What if we have to become more evil to survive this Third World War?

vanity | 5-10-04 | SELF

[STARWISE]

Boost the prayers .. pass the ammunition ... I fear this may be the ultimate reality show, and that it doesn't matter how good WE know we are .. but how fierce, mighty and indomitable THEY think we are.

[eastforker]

Real simple Star, Don't take anymore prisoners, kill them on the battlefield and move on. We will never win them over to our side until the chain is broken and their religion of hate is proven false. The down side is America doesn't have the stomach for it, not yet anyway.

[Cultural Jihad]

Interesting essay, but I think it strikes out in this way. Being motivated by compassion and fairness seems like a weakness to the world, but there are powers at play well beyond the control of any earthly authority.

[Indie]

DAMNED GOOD ARTICLE. I AM SICK of the CINOs on FR who are self-proclaimed protectors of morality who constantly bash our country and military just as the enemy does. THIS IS A WAR FOR OUR SURVIVAL IN CASE YOU WIMPS DID NOT KNOW IT!! So take your islamonazi loving apologists attitude somewhere else. [not you starwise...lol] /rant over

[Michael Barnes]

There's quite a few screen names that I can think of that have turned my stomach as of recent and I have no doubt their lurking on this thread. Simply wringing their keyboards with a way to debate this whole thread otherwise.

[epigone73]

Gotta agree.

As for the damage it does to our morals, well, we can always reform after we crush our enemies. But if they win, then being 'moral' and 'good' won't have done us a whole lot of good, now will it?

[Blue Scourge]

Indeed, it is a war for survival....but what good is surviving if we lose all we hold dear and lose what we view ourselves up to be.

We must fight this war to the fullest, but at the same time we cannot allow ourselves to become the barbarians we are trying to destroy. Is it going to be easy? No, but if we really want to win and preserve our way of life, our liberty, and our freedoms it must be done.

I was not outraged by these "abuses", I figured something was going on to one degree or another. But, we cannot allow ourselves to prove our enemies and naysayers right. We must be the better person that we know ourselves to be.

[secretagent]

They don't fear death, they are raised to hope for a martyr's death .. they fear humiliation.

One possible flaw in your argument: The prisoners submitted to the humiliations rather than resisting unto death.

[ladyinred]

Because of the media, I fear we will play right into the hands of the Islamic terrorists. God help us.

[STARWISE]

Where might you have heard or read that?

[dalebert]

exactly what I was thinking.

[stboz]

But if they win, then being 'moral' and 'good' won't have done us a whole lot of good, now will it?

Just the point I was trying to get over to my wife last night. We must be willing to fight evil with its own arsenal. It doesn't have to mean we become evil. Left on its own, evil will destroy good no matter how noble the good side is. Evil only responds to brute and devastating force. Not pretty...but that's how it is.

[GreatOne]

Good essay. We are not going to win this war until we decide to do what is necessary to win. In Fallujah, that meant allowing all children, women, and elderly out of the city, and anyone else who didn't want to fight, then sending in the daisy cutters. That simple. We didn't do that in Korea (particularly Yalu River), and didn't in Vietnam. 'Nuff said.

As much as I trust our leadership, it is disappointing to see that we're trying to buddy up those animals via joint patrolling. I could see if this is a prelude to turning over authority to an Iraqi government. If there's another "uprising", it'd better be dealt with the brutal force promised previously.

Does anyone know if we've been attempting to expand our military? After it being sliced back in 1990s, we should be doing everything we can to recruit more soldiers. Also be nice to see the Republicans take a stand in Congress and cut back some of the damn pork/entitlement spending and use it for higher pay and more troops. North Korea or China won't wait until we're done in the Middle East to start something.

[wtc911]

America has always been able to rise (or sink) to a level of savagery that trumps by one degree the savagery we have faced. Then we revert to our loving, humane selves. In that we have been unique in history. I pray that we have at least one more round in us.

[eastforker]

Only because they was a single unit, no more the mob mentality.This is a type of people that get stired up easily.We have seen the same thing here in the USA. Philly, LA, Cincy and others. Put them in a crowd and they are the riot, single them out and isolate, they become meek.Except for the occasional bad ass in our prisons, most prisoners react well to authority and function much better under the threat of punishment.

[stboz]

Yeah, yeah; I know,"If you strike me down, Darth, I shall become more powerful than you can imagine....blah, blah, blah..."

[Captainpaintball]

Michael Savage is right. Not only should we batter them, but humiliate them afterwards. How should we beat them? Using the "THREE Ls."

LEAFLETS for the citizens. As Michael Savage hasbeen saying, women and children have 24 hours to "ex-cape". (a little ebonics lingo, there.) ALL men leaving the city will be set aside in a nearby camp and interrogated. Humanely, of course.

LEVEL the city. With the force of 1000 daisycutters, Fallujah will be incinerated in a show of force not seen since Hiroshima.

'LIM-IN-ATE the survivors. Those not smart enough to leave, and all the "brave" insurgents left alive will be put out of their misery.

This will work if we do it hard, fast, and without apology.

The apologizing is what is killing us. Democrats, to their credit, at least know NOT to apologize, no matter how stupid, outrageous, or inappropriate their actions.

[rdb3]

The common denominator among the posters you're talking about is that they all hate Bush.

Therefore, it bothers them not in the least that they sound exactly like Democrats on the war.

[schu]

I believe it was Churchill who recognized and commented how war can make even those on the right side act immorally. Certainly individuals fighting in the war will make bad/immoral decisions, especially when events hit close to home. Some think that the strategic bombing in Europe, especially after victory was assured, was immoral. The bombing was certainly systematic and fully supported by the political leaders as well as the populace.

Is it possible to have a war, even when we are on the right side and not act immorally for even some small part of it? Is that what it takes to win? These are difficult questions, and ones we leave to leaders who have hopefully studied and understand the issues before the decisions need to be made.

I for one am glad I do not have to make these decisions and salute those who accepted the responsibility.

[Psycho_Bunny]

I'll tell you what worries me:  the last time we got in a fight with a group of fanatics who based their entire cultural psychology on "face" or "honor" we beat them on the battlefield and they wouldn't surrender.

Then we had to drop two nukes on them to make them finally stop fighting.

I know the middle-east doesn't have the relative power that Japan possessed, nor the strong central leadership.  Nor, in my opinion, does Arab culture have the depth of Japan's.

But a group of fanatics who value "honor" and "face" over individual/personal freedom, present an enemy unlikely to stop at any reasonable point.

I hope I'm wrong but I think things are only going to get worse.