Coulter Attacks Cleland's War Record (ann coulter)

11Alive web site ^ | February 13, 2004 | John Shirek

[anncoulteriscool]

Coulter Attacks Cleland's War Record

Columnist and television commentator Ann Coulter, in a column published this week, said former Senator Max Cleland, who lost both legs and an arm in Vietnam, is no war hero.

Cleland, as he campaigns for Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry, is saying President Bush’s military record is inferior to Kerry’s service in Vietnam.

“The question should be: Where were you in the war of your generation? Did you take your place in the line? Or did you escape and avoid, by political means, and then cut short your tour of duty to go to Harvard Business School? I mean, John Kerry volunteered,” Cleland recently said on “Hardball With Chris Matthews.”

Coulter countered that Cleland is no Vietnam war hero, just a victim of a tragic, accidental grenade explosion who plays up his amputations for political gain.

“If Cleland had dropped a grenade on himself at Fort Dix rather than in Vietnam, he would never have been a U.S. Senator in the first place. Maybe he’d be the best pharmacist in Atlanta,” Coulter said in her column, published on February 11.

“He didn't ‘give his limbs for his country,’ or leave them ‘on the battlefield,’” Coulter said. “There was no bravery involved in dropping a grenade on himself with no enemy troops in sight.”

Cleland was wounded picking up a grenade that someone else had dropped.

Rusty Paul, a Georgia Republican Party strategist, said Coulter crossed the line with her comments.

“You can't take away from Max Cleland his record of service to this country and the sacrifice that he's made, regardless of the circumstances. To me, that's out of bounds to talk about that,” he said.

Paul, however, said attacking the politics of Cleland and Kerry was well within those bounds. “I think the voters would much prefer to talk about what George Bush’s view for the future is versus John Kerry’s rather than what happened 30 years ago,” he said.

Cleland was on his way back to Atlanta Friday night and was not available for comment. He is scheduled to spend Saturday in Georgia and then rejoin the Kerry campaign on Sunday.

[mass55th]

"When you pull Mr. Hand Grenade's pin, he is no longer your friend!"

OUCH!!

[jonascord]

A lot of people have been injured doing stupid things. Some people were in the military when it happened.
How many of them carefully edited what happened and used the new version to run for congress as a "War Hero"?
Waving his stumps at people deliberately kept ignorant of how they became stumps, to guilt them into silence as way to counter reasoned argument, is not the act of a hero.

It's a carefully crafted lie.

[Qwinn]

Prior to Coulter's article, articles were constantly referring to Cleland being injured by a "Viet Cong grenade". This was indispubtably a lie, and never ever challenged or corrected by Cleland until Ann came along. To me, that makes it legitimate criticism. He was lying. The media was complicit in the lie. I'm not saying that he should be bashed or mocked for his injuries -gratuitously-, but if he's going to lie and blow it up (no pun intended) into something it -wasn't-, he's fair game. If you think she went too far, then tell me, doesn't that do a disrespect to the vets who really -did- suffer injuries due to Viet Cong grenades, and whose sacrifices are now usurped and personified by this man?

Qwinn

[annyokie]

First: Thank you for your service. Certainly one may critisize another for his bragadoccio.

Second: My husband served three tours in Viet Nam and was awarded many many comendations (six Bronze Stars and two DFC's among many others as a helicopter pilot.) He refuses to condemn to nature of Clelland's injuries, BUT does condemn his actions afterward as a democrat, but is unstinting in his support of Clelland's service.

In short, it was a stupid mistake and yielded tragic results.

[shhrubbery!]

Ann is not dishonoring your brother. Where do you come up with that logic?

She's dishonoring someone who richly deserves it, someone either so stupid or so craven that he tries to weaken our president in wartime. (I would pick stupid, given his "accident" with the grenade, and his ridiculous performance on Hannity & Colmes last night.)

Service in Vietnam should be honored; but it does not make anyone sacrosanct and untouchable, whether it's Cleland or Kerry.

[mass55th]

"Cleland, on the other hand, has left the impression that he is some kind of a war hero - and got elected on the strength of that deception. For that, he should be held accountable!"

Kind of like how through the years, Kerry allowed the impression that he was an Irishman go unopposed, and probably got elected on the strength of that deception.

[RaceBannon]

Too Far?

No, it's about time someone said it.

If Cleland has been living up some hero record for his injuries, and he got them for something that was just a training acident issue, then Cleland is a LIAR.

[saquin]

I'm sorry, but I think she's out of line on this. Many of the soldiers who died in Iraq died in "accidents", like the recent explosion that killed 2 soldiers while they were moving munitions to a detonation point. No, there were no enemy fighters around and the explosion was an accident, but they still died in service of their country.

[annyokie]

No one is saying that. She is over the top on this issue, IMO.

My brother was killed when he "foolishly" stepped on a landmine, by her logic.

[jonascord]

It's not the living or dying that is the issue, it's the LYING ABOUT IT!!!

[knarf]

We complain about how little the Republicans do, we complain about having no voice and we're accused of being just as bad as the Libs.

What Ann has said was more ballsy than what most men have so far shown.

Perhaps there comes a time when the gloves have to truly come off and it is not a cliche.

[shhrubbery!]

I'm sorry about your brother, and God bless him for his service.

However, you are not thinking logically about this. I am sure Ann Coulter would NOT say your brother "foolishly" stepped on a land mine.

Stepping on a land mine is not comparable to playing with a live hand grenade.

[Alter Kaker]

Cleland's campaign manager clarifies senator's Army service

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is in response to the letter to the editor (Sunday, Oct. 20) that inquired how Sen. Max Cleland was injured in Vietnam and whether or not he received any commendations in the war.

Army General Order 4361, dated June 9, 1968, states that the Silver Star was awarded to U.S. Army Capt. Max Cleland "for gallantry in action while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an armed hostile force in Vietnam." In 1968, then Capt. Cleland was in action at the battle of Khe Sanh. Below is the language contained in his Silver Star Order:

"Awarded: Silver Star; Date Action: 4 April 1968; Theater: Republic of Vietnam

"Action: For gallantry in action while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an armed hostile force in the Republic of Vietnam. Captain Cleland distinguished himself by exceptionally valorous action on 4 April 1968, while serving as communications officer of the 2nd Battalion, 12th Calvary during an enemy attack near Khe Sanh, Republic of Vietnam.

"When the battalion command post came under a heavy enemy rocket and mortar attack, Capt. Cleland, disregarding his own safety, exposed himself to the rocket barrage as he left his covered position to administer first aid to his wounded comrades. He then assisted in moving the injured personnel to covered positions. Continuing to expose himself, Capt. Cleland organized his men into a work party to repair the battalion communications equipment which had been damaged by enemy fire. His gallant action is in keeping with the highest traditions of the military service, and reflects great credit upon himself, his unit, and the United States Army.

"Authority: By direction of the President, under the provisions of the Act of Congress, approved 9 July 1968."

The action cited occurred on April 4, 1968, four days before the grenade explosion that cost Sen. Cleland both legs and an arm.

As has been widely reported in the Atlanta Constitution beginning in 1968, then-Capt. Cleland, an Army Signal Officer, volunteered for infantry service to relieve the stranded Marines and members of the Army's 1st Cavalry at the battle of Khe Sanh.

While disembarking from a transport helicopter, Capt. Cleland reached for a grenade he believed had become dislodged from his web gear. Later it was discovered that the grenade belonged to a young soldier new to the theater. That soldier had improperly prepared the grenade pin for easy detonation and had dropped it while coming off the helicopter. The grenade exploded and severely injured Capt. Cleland.

The Silver Star is the third-highest valor decoration of the United States. Sen. Cleland also was awarded a Soldier's Medal, Bronze Star, Republic of Vietnam Campaign Medal with Device (1960), Vietnam Service Medal, National Defense Service Medal and Parachutist Badge.

Thank you for your interest in Sen. Cleland and your interest in the campaign.

Tommy Thompson

Campaign manager, Atlanta Link

[fish hawk]

Ann is right, they are wrong, end of story. Cleland is a horses ass, not a hero. He sould be ashamed of letting people call him "hero" when in his own mind he knows he dropped a grenade on the way to a beer party, and was stupid enough to pick it up. Hey, not everyone that puts on a uniform is a hero, some are just plain jerks. IMHO

[river rat]

Neither Kerry or Cleland - regardless of any heroic performance or horrific losses they may have suffered - are immune to being challenged with the TRUTH...

As rude or painful as Ann's attack may be -- the charges by Kerry and Cleland against others have not be very considerate or truthful...

Cleland and Kerry have not been mute when it comes to mouthing insulting charges against men that served that same era --- and personally, I'm glad someone is shoving that crap back at them....

Neither Kerry or Cleland have been bashful about insulting me or the 100's of thousands of men that served honorably or died in that conflict... If they don't wish to be slammed with deserved insults - they should STFU...

Both of these clymers profited handsomely by their "service"...
My brothers that were killed, maimed or withdrew into the dark corners of their minds --- didn't do so well..

Semper Fi

[Qwinn]

Okay, you may have pointed it out. Kudos to you if you did. But no one called Cleland and asked him if it was true because you posted it.

Ann's got the voice to say it and make people ask if it's true. I'm not saying Ann was the first person to point out the media was lying about Cleland's record - I'm saying she was the first person with enough of a public voice to make people realize that there was deliberate BS going on.

That does matter. An oracle ain't worth much if no one listens or remembers what they said.

Qwinn

[Alter Kaker]

No, it's about time someone said it. If Cleland has been living up some hero record for his injuries, and he got them for something that was just a training acident issue, then Cleland is a LIAR.

In addition to accident, Cleland won Silver Star for Gallantry in battle.

[hole_n_one]

In case anybody missed the Coulter piece, it can be found at this FR thread.

[speedy]

I think you hit on it. Cleland raised this issue himself. Liberals always get hysterical when they imagine that we are questioning their patriotism, but they feel free to question anything -- truthfulness, charity, basic decency -- about our side. They like an unfair fight -- Cleland is a master of this. The kinds of attacks Ann Coulter applies to them are they kinds they routinely apply to us, with the significant difference that what Ann says is demonstrably true. A bit cold at times, maybe, but always true.