Terri Schiavo Hospitalized With Apparent Puncture Wounds In Arm! Apparent Foul Play!

WFTV-ABC in Orlando | UNK

[MindBender26]

You certainly give 3 or 4 people a heck of a lot of power if they alone can influence millions of people...give me a break.

3 or 4 is an excess of 2 or 3. Lech Walesa started a movement that brought down communism and ended the USSR. His only initial help was the media. Hitler started with two helpers. A man named Jesus did pretty well by himself.

It has nothing to do with the vigils, but everything to do with the reason for the vigils

But when people started using Terri's cause to promote their own, such as some rabid "kill all abortionists" showing kids signs with dead fetus pictures, did that help Terri's cause?

If you question the Schindler's creditability as the parents of Terri Schiavo, you cannot call yourself a true supporter of saving Terri's life

Where did you ever get that misguided idea? Never did such a thing.

The core concept is very simple; get Terri home with her mother. Period.

The failures of the current demonstrations to build public support for that are obvious. A new plan was needed.

Have spoken with family PR woman. End of case.

[Future Useless Eater]

I cannot see anyone as someone who genuinely supports the life of Terri Schiavo when they constantly run around demoralizing other Terri supporters and putting down their efforts....

Woo-Hoo! Three cheers for Angleena!

[pc93]

If you havne't called the Health Care Administration yet
please do.

Contacts:
The Capitol
Tallahassee, Fl. 32399
Phone: 850/488/7146
Fax: 850-487-0801
www.myflorida.com
jeb.bush@myflorida.com

The Health Care Administration
1-888-419-3456
Press Option # 1
(you may remain anonymous)
Please Report:
Suspected Lack of Care for Terri Schiavo
Missing Teeth/no treatment
Bed Sore
Poor daily hygiene
Terri's not receiving any social activity
Social Isolation (cruel and unusual punishment by cooking up accusations against her parents and denying her visitation by her parents and siblings, etc., priest, etc.)/not allowed to go outside in the fresh air.
No Physical, Occupational, Speech Therapy

Where Terri presently resides:
Park Place Assisted Living
2750 Drew Street
Clearwater, Florida
727-799-2177

---

The Hotline will ask you whether you wish to be anonymous, or not.
You can opt to be anonymous but if you do, you will not receive a personal response regarding their findings.

They will ask you what you are reporting, the patient's name, age and her location.

You do not have to be an actual witness to what is being reported. All you have to do is say you have heard that there is abuse. Report that you have concerns
about a patient located at Park Place at the address I had previously sent to you with the items mentioned ie, bed sore, lack of care, missing teeth (possible infection to not being treated, etc.)

[Angleena]

If you have read the bible correctly, you will recall that there were many such as yourself who belittled and berated Jesus too, same as you belittle and berate many of those who support the life of Terri Schiavo. Jesus never let them shut him up, and these people certainly shouldn't let you shut them up. In fact, some people say that Jesus was betrayed by one of his own followers, when you belittle other's that support Terri, you betray Terri.

You are saying that people at the vigil were showing kids pictures of abortions and aborted fetuses? That's the first I have heard that. Please show me a good source that shows people at the vigils were displaying pictures of aborted fetuses. I would imagine if that were true, it would be plastered all over the news nation wide, I have yet to see anything of the sort. If these children were so terrorized, why did they write the kindest most honest birthday cards to Terri? Why did someone then go and take every single card down after Terri's mother had displayed them all in Terri's room? Perhaps someone just started this nonsense about the children to use the innocent child against promoting the life of Terri Schiavo? Vigils, demonstrations, protests, picketing is all a part of life...it's up to us adults to teach our children responsibly and honestly about these things. As far as I am concerned, Terri's life has nothing to do with abortion and while I don't support all the tactics used by SOME pro-life activists, I appreciate their help to save Terri's life so I do not judge them on what they do in their regular campaigning....this battle is neither the time or place to get into the abortion debate. But it is also no time to turn away every single person that jumps on the band wagon to save Terri's life. Sometimes, we must just put our differences aside and come together for the common good.

It seems you have also used Terri's life to support your own cause. That is evident when you have mentioned over and over there is a better way (your way with your help and with your expertise as a public relations person). Instead of talking about it, DO IT! If you have a better way, get out there and walk the walk instead of sitting around here talking the talk. I personally don't have a better way, I think everyone's way could be a possible good way. Never ever put down one person's idea...because where one idea may not work, someone else's might. When people put their heads together, several ideas can be put into one very strong idea. A great idea can be born from the ideas of several.

You are the one that keeps saying over and over that the Schindler's creditability has been put in question. I certainly don't see other supporters seeing that happen. Of course we can see that those who support Michael are trying to force us to question them but most of us have brushed that off and are not concerned with worry about their creditability...you seem to be overly concerned. When everything is said and done, people will believe what they want to believe even if everyone's creditability is destroyed. Michael could be a convicted killer and some will still support his "right as husband" to make decisions for Terri. That's just the way it is.

Rather then attacking those of us that are solidly behind the Schindler's and believe they are creditable, try attacking those that are not. Instead of trying to convince us to support the Schindler's since we already do, try convincing those that are sitting on the fence and haven't decided yet. Though I doubt you will get far with the kind of tactics you are using. You attract more bees with honey.

The current public support system has not failed Terri one bit. In fact, it was that very public support that spread the word across the country and let us see who Terri is and what is happening to her. I live right in the middle of the US and didn't know anything about Terri until October 15 (when the feeding tube was last removed) when the demonstrations went full bore and attracted media attention around the US. Had there been no demonstrations, people wouldn't have taken a second look, people would have just believed the media was reporting the correct story...but instead, they see all the demonstrations and they wonder what all the hubbub is about and they continue to investigate into it. If there were no vigils, no protests, there would be very little press coverage. If there had been no vigils, no protests, many people still would not no who Terri Schiavo is unless they had cable news. These days the press is all about ratings and they do not cover stories for long that don't bring about public interest.....unfortunately the public is very interested in ongoing disputes that result in vigils, demonstrations, etc. The public doesn't seem to pay a whole lot of attention to feel good stories these days, they are readily tossed away...but stories that involve conflict of this size are remembered and attract readers/viewers. Because Terri's story has attracted the "hot topics" like abortion, politics, pro choice, pro life, religion, people with disabilities, etc., it is a story that has held news coverage. If these activists were not involved, Terri's story would have died out long ago.

The vigils have done another thing that may not be readily apparent to those who do not have a caring heart, they showed the Schindler's that we believe in them, we are there for them and they are not alone. I'm sure they have gained strength from having these people by their side.

As far as this recent story about the alleged puncture wounds in Terri's arms, what it has done is removed nearly all attention and speculation into the poor care Terri is getting in the current nursing home. We haven't seen much of anything about her missing teeth and her bed sore since this story came out. It just seems to me that this was a tactic used by Felos to divert attention.

[Wampus SC]

"If anyone would like to have their freeper name on a card for an Easter box I'm sending to Terri via the Terrisfight address, please post to me or ping me. I plan to send it tomorrow express mail."

I think that's a good idea. Please sign my freeper name to the card. Thanks.

Wampus SC

[YoSoy2]

"If you question the Schindler's creditability as the parents of Terri Schiavo, you cannot call yourself a true supporter of saving Terri's life."

Excellent post.

God bless you and God bless Terri.

[Wampus SC]

"But when people started using Terri's cause to promote their own, such as some rabid "kill all abortionists" showing kids signs with dead fetus pictures, did that help Terri's cause?"

A long time ago, I used to participate in the newsgroup "alt.native". There was an expression that went around there: "Some people say the d@mndest things about Indians when they don't know Indians can read the newsgroup!" Well, for "Indians", substitute "people who were there". Seeing you do the same thing now is, well, it's funny!

You just showed up a day late and a dollar short again.....

[Wampus SC]

Wow! Make that three more cheers for Angleena. That was perfect.

[yesnettv]

People,
Drop egos please!
We are trying to save Terri!

There is a saying, "If you keep doing what you 'been doing, you'll keep getting what you 'been getting".

To save Terri, we need to change tactics!

[Wampus SC]

"People,
Drop egos please!"

You addressed it to me, so I'll add my $0.02. I guess these following things don't constitute ego, then: Constant references to one's own greatness, talent, experience, and expertise; with nothing to back it up but repeated assertions of same. Claiming to have a super-duper plan, and anyone who isn't following it *before* they know what it is is "psychotic", stupid, ridiculed - - - -

[pc93]

Do call today! Register your name and the complaints below, etc. and you will get a complaint number and
a field officer will get back to you voice and in writing
after checking up on Terri.

[MindBender26]

A few comments. I do not belittle Terri's supporters. I praise their DEDICATION... while at the same time I point out that their TACTICS have resulted in a loss of public support for her.

The purpose of a demonstration, like the purpose of any political or PR campaign is three fold.

Most importantly, it is to move the vast field of undecideds into your supporters. Undecideds also includes those for whom Terri's problems were not a major part of the life or thought process.

Next in importantance, you work to have your opponents stop caring about the issue, to have them move onto other things.

Lastly, and least importantly, you work to encourage those who already agree with you. Certainly you want to "preach to the already converted" but of the three areas, motivating those who already agree with you is the least important. It's great for the ego, but produces little real results.

This was the classic mistake Elian's supporters made. They had the support of 97% of the Cubans in Miami, and worked to make it 100%, while ignoring and sometimes offending the "little old lady in Peoria."

You say I work to support my own cause. You are right. My cause is an EFFECTIVE campaign for Terri, one that will build support rather than drive it away.

You also claim that I say "over and over that the Schindler's creditability has been put in question. I (you) certainly don't see other supporters seeing that happen."

First of all, I do not believe the Schlindler's creditability or motives or honesty are in question in any way, not have I claimed anyhting of the sort.

I do know from watching the poll results and talking to outside observers that many people in the area feel that way, because the demonstration efforts have ignored the vast majority of undecideds we spoke of above, and have energized Terri's opponents, rather than "put them to sleep"

Remember,it's not enough that Terri's supporters continue to agree with her cause. Success comes when you move others to her cause.... and I'm sorry to say that effort has failed miserably here.

People who want to justify their prior actions, and those who want to continue to use Terri's plight to promote their own cause will continue to fight me on this, and fine, they can do so. My efforts have one simple goal; increase the EFFECTIVENESS of the PR campaign.

If this PR campaign does not become EFFECTIVE, then Michael will continue to win on the legal issues, and the campaign will be lost. It matters not if the campaign is loud or long or motivates those who already agree with Terri's family. Hitler's invasion of Russia was "loud" and long... Our eforts in Vietnam were loud and long and doomed to failure because they were not EFFECTIVE.

To be successful, this campaign must reach the undecideds and those who don't have string feelings about the issue, or it will not save Terri's life. To do that, it must be EFFECTIVE.

And yes, I have been in touch with the family's PR person. Since working through her now gives me the opportunity to be EFFECTIVE, and this forum only speaks to those who already support Terri, I now move my interest there.

[cyn]

MB, I'm glad to hear that.

I would suggest that you also contact Atty. George Tragos directly. He also just came on board w/fresh energy and ideas to support Terri and her family.

He is a member of Professionals in Excellence -- it's awesome how many people are concerned about Terri and want to do the right thing for her.

You are in my thoughts and prayers in this, as are all those already in Terri's fight organization. May God give all of you all wisdom, discernment, prudence, knowledge -- and every big and little thing that He knows is needed for Terri. And may He bring the plans of the enemy to nothing.

[Angleena]

I'm glad you can admit you support your own cause, but that is exactly what you have been condemning other supporters for doing.

You have belittled Terri supporters, saying they only want camera time, that their vigils have been ineffective when they have not been ineffective. You have even gone so far to belittle a huge group of Terri supporters (pretty much all of them) by saying that their efforts have been ineffective.

I'm sure you feel at least somewhat offended when someone calls you a spy or a mole (if you don't, you lack human compassion). Now when you say things to other Terri supporters, that are actually going out and doing footwork, you are belittling them and don't for a minute think you are not.

Calling a true Terri supporter a spy/mole or any other belittling remark in a public forum hinders everyone's efforts. It makes those who support Terri look like squabbling children. It is this exact behavior that you have exhibited in this forum that has caused us to lose supporters or have supporters crawl into a corner and remain silent. I was inadvertently a victim of someone calling a group which I belonged to a bunch of moles, and it virtually closed down the group which has scores of important information filed for easy access to other's. I know first hand how berating other's can destroy the fight for Terri.

Don't sit here and tell me you have not belittled and berated other supporters, that very behavior is what has made you look so bad. You have gone after FV many times and even outright accused that one person of causing a downfall in support. I have seen FV in other groups and happen to know that (s)he had never once stumbled off the track of supporting Terri. FV is involved in another group that I am in and has been fairly quiet, so I don't for a minute think this person is trying to get attention as you claim. You have categorized supporters, that is another no no. I suggest you go back and read your posts to see just how you are coming across, it is not good.

From the opinions you give, it seems to me that you believe the disabled individual that is confined to her/his home and can do nothing more then write letters or make phone calls is unimportant. Let me tell you, we are working to save the life of a disabled woman and for that reason, all our disabled supporters are extremely supportive. What about the people that live outside of Florida, do you think they are not important?

If you really want to spread the word, you need to step outside of the INTERNET and reach those folks that do not have the INTERNET. If you really want to help in the cause, you need to first apologize to those supporters you have offended and then try to pick up from them and ask them to help you, get them on your bandwagon. Putting them down is certainly not going to help you in your task at all. When you put one person down, not only does everyone reading the forum see it, each of those people spread the word to other people that they know and it makes your task all that much harder. You need to try a different tactic, how about saying nothing about those supporters you may not like and may not approve of their way of supporting Terri? Instead, how about saying something like, "I have another idea that might be succesful, anyone who wants to join me please let me know". How about doing what you just did in this letter in response to me...rather then state everything that you feel is being done wrong, state that "we should try this", it would be a much better approach.

[lakey]

By the date of your registration, I think I understand where you are coming from. Evidently, you came aboard FR specifically for Terri.

When some emotional/sensational issue arises, we get new members, whose only interest is in that one matter.

I only wish people worked as hard to change bad laws as they do to undermine a constitutional statute. Like it or not, that's what you are fighting. Not Michael. It's the law of Florida.

So far, it is protected by the U.S. Constitution. Start messin' with that, and you'll see some old-timers let out some loud screams.

MindBender26 has every right to voice his/her opinion. Part of the advice, IMHO, was plain common sense.

[Future Useless Eater]

[he] has every right to voice his/her opinion. Part of the advice, IMHO, was plain common sense.

And would you also say that the mind-messer had a right to voice THIS opinion to one of Terri's strongest supporters?

"...will you and the other one tooth wonders sit down, shut up, stay home and stop looking like loonies every time you are on TV?"

And lets not forget this mind-messer was cheering for George Felos' camp last October. His real goal here did not seem to be to help Terri, but to demoralize her supporters. He could have contacted the family and her team in one fiftyith the time he spent here rudely lambasting.

The nit-wit gets all his news from the St.Pete Times and CBS, and didn't even have the gender right for the person he'd 'seen on TV' so often.

[lakey]

I told him/her about being rude on the previous thread. FR_addict doesn't like MB26's tone. She is generally right, and what I read certainly appeared to be rude. And since I do not keep up with all of these lengthy threads/posts on Terri (or even Scott Peterson for that matter), I take her educated word.

That has not been my personal experience with MindBender. It did happen to me when Floriduh voter didn't like my asking if "you are willing to 'trash' the Constitution for this one woman?" Snippy reply "....blah, blah, blah. See ya."

With the exception of attending the protests, I had done as much as any other freeper in getting the governor's attention, as well as telephoning and e-mailing Florida legislators.

In my personal experiences on the Elizabeth Smart threads, I found that, due to ridicule, sarcasm, or FEAR of ridicule, sarcasm etc., many people dropped out, or just lurked.

I let it all roll off of me - took the heat, the jabs, the insults, and/or measured my own right back at them. Why? Because I knew I was right.

It isn't beyond the realm of possibilities that there are people in this forum, pretending to be pro-Terri, making the whole thing look ludicrous....ridiculing sound advice, starting a war of words. Think about it.

Yes, MindBender has the right to voice opinions, unless and until....you can always hit the Abuse button and let Jim Robinson decide.

[Future Useless Eater]

Thank you for your posts! If Michael Schiavo WERE to ever
send a mole or lakey here to demoralize freepers he would
very likely single out FV as one of the most important
freepers to attack and discredit.

Hey wait, the mind-messer even pointed his three basics of PR, which were something like...
1) demoralize your opponents and hope they lose interest,
[well yea, he DID treat us like opponents]

2) win over the undecided,
[not applicable here because that would be fishing in
the wrong pond]

3) encourage your supporters
[and he certainly did NOT do that]

Combining those findings with his support last year for Felos, and I'd say the mind-messer was not sincere. And
very few newcomers arrive here with such strong opinions
like that either, so that's another tip-off.

best wishes to you, the Schindlers, Terri, and all her supporters!

[phenn]

Will the Pope's statement help save Terri Schiavo?
Are people in "vegetative" states really hopeless?
Listen Wednesday night, 4/7/04 at 10 PM EST and hear about the recent international meeting in Rome to discuss developments in the treatment and ethics of the "vegetative" state. See link below for the official English translation of the Pope's March 20 statement which has been called a "stunner" by ethicists! - Nancy Valko, RN.

Listen on http://www.highway2health.net
Wednesday - April 5, 2004 10.00 ET (GMT-5)

About the Host
Nancy Valko has been a Registered Nurse for 35 years, working mainly in oncology, home health/hospice, hemodialysis and several kinds of ICUs, including trauma and is currently a full-time nurse in an ICU. Ms. Valko has covered the Terri Schiavo case for Wisconsin NPR, written for publications both religious and secular, produced medical news analysis articles for the National Catholic Register and is a Spokesperson for the National Association of Pro-life Nurses (http://www.nursesforlife.org, is president of Missouri Nurses for Life and a contributing editor for Voices, the magazine of Women for Faith and Family (http://www.wf-f.org)

Full Text of Pope's Address in English
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/speeches/2004/march/documents/hf_jp-ii_spe_20040320_congress-fiamc_en.html

[Angleena]

Of course everyone has the right to voice their opinion but when you start criticizing someone personally and referring to them as one tooth wonders, and putting them down for their efforts, that is a different story. Not too many here know someone personally (outside of the net) to be able to make an opinion on who someone is. It is demoralizing and doesn't help Terri's cause to engage in name-calling or finger pointing at those that are on the same side.

And yes I am relatively new to Free Republic, posting that is. I have been reading it for awhile because people are always sending me links to posts....I decided perhaps it was time to join. My responses to MB are not because I think MB isn't in the fight to help Terri, it's because MB considers himself/herself to be a PR person and hasn't shown good PR in this forum. Good Public Relations does not include name calling or finger pointing at those that support the same cause. Good Public relations is having a strong voice and using convincing words, it's giving information in a positive light to get positive supporters. It's being friendly so you don't close the doors to those who will listen. By name calling and finger pointing, that door becomes closed. It even becomes closed to those that may potentially jumped on the band wagon with MB. For instance, I would have been more open to listening to what MB had to say if I hadn't read the name calling and demoralizing of other supporters....there are many that are like me that are reading and not posting...MB throws away the chance at reaching them by engaging in the kind of belittling behavior. Though MB has opened the door for some that want Terri and they will stop to listen. My first thoughts, based on reading MB's post was that (s)he was behind Michael and not Terri, but MB claims differently. That just goes to show how what we type here reflects on those reading.

I am very much aware of the constitutionality of "Terri's law" and have my own opinions on that which I have not expressed in this forum since this thread isn't about that. I also have my own opinions about Bill 692 which I have not mentioned here, since this thread is not about that.

I also have a wide range of other opinions that have nothing to do with Terri at all but since I am new here, I feel I should stay on one subject until I get the feel for how things work. I have yet to figure out what some of the terms being used mean. So forgive me for my newbie status, as I get into this, you will probably see me posting on other issues.