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FRESH CLUE SHOWS TURIN SHROUD MAY BE GENUINE BURIAL CLOTH OF CHRIST
The Mirror ^
| April 2, 2004
| David Edwards
Posted on 04/05/2004 7:13:37 AM PDT by NYer
IT'S been called the longest-running hoax in history - an 800-year-old religious riddle that's taken in popes, scientists and believers from all faiths.
The Turin Shroud has been either worshipped as divine proof that Christ was resurrected from the grave or dismissed as a fraud created by medieval forgers.
But new evidence suggests the shroud might be genuine after all.
![](http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/apr2004/3/8/00084E47-81AF-106E-B5A380BFB6FA0000.jpg)
HAUNTING: The face on the shroud
As Mel Gibson's film The Passion Of The Christ rekindles interest in Jesus, stitching on the shroud which could have been created only during the messiah's lifetime has been uncovered.
At the same time, tests from 1988 that dated the shroud to between 1260 and 1390 have been thrown into doubt.
Swedish textiles expert Dr Mechthild Flury-Lemberg, who discovered the seam at the back of the cloth during a restoration project, says: "There have been attempts to date the shroud from looking at the age of the material, but the style of sewing is the biggest clue.
"It belongs firmly to a style seen in the first century AD or before."
Her findings are being hailed as the most significant since 1988, when scientists controversially carbon-dated the 14ft-long cloth to medieval times, more than 1,000 years after Jesus died.
Yet experts now say the team unwittingly used cloth that had been added during a 16th-century restoration and it could have been contaminated from handling.
Mark Guscin, of the British Society for the Turin Shroud, says: "The discovery of the stitching along with doubt about the carbon-dating all add to the mountain of evidence suggesting this was probably the shroud Jesus was buried in.
"Scientists have been happy to dismiss it as a fake, but they have never been able to answer the central question of how the image of that man got on to the cloth."
Barrie Schwortz, who in 1978 took part in the first scientific examination of the shroud, says: "I was a cynic before I saw it, but I am now convinced this is the cloth that wrapped Jesus of Nazareth after he was crucified."
THE history of the cloth - which bears the ghostly image of a bearded man - is steeped in mystery.
The first documented reference was in 1357, when it was displayed in a church in Lirey, France. The cloth astonished Christians as it showed a man wearing a crown of thorns and bearing wounds on his front, back and right-hand side.
He also had a wrist wound, which confused some pilgrims who thought Jesus was nailed to the cross through his hands. Scientists have since discovered the wrists were used as the hands could not support the body's weight.
Before it arrived in France, it is thought the shroud was known as the Edessa burial sheet, given to King Abgar V by one of Jesus's disciples.
For the next 1,200 years it was kept hidden in the Iraqi city, brought out only for religious festivals. In 944 it is thought to have turned up in Constantinople, Turkey, before being stolen by the French knight Geoffrey de Charny during the Fourth Crusades.
It soon became Europe's most-revered religious artefact, although it was scorched in a fire in 1532. In 1578 it was moved to Turin in northern Italy and was frequently paraded through the streets to huge crowds.
Yet while the shroud attracts hundreds of thousands of pilgrims when it goes on display, it was not photographed until 1898. The photographer, Secondo Pia, was amazed at the incredible depth and detail revealed on the negative.
There were even rumours that the shroud had healing qualities after the British philanthropist Leonard Cheshire took a disabled girl to see it in 1955. After being given permission to touch it, 10-year-old Josephine Woollam made a full recovery.
But it wasn't until 1978 that scientists were allowed to examine the shroud for the first time.
The Shroud of Turin Research Project spent 120 hours examining the cloth in minute detail but was unable to explain how the image had got there. Barrie Schwortz, the project's photographer, says: "We did absolutely every test there was to try to find out how that image had got there.
"We used X-rays, ultra-violet light, spectral imaging and photographed every inch of it in the most minute detail, but we still couldn't come up with any answers.
"We weren't a bunch of amateurs. We had scientists who had worked on the first atomic bomb and the space programme, yet we still couldn't say how the image got there. The only things we could say was what it isn't: that it isn't a photograph and it wasn't a painting.
"It's clear that there has been a direct contact between the shroud and a body, which explains certain features such as the blood, but science just doesn't have an answer of how the image of that body got on to it."
A SECOND study was carried out in 1988, when scientists cut a sliver from the edge of the shroud and subjected it to carbon-dating.
Carbon has a fixed rate of decay, which means that it is possible to accurately measure when the plant materials that formed the basis of the cloth were harvested.
The announcement that the shroud was a fake was made on October 13, 1988, at the British Museum. Scientists compared those who still thought the shroud was authentic to flat-earthers.
It led to the humiliating spectacle of the then Cardinal of Turin, Anastasio Alberto Ballestrero, admitting the garment was a hoax.
The Catholic Church also accepted the scientists' findings - an embarrassing admission given that Pope John Paul II had kissed the shroud eight years earlier.
But experts now say the carbon-dating results are wrong. Ian Wilson, co-author of The Turin Shroud: Unshrouding The Mystery, says they were flawed from the moment the sample was taken.
He says: "What I found quite incredible was that when they had all the scientists there and ready to go, an argument started about where the sample would come from.
"This went on for some considerable time before a very bad decision was made that the cutting would come from a corner that we know was used for holding up the shroud and which would have been more contaminated than anywhere else."
Marc Guscin, author of Burial Cloths Of Christ, believes the most compelling evidence for the shroud's authenticity comes from a small, blood-soaked cloth kept in a cathedral in Oviedo, northern Spain.
The Sudarium is believed to have been used to cover Jesus's head after he died and, unlike the shroud, its history has been traced back to the first century. It contains blood from the rare AB group found on the shroud.
Mark says: "Laboratory tests have shown that these two cloths were used on the same body.
"The fact that the Sudarium has been revered for so long suggests it must have held special significance for people. Everything points towards this cloth being used on the body of Jesus of Nazareth."
Yet despite the latest discoveries, there are still many sceptics.
Professor Stephen Mattingly, from the University of Texas, says the image could have been created by bacteria which flourish on the skin after death. "This is not a miracle," he says. "It's a physical object, so there has to be a scientific explanation. With the right conditions, it could happen to anyone. We could all make our own Turin Shroud."
Another theory, put forward by South African professor Nicholas Allen, is that the image was an early form of photography.
However fierce the controversy, the shroud is still a crowd-puller. When it last went on display in 2000, more than three million people saw it. Many more visitors are expected when it next goes on show in 2025.
Mark believes the argument will rage on. He says: "The debate will go on and on because nobody can prove one way or another if this was the shroud that covered the body of Jesus. There simply isn't a scientific test of 'Christness'.
"But there are lots of pointers to suggest it was."
TOPICS: Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; Philosophy; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: britishtabloid; medievalhoax; shroud; shroudofturin; sudariumofoviedo; turin; veronicaveil
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To: sneakers
You're right about this -- I think this has been mentioned in a couple of posts on this thread.
241
posted on
04/05/2004 1:38:27 PM PDT
by
Alberta's Child
(Alberta -- the TRUE north strong and free.)
To: RightOnline
"Blood type was AB-, IIRC."
Sure, that's what is said, but WHO did the actual testing ? Where are the actual test procedures used and results ?
Just specifically where on the shroud was this blood sample removed ? When ? How ?
(Dosen't anyone here watch CSI ? )
242
posted on
04/05/2004 1:39:08 PM PDT
by
RS
(Just because they're out to get him doesn't mean he's not guilty)
To: mtbopfuyn
If you were to carry lepta (widows' mite) in your pocket it would probably make you Jewish. (Actually it would be surprising if you had a pocket). Romans minted coins for Jewish use and other coins for use by Romans, Greeks and others such as the Syrian population.
It is true that some report seeing images of lepta coins over the man's eyes on the Shroud. Are they there? Probably not. But it is a fascinating subject; one of the most interesting aspects of Shroud research. See:
http://shroudstory.com/faq-coins.htm Though I think the Shroud is genuine, I have serious doubts about the coins.
Shroudie
To: Hammerhead
The idea is that at the instant of resurrection (a second, a millisecond, maybe less) some kind of energy emanated from the body and "burned" the image onto the shroud. One thing I recall from reading about this years ago is that when they checked the fibers containing the actual image with a microscope they found that the discoloration only reached a depth of a couple molecules(!). One of the main problems faced by those determined to disprove the shroud's authenticity is that so far no one has been able to find a pigment that makes the image (although I also recall that some ochre was found in a few but not all parts of the image indicating somebody at some time tried to "enhance" it) or explain what happened to the fibers.
244
posted on
04/05/2004 1:44:04 PM PDT
by
katana
(We all have it coming, kid.)
To: tiamat
I thought Jewish people of that period traced lineage through the mother's side?
YEs, because before DNA testing you couldn't prove who your daddy was.
245
posted on
04/05/2004 1:50:54 PM PDT
by
johnb838
(Kerry: Wrong on Defense, Wrong on Taxes. Too Liberal for America.)
To: katana
This is a microscopic view of an image fiber.
Cellulose fibers that make up the threads of the Shroud's cloth are coated with a thin carbohydrate layer of starch fractions, various sugars and other impurities. This chemical layer, which is about as thick as the transparent scratch-resistant coatings used for eye glasses, is essentially colorless. However, in some places, the layer has undergone a chemical change that appears straw-yellow. This chemical change is similar to the change that takes place when sugar is heated to make caramel or when proteins react with sugar giving beer its color. And it is the straw-yellow, selectively present in some parts of the carbohydrate layer, that makes up the image we see on the Shroud. When scientists speak of image fibers they are referring to the coating on lengths of fiber that have undergone this chemical change. Shroudie
To: RS
"Dosen't anyone here watch CSI?"
Speaking of unrealistic! LOL
247
posted on
04/05/2004 2:02:50 PM PDT
by
the OlLine Rebel
(Common Sense is an Uncommon Virtue)
To: Stallone
Question: Isn't 2 a corollary of 3? I'm trying to understand the "3D image" idea - and I was thinking it really means what you said in #3 - that the cloth patter varies between actual contact and some distance from the object.
Comment: While I think much of the evidence (I don't know enuff, but...) seems to say the item is the rite general era, I don't think the corollary of that is that the image is of Jesus.
Again, I'm open-minded, and believe in Jesus. But as a scientist myself of sorts, I don't see how pinpointing it to the rite era and location says it belongs to Jesus. Strictly speaking.
248
posted on
04/05/2004 2:11:34 PM PDT
by
the OlLine Rebel
(Common Sense is an Uncommon Virtue)
To: RightOnline
"As usual, his presentation was fascinating and he alluded strongly to some very new research that will "set the world on its ear"."
Did he give a hint of what this might be or when the new research will be disclosed? I concur the comment is compelling.
Incidentally, I live in Holly Springs. How do I find out about the presentations and when they will occur?
Thanks!
To: Freeper Lady
Not sure of the timing, but just "later this year". As for the timing on the presentations........they're held at Covenant Church of Raleigh (located on Strickland Rd. in North Raleigh......actually my former church; Dr. D'Muhalla is a member of that congregation). When Tom does these, they're usually around this time of year (before, but around, Easter time), but not necessarily every year.
To: Mr. Jeeves
That's fine, maybe the "scientist" there was a fraud...Shroud research is the product of many scientists, not one. Still no method has been found to reproduce the Shroud.
Nor an adequete explanation why in medeival times an image would be reproduced in incredible detail...which ONLY really shows up in a process developed 700 years later--the photographic negative.
I've never seen more proof for the reality of God than the vicious bitter atheism promulgated by the Skeptical Inquirer, by the way. That publication proves the assertion, "If there was really no God, there would be no atheists."
To: the OlLine Rebel
""Dosen't anyone here watch CSI?"
Speaking of unrealistic! LOL"
Exactly...
I'm trying to track down any info on when, where, who...the blood test of the shroud was actually done, but there dosen't seem to be any info... just the generic statement that it HAD been tested at some time - given the available microphotographs of every spec of lint they picked off of it, you might think that SOMEONE should know the specifics on something as important as the blood tests....
252
posted on
04/05/2004 2:25:24 PM PDT
by
RS
(Just because they're out to get him doesn't mean he's not guilty)
To: shroudie
I'm on your side. My reply was simply to explain how the whole C14 testing works, not to vouch for the conclusions that some have reached.
To: Xenalyte
According to some, the Plantard de St. Clair family is Davidian (and Merovingian, which opens up a HUGE can of worms).I wish I could remember his name but there's some Earl or Duke or something in England who on one hand claims he's a descendant but on the other poo-poos the whole theory. I was at a LDS library doing genealogy one day when the librarians were all in a tizzy over some bozo who had submitted their line all the way back to none other than Adam and Eve. I've often wondered if they ever got anywhere on tracking down their ancestors on grandpa Cain's wife's side.
To: mtbopfuyn
If I were to carry in my pocket some coins minted during the time of Pontius Pilate would that make me Jesus? Just burn the image of the coin (the style of which was unknown to the medievals) into an ancient piece of linen material bearing an image, the origin of which is unknown to modern science, and I might pay attention.
255
posted on
04/05/2004 2:51:04 PM PDT
by
Aquinasfan
(Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
To: NYer
In my mind there has never been a moments doubt about the Shroud of Turin being the burial cloth of Christ. Why else would it exist.
To: RS
In your link it does not say that this researcher actually did any blood testing ( Botanist Avinoam Danin ) - do you have any link to someone who actually did this ? It's pretty well established. Just type in "Shroud" + "type AB" and see what you find.
257
posted on
04/05/2004 2:55:56 PM PDT
by
Aquinasfan
(Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
To: RS
Regarding blood chemistry studies.
RS, I haven't a complete answer from here at home. But this might help you find the material you seek. (See references below). If not, let me know and I'll dig out more information.
David Ford (University of Maryland)has examined the various blood studies of the shroud. He wrote: For one thing, not all the blood material is red, for its color ranges from yellow to orange to red to brown. Also, the blood is not whole blood, but exudate from a blood clot (when a blood clot dries, it contracts, exuding liquid blood material). The blood moreover is blood clot exudate from a beaten, traumatized individual. A traumatic beating would destroy red blood cells, and the red cell debris would go to the liver, which in turn would take the debriss hemoglobin and convert it to the bile pigment bilirubin. Bilirubin levels in the blood would rapidly rise, meaning that should a cut form, the resulting blood clots exudate will contain serum albumin (a protein found in blood serum), and that albumin will bring with it bilirubin. The clot exudates hemoglobin oxidizes to become methemoglobin, which is reddish-brown/brown; this reddish-brown/ brown + the yellow-orange bilirubin = red. (Malaria can produce red cell destruction, but severe malaria cases are rare.) Ancient DNA specialist Thomas Loy agrees with [Al] Adlers explanation for the seemingly too-red color of much of the blood, himself having found 300,000 year-old blood with the same vivid red color.
Some who worked on the blood studies. Remember that much of this blood work was done from samples collected from the Shroud in 1978. And since you mention CSI, there is documented and certified chains of evidence.
1) Dr. Paul Heller, Professor of Internal Medicine and Medical Physics, Yale University & Director of the New England Institute.
2) Dr. Alan D. Adler, Emeritus Professor of Chemistry, Western Connecticut University.
3) Dr. Robert Bucklin, Forensic Pathologist, Head of the Forensic Medical Division of the Los Angeles Medical Examiner Office with more than 25 years experience identifying blood and bloodstains.
4) Dr. James Malcolm Cameron, Professor of Forensic Medicine, the London Hospital Medical School.
5) Raymond N. Rogers, Chemist, Laboratory Fellow, University of California and Los Alamos National Laboratory.
6) Anna Arnoldi, Department of Molecular Sciences, University of Milan.
7) Dr Victor V. Tyron, Director of Center for Advanced DNA Technology, University of Texas Health Science Center.
The following tests were conducted:
X-ray fluorescence used to detect higher-than-elsewhere levels of iron in blood areas.
Microspectrophotometry used to indicative spectra
Generation with chemicals and ultraviolet light of characteristic porphyrin fluorescence
Positive tests for hemochromagen using hydrazine
Positive tests for cyanmethemoglobin using a neutralized cyanide solution
Positive tests for the bile pigment bilirubin
Positive tests for protein
Use of proteolytic enzymes on blood material leaving no residues
Reflection spectra indicative of bilirubin and blood presence
Chemical detection of the specific protein albumin
Presence of serum halos around various blood marks when viewed under ultraviolet light
Immunological determination that the blood is of primate origin
Here is what Al Adler says: All the microscopic, chemical, spectroscopic, and immunological evidence is consistent with these images, not only being exudates from clotted wounds, but those of a man who suffered severe trauma prior to death, explaining the red color of the blood at the microscopic level (3,4,5,8,11,12,24,29,30,31,32,33,43,44). Proposed mineral compositions simulating blood are not consistent with these various measured chemical and physical parameters(3,5,12,24,29,30,44).That these are clotted wound exudates is clearly seen in the ultraviolet photographs where every single blood wound shows a distinct serum clot retraction ring (25) agreeing with the earlier observations of the pioneers on the major blood wounds as seen directly on the cloth (3).
Citations for above by Adler:
3) Adler, in Sindone Cento Anni di Ricerca, Istituto Poligrafaico, Rome (1998).
4) Adler, ACS Symp. Series, 625, 223 (1996).
5) Jumper, et. al., ACS Adv. in Chem.,205, 447 (1984).
8) Borkan,Vertices,10,18 (1995).
11)Ballosino, The Image on the Shroud, St. Pauls, London (1998).
12)Bollone,Sindone O No, Societa Editrice Inter., Torino, (1990).
24)Heller and Adler, Can Soc. Forens. Sci. J.,14, 81 (1981).
29)Mottern, London, and Morris, Mater. Eval.,38, 39 (1980).
30)Morris, Schwalbe, and London, X-ray Spectrom.,9, 40 (1980).
31)Pellicori, Appl. Opt.,19, 1913 (1980)
32)Gilbert and Gilbert, Appl Opt.,19, 1930 (1980).
33)Accetta and Baumgart, Appl. Opt.,19, 1921 (1980). NY 1990)
43)Adler, in Turin Shroud, Hong Kong (1986).
44)Adler, Selzer, and DeBlase in ref.21 and also ref.22.
Here is a link to a paper by Ford. It cites additional references:
http://www.shroud.com/pdfs/ford1.pdf More information: In 1978 analyses were performed independently by J. H. Heller and A. D. Adler
in USA (1980) and by P. Baima Bollone in Italy (1981). Heller and Adler chose to use the conversion of the suspected heme group to a porphyrin, detectable by its characteristic Soret excitable red fluorescence, as a very specific test (the Soret band has a very strong absorption due to the heme porphyrin at four hundred and ten nanometers). They obtained positive results. In addition to the heme derivative, Heller and Adler found on the TS bile pigments and serum type proteins (albumin), indication that on the cloth there is whole blood and not just heme protein; they found also serum haloes at the margins of blood clots and concluded that the TS was in contact with a wounded human body. A solution of proteolytic enzymes completely dissolved the red particulate coating the fibrils, leaving no
particulate residues. This further indicates that this particulate is blood. This protease treatment also removes the golden yellow coating of the serum coated fibrils, corroborating its identification as serum. Interestingly, fibrils freed of their coatings using this technique closely resemble the non-image fibrils when viewed under phase contrast microscopy. This is a strong indication that the blood and the serum coated the fibrils before the image formation and protected the fibrils when the image was forming.
I hope this is of some help. If not, let me know and I dig out some more material.
Shroudie
To: johnb838
YEs, because before DNA testing you couldn't prove who your daddy was.There's an old saying, "Mama's baby, Daddy's maybe." In biblical times and even today in some countries, women have little say. Back then the lineage was recorded through the father. The Bible speaks of Jesus' brothers James, Joseph (jr), Simon, and Judas, but there's zip on his sisters. However, even though we know his brothers, we don't know if they were from Mary or a previous wife or what. It would be interesting to see if the DNA on the shroud could be matched with DNA from the head cloth, the supposed decendants, and the burial box supposedly containing the bones of someone named James who was the son of Joseph and brother of Jesus. I won't be holding my breath for any testing of those because if one thing didn't prove out for whatever reason there'd be riots in the streets.
To: Aquinasfan
This was interesting:
http://xoomer.virgilio.it/bachm/BRILLAN2.PDF
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