful, so for the defense of the faith they ought publicly to take an oath that they will strive in good faith and to the best of their ability to exterminate in the territories subject to their jurisdiction all heretics pointed out by the Church; so that whenever anyone shall have assumed authority, whether spiritual or temporal, let him be bound to confirm this decree by oath. But if a temporal ruler, after having been requested and admonished by the Church, should neglect to cleanse his territory of this heretical foulness, let him be excommunicated by the metropolitan and the other bishops of the province. If he refuses to make satisfaction within a year, let the matter be made known to the supreme pontiff, that he may declare the ruler's vassals absolved from their allegiance and may offer the territory to be ruled lay Catholics, who on the extermination of the heretics may possess it without hindrance and preserve it in the purity of faith; the right, however, of the chief ruler is to be respected as long as he offers no obstacle in this matter and permits freedom of action. The same law is to be observed in regard to those who have no chief rulers (that is, are independent). Catholics who have girded themselves with the cross for the extermination of the heretics, shall enjoy the indulgences and privileges granted to those who go in defense of the Holy Land. 4th Lateran Council, Canon 3

This followed the stance of Lateran 3 and the arm twisting of the Pope to get the kings to declare heresy a capitol offense. It wasn't the idea of the kings; but, of the church. The Constitution of Lombardy was the answer of Germany to the Vatican's constant harping on the issue. Yet you guys sit there and act as though it were the other way around when your own documents belie it. And let us not forget, the church was putting people to death for their beliefs long before the office of inquisition opened for business. It wasn't exactly a new idea.

36 posted on 06/18/2004 10:55:37 AM PDT by Havoc ("The line must be drawn here. This far and no further!")
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To: xsysmgr
By the mid 16th century, Spain was the wealthiest and most powerful country in Europe. Europe's Protestant areas, including the Netherlands, northern Germany, and England, may not have been as militarily mighty, but they did have a potent new weapon: the printing press. Although the Spanish defeated Protestants on the battlefield, they would lose the propaganda war. These were the years when the famous "Black Legend" of Spain was forged. Innumerable books and pamphlets poured from northern presses accusing the Spanish Empire of inhuman depravity and horrible atrocities in the New World. Opulent Spain was cast as a place of darkness, ignorance, and evil.

Hmm.. now why does this sound so familiar? Wealthy and powerful nation.... at war with those of another faith... winning militarily... so their enemy turns to propaganda about abuse in prisons...

41 posted on 06/18/2004 11:42:12 AM PDT by Snuffington
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To: xsysmgr

This is one of the best articles I have ever read on the Inquisition.

BTW, the primary target of the Inquisition was the clergy. In Mexico, for example, only one layperson, an Indian who refused to stop acting as what would be similar noawdays to a "santería" priest, was put to death by the Inquisition. The rest were all clergy, and they were punished for things ranging from wilfully teaching false doctrine - to having enslaved or sexually abused Indians.


91 posted on 06/18/2004 2:05:13 PM PDT by livius
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To: xsysmgr
Black Legend- from Encyclopedia Britanica

Spanish Leyenda Negra term indicating an unfavourable image of Spain and Spaniards, accusing them of cruelty and intolerance, formerly prevalent in the works of many non-Spanish, and especially Protestant, historians. Primarily associated with criticism of 16th-century Spain and the anti-Protestant policies of King Philip II (reigned 1556–98), the term was popularized by the Spanish historian…

103 posted on 06/18/2004 2:53:16 PM PDT by Porterville (Fight Communism, vote Republican- and piss on france)
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To: xsysmgr
To understand the Inquisition we have to remember that the Middle Ages were, well, medieval. We should not expect people in the past to view the world and their place in it the way we do today.

You know, I bet Thomas F. Madden would be among the first to decry moral relativism.

120 posted on 06/18/2004 3:23:15 PM PDT by edsheppa
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To: xsysmgr
But in recent years the Inquisition has been subject to greater investigation. In preparation for the Jubilee in 2000, Pope John Paul II wanted to find out just what happened during the time of the Inquisition's (the institution's) existence. In 1998 the Vatican opened the archives of the Holy Office (the modern successor to the Inquisition) to a team of 30 scholars from around the world

This doesn't exactly sound like an unbiased investigation. And they apparently restricted themselves to Roman Catholic accounts of the history.
121 posted on 06/18/2004 3:24:06 PM PDT by gitmo (Thanks, Mel. I needed that.)
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To: Flying Circus

ping


133 posted on 06/18/2004 4:42:23 PM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: xsysmgr

bump


144 posted on 06/18/2004 5:26:41 PM PDT by VOA
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