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Rocky Mountain Gun Owners Alert: Kill 1805 Immediately
Rocky Mountain Gun Owners ^ | 02/26/04 | Rocky Mountain Gun Owners

Posted on 02/27/2004 7:54:46 AM PST by Copernicus

Rocky Mountain Gun Owners

EMERGENCY ALERT - S.1805 has Gun Control attached -- KILL IT!

Feb. 26, 2004, 1300 hrs Mountain - As predicted, S.1805, the Lawsuit Liability bill, is being debated on the Senate Floor right now (at the behest of its sponsor, Idaho Senator Larry Craig).

And late last night, Senator Larry Craig (a board member of the NRA) worked with rabid anti-gunner Sen. Jack Reed (D-RI) to come up with a "Unanimous Consent Agreement" which allows a large number of gun control amendments to be offered to S.1805.

By pushing this bill to be heard on the floor, and agreeing to hear a large number of gun control amendments (listed below), Senator Craig has opened up Pandora's Box of Gun Control.

That means you MUST call your US Senators immediately, even if you called them yesterday.

Senator Wayne Allard can be reached at (202) 224-5941.

Senator Ben Nighthorse Campbell can be reached at (202) 224-5852.

Urge both of Colorado's Senators to VOTE AGAINST S.1805, now that it has gun control on it and is likely to contain more.

As this alert is being written, the Senate just passed an amendment (by 70-27, for story on this amendment click here, or here for full text) to require Trigger locks (we do not have the language, but will shortly) and is moving toward more gun control. It's a federal government intrusion on your right to self-defense, and FAR outweighs any good S.1805's original language would do.

And as this is being written, Sen. Teddy Kennedy is offering an amendment to ban "Cop Killer Bullets."

After agreeing to the "Unanimous Consent Agreement", Sen. Larry Craig said "Some of these amendments could pass." This C-Span2 admission is understating it -- some of these gun control amendments WILL pass. In fact, one already has, and others gun control advocates are lining up to join in on the "fun".

NRA Board Member Sen. Larry Craig has agreed to allow a slated list of gun control amendments to S.1805. These include, but are not limited to, the following unspecified gun controls:

Boxer - new Federal rules for Gun locks

Campbell - Cop-Only Nationwide Carry

Kennedy - Cop Killer Bullets

Mikulski - Snipers

McCain-Reed - Gun Show ban

Feinstein - Assault Weapons ban

Frist/Craig - Cop Killer bullets (a toned down, yet still anti-gun rights version of Kennedy's amendment)

And these are only the amendments that have been announced. Others almost certainly will be floated, and maybe passed.

Does this constitute proof that the NRA "struck a deal" to allow gun controls to pass? Of course, they claim they didn't cut any deals.

But ask these questions:

1. Have you received an e-mail from NRA-ILA urging voting against S.1805 IF it gets gun control on it? They KNOW quite well that this bill will have gun control on it, and have known it for weeks. Instead, they play inside baseball and tell gun owners "Trust us -- we have a plan", trusting in their own cleverness to circumvent the anti-gunners amendments. That is the same thing they said on the McCain-Fiengold Campaign Finance Deform bill (which stripped gun owners of their 1st Amendment rights) as well as the first Assault Weapons and High-capacity magazines ban bill, Brady Registration Checks, Lautenberg Gun Ban, etc, etc.

That's a failed strategy, and should be abandoned.

Remember, the definition of insanity is continuing to do what you've always done but expecting different results.

They'll post some things on their website (which is passive), but they won't apply real pressure. That mean's they are, by their silence, agreeing to this "Unanimous Consent Agreement." And their board member, Sen. Larry Craig, openly agreed to that agreement with Sen. Reed.

Craig will vote against most (not all -- in fact, Sen. Craig offered his own "Cop Killer Bullets" amendment in an attempt to appease Teddy Kennedy) of the gun controls, but he's the person who enabled all of these gun control amendments.

2. Why would an NRA board member accept a Unanimous Consent Agreement to allow a huge number of amendments to be debated, all of which strip gun owners of their rights and many of which that board member (and US Senator) knows will pass?

The writer of this alert is a former staff member (not intern) of the U.S. Senate, under Senator Bill Armstrong. I know how the U.S. Senate works, and have been in regular consultation with those who have worked in all aspects of Congress for decades.

One thing is crystal clear: the NRA's mouthpiece, US Senator Larry Craig (R-Idaho), has agreed to let these amendments be heard, and he knows some will be attached to the bill.

3. Have you heard the NRA say that they will oppose S.659/S.1805 in the Senate if it gets gun control amendments on it? We haven't, and doubt we will, since their US Senator is the one who enabled those amendments to be attached. Their plan, to let these gun controls ride on the bill and hope they are stripped out in the House, is an incredibly risky gambit, which if lost will result in the largest erosion of our rights in American history.

There's no more time to waste.

Call your US Senators immediately and urge them to vote AGAINST S.1805.

Senator Wayne Allard can be reached at (202) 224-5941.

Senator Ben Nighthorse Campbell can be reached at (202) 224-5852.

Urge them to vote against S.1805.

It's time to pull the plug on this well-meaning, but gun-control-laden dog.

E-mail: ExDir@RMGO.org


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: bang; banglist; guncontrol; rkba
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To: B4Ranch; Travis McGee; Squantos; Eaker
well, is yer common .223 considered "armor piercing" yet?

does the nra support the ban on centerfire "capable of being armor piercing ammo" yet?

larry friggin craig, huh. that's about as much nra 2nd amendment support as I can stomach.

Gun Control isn't about GUNS

no nonsense support of the right to keep and bear arms

It's about Control

101 posted on 02/27/2004 8:37:31 PM PST by glock rocks (sometimes I want to just kick back, put on some tunes, and smoke a troll.)
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Comment #102 Removed by Moderator

To: skip2myloo; glock rocks; Travis McGee; Squantos
Instead the NRA has posted NO updates today regarding the status of S. 1805, nor addressed Craig's actions as a NRA Director.

This could get interesting if the membership demanded an answer to Craig's actions as a NRA Director. Imagine what could happen if the two faced senior officials tried to lie their way out of it.

103 posted on 02/27/2004 9:21:12 PM PST by B4Ranch (Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.--Eleanor Roosevelt)
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To: glock rocks
My old .270 will punch holes in 1/4" soft steel all day long from 50 yards. I've never tried it any faurther out.

I think I'll look into buying some stock in a few of the air-gun companies. Just as a long term investment. Think the paint ball ones will grow up?

104 posted on 02/27/2004 9:26:14 PM PST by B4Ranch (Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.--Eleanor Roosevelt)
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To: B4Ranch
It's hard to believe they would be stupid enough to pass this bill with an "elastic" AP ammo rider.
105 posted on 02/27/2004 9:38:54 PM PST by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
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To: glock rocks
Ditto Dat !..........Stay Safe !
106 posted on 02/27/2004 9:48:44 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Copernicus
Anyone who seeks to deprive us of our 2nd Ammendment rights should be hunted down and killed.

Semper Fi
Fen
107 posted on 02/28/2004 2:01:15 AM PST by Fenris6
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To: glock rocks
"Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters." -- Daniel Webster
108 posted on 02/28/2004 2:13:53 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: Travis McGee
The amendment leaves it entirely up to the arbitrary decision of the Attorney General (think Reno, not Ashcroft).

FatTeddy was holding up a .30/30 hunting round during his rant.

That was no accident.

He INTENDS to go after ALL centerfire ammo.

All they have to do is use Level I body armor as the "standard." All it protects against is .22 rimfire.

He and his ilk have not been successful going after the guns - so, they're going to go after the ammo that goes in them.

Its that plain - its that simple

109 posted on 02/28/2004 2:21:23 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: skip2myloo
Excellent quote. In the 1930's, the German's passed registration laws to help stem the bloodshed from Nazi's and Commie's fighting in the streets.

When the Nazi's took power, they used those lists to disarm the sheep.
110 posted on 02/28/2004 2:24:28 AM PST by Fenris6
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To: tpaine
It's pretty obvious there is a faction here at FR that is willing to accept 'bullet bans' [and possibly AWB's] in order to prevent spurious lawsuits against gun manufacturer's..

So it would seem. Both the "AP bullet" ban and the "AWB", either one alone, are major loophole legislations that would allow for the banning of a broad swath of civilian firepower by future bureaucratic fiat.

It is like putting a backdoor into computer operating systems. The OS is benign enough when you install it, for the average "point-and-click" user, but it has that secret door where those with the key can come in and do what they will; steal what you have, alter it, destroy it or plant evidence against you.

Shortsightedness on these "concessions" will bring us much closer to a standoff at the front door instead of the House Floor. Either that or surrender. (Ptui)

111 posted on 02/28/2004 3:18:55 AM PST by TigersEye (Carrying a gun is a social obligation.)
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To: tpaine
Almost duplicitous, I would say..

Almost? The consumate diplomat as always, tpaine. ;^)

112 posted on 02/28/2004 3:22:27 AM PST by TigersEye (Carrying a gun is a social obligation.)
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To: B4Ranch
I suspect that's exactly what's going on over at NRA HQ right now, they're trying to figure out how to mitigate Craig's off-message actions and comments.

The bottom line is, that this Ammo Ban Amendment is absolutely disastrous to S. 1805.

If the the Kennedy Amendment (as amended by Craig/Frist) is passed, we should all immediately start calling for the defeat of S. 1805.

Which is probably what the Dems/Libs and RINOs had in mind all along

President Bush has asked for a "clean bill," and his own Senate Majority Leader, Bill Frist, is running around tacking on a bunch of stupid Amendments.

For example Frist sponsored this amendment that has already PASSED !!

S.AMDT.2630 to S.1805 To protect the rights of law enforcement officers who are victimized by crime to secure compensation from those who participate in the arming of criminals. Sponsor: Sen Frist, Bill [TN] (introduced 2/26/2004) Cosponsors: 1 Latest Major Action: 2/26/2004 Senate amendment agreed to. Status: Amendment SA 2630 agreed to in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 60 - 34. Record Vote Number: 21.

Man does that leave the door open for frivolous lawsuits -- this Amendment, in effect - cancels the whole purpose of S. 1805. This Amendment says 'Its OK to have a frivilous lawsuit against a manufacturer, dealer, or other third-party, so long as a policeman (and his lawyer) get all the money.' In other words, the police (and the government) are exempt from this law. Nothing new here, they're all extra-special, you know.

Then, there are the other Frist Amendments:

S.AMDT.2625 to S.1805 To regulate the sale and possession of armor piercing ammunition, and for other purposes. Sponsor: Sen Frist, Bill [TN] (introduced 2/26/2004) Cosponsors: 1 Latest Major Action: 2/26/2004 Senate amendment proposed (on the floor)

And this lunacy - what did this proposed Amendment (now withdrawn) have to do with giving the President a "clean bill ??":

S.AMDT.2626 to S.1805 To make the provisions of the Voting Rights Act of 1965 permanent. Sponsor: Sen Frist, Bill [TN] (introduced 2/26/2004) Cosponsors: 1 Latest Major Action: 2/26/2004 Proposed amendment SA 2626 withdrawn in Senate.

And my own RINO from Virginia, proposes an Amendment and won't even reveal it's purpose:

S.AMDT.2624 to S.1805 Purpose will be available when the amendment is proposed for consideration. See Congressional Record for text. Sponsor: Sen Warner, John W. [VA] (introduced 2/26/2004) Cosponsors: (none) Latest Major Action: 2/26/2004 Senate amendment submitted

The NRA is gonna have to conger up some powerful prevarication to quell the dissatisfaction in the ranks - something akin to convincing us black is white and vice-versa.

BTW, did you ever notice, go to any NRA Web site: NRA.org, NRAHQ.org, NRA-ILA.org, ClintonGunBan, etc., - and they all provide links to write an e-mail to your congresscritters, the President, the media -- but THERE ARE NO LINKS, for members to contact the NRA. Guess they just don't want to hear from us.

If you go the the main NRA web site, http://www.nra.org, the top left corner carries a section called "Top Headlines." This morning; "Healthy GDP Raises Hopes for Job Growth," "Agency Tells Airlines to Weigh Passengers," "IOC Clears Iraqi Flag for Athens Olympics," "Bush, German Leader Put Differences Aside" and "Bush Believes Aristide Should Resign."

But, back when the D.C.-sniper was THE headline news around the world, the NRA completely embargoed all those reports in this section. I thought that was disingenuous reporting. What a perfect opportunity to dispel the idea that some gun (like an insane SUV) had gone berserk and was on the streets killing babies - instead, there was NOTHING.

So I called every NRA HQ media, public relations and ILA number I could find to discuss the public appearance of their ignoring the story on a real-time basis.

I've been a Life Member for 32 years, they didn't want to discuss it -- couldn't find anybody that would even feign an interest in the issue, or admit any policy-level responsibility for making such decisions.

I was promised "someone" would call me back -- no one ever did.

The NRA is not responding to it's membership. The April Convention ought to be interesting, reminiscent of the old days with Baker and Carter and others. I'm not sure the rules even allow a groundswell of dissent to rise to the surface at an annual meeting anymore.

No point trying to talk to LaPierre, he is "unavailable" to the lowlife membership.

Glad I haven't sent in my NRA ballot yet.

[/soapbox]

113 posted on 02/28/2004 3:31:09 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: B4Ranch
They're already going after those too:

BB Guns & Gun Control ABCs By James O.E. Norell [The Consumer Product Safety Commission`s lawsuit to force a BB gun recall is reason to revisit why Congress voted overwhelmingly to exempt firearms and ammunition from the CPSC`s purview... The Consumer Product Safety Commission`s lawsuit to force a BB gun recall is reason to revisit why Congress voted overwhelmingly to exempt firearms and ammunition from the CPSC`s purview...]

http://www.nraila.org/Issues/Articles/Read.aspx?ID=86

114 posted on 02/28/2004 3:47:19 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: Fenris6
I think the opposition position is:

Anyone who seeks to exercise 2nd Ammendment rights should be hunted down and killed.

115 posted on 02/28/2004 3:50:06 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: All
who is on the conference committee?

Can we start working on them?
116 posted on 02/28/2004 3:53:45 AM PST by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: longtermmemmory
I don't know the answer to your question, nor do I know if that strategy would have any success.

My own opinion is, that the sponsors of S. 1805 ought to WITHDRAW the proposal, on the grounds that the amendments are contrary to the original and intent and purpose of the fundamental bill.

That the President demands a "clean bill"

Then, they ought to reintroduce the clean bill, Frist should hold an up/down vote.

Then it goes to the House "clean."

The NRA and Director Craig can save face that way too (maybe).

117 posted on 02/28/2004 4:04:33 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: gatex
"Attach a pro-gun ammendment to every bill"...

I like that!
118 posted on 02/28/2004 4:07:16 AM PST by wunderkind54
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To: wunderkind54
Me too !!
119 posted on 02/28/2004 4:17:56 AM PST by skip2myloo
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To: Copernicus
Who the hell are the "Rocky Mountain Gun Owners Association"?. I live in the Big Horn Mtns and never heard of them.
What I do know is that without the NRA we would have lost our guns years ago. The Folks I know are leary of " Gun Organizations " that fragment and divide them, attack other Gun Rights Associations, and muddy the waters regarding legislation..
What happens now has to go to conference committee with the House. If the final result is poor, it'll die there. This is a long way from over.
Support the NRA, there is strength in numbers.
120 posted on 02/28/2004 4:32:38 AM PST by reloader (Shooting- The only sport endorsed by the Founding Fathers.)
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