Why It’s Islam vs Rest of the World (TROP™ says it's OUR fault.)

The Sunday Indian Express [Bombay] ^ | February 1, 2004 | Tavleen Singh

[Alouette]

I certainly do not excuse the Inquisition, but it seems to me that Stalin's version was far more ferocious than Torquemada's.

[quidnunc]

ItisaReligionofPeace wrote: My friend, you are blinded by your faith. There is not much of that going on right now in the world, thankfully, but it most certainly has occurred in the past, and probably will in the future. I understand that your mind Christianity = good, and Islam = bad. How could you live with yourself if you didn't see things that way?

I am not a religious person but that's neither here nor there.

I have a couple questions for you:

(1) Can you document any (as opposed to 'not much') systematic Christian warfare against non-believers in the name of religion, and

(2) what makes you believe that Christians will again persecute non-Christians in the name of religion?

ItisaReligionofPeace wrote: But they do kill people who they believe are witches. But they do conquer and enslave in the name of God. But they do torture heretics.

Where, which Christians are doing this?

You're simply attempting to deflect attention away from Islam's bloody present onto Christianity's sometimes-violent past.

But the problem today is Muslims, not Christians.

Muslims — not Christians — are waging a religious war against those whom they deem to be infidels.

In the final analysis it's boiled down to either us or the Muslims in a fight to the death.

Everything else is bullbleep!

[BraveMan]

Posters who don't click the article should not miss this . . .

In Davos we were supposed to have heard the voices of moderate Islam but what we ended up hearing, at session after session, was an endless litany of complaints. It was the fault of the West that Islam was being labelled a terrorist religion, the fault of the West that most Muslim rulers were despots, the fault of the West that political issues had been allowed to fester, the fault of the West that Muslim countries had not progressed economically and the fault of the West that Osama bin Laden had got created. In vain I searched to hear one voice that would admit that there must be something deeply wrong in Islamic societies that they had bred the sort of hatred that created so much senseless violence.

[freebilly]

It would, in my view, be a terrible mistake to try and understand the causes of Islamic terrorism. And, please let us call it Islamic since nearly every terrorist act in recent years has been committed by Muslims in the name of their so-called jehad. These terrible acts of violence cannot be excused on political grounds. There have always been political disputes and there always will be but the solution is not terrorism. As for ‘‘socio-economic’’ causes we need to remember that none of the hijackers of 9/11 were poor, illiterate or underprivileged. Many of them have abandoned their repressive home countries for comfortable, middle-class lives in Europe and the United States but were so consumed by hatred of the West that they were prepared to die for it.

Moderate Muslims need to ask why just as they need to ask why, despite all their oil, even rich Muslim countries are unable to create just and enlightened societies instead of ones that produce disaffected, desperate youths who are prepared to give their lives to kill innocent people. If the West is such a terrible place and America Satan incarnate then why do so many Muslims choose to migrate to cities like New York and London? Why are they not happy to live bigoted, blinkered lives in Riyadh and Jeddah?

This is a home run....

[Let's Roll]

Of course - but again these were the acts of men - no where does Jesus command his followers to kill in the name of God or religion.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

I've already told you, the Spanish inquisition for starters. It was very clear that you were tortured if you were a non-believer. The Crusades at varying points of time. My point to you is that right now it is Islam. Not long ago it was Christianity. Anytime you can convince people to do XYZ in the name of religion, you have a probelm...

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

You are correct in most of what you say. Very well said.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Well, I think it is very accurate to say that a huge majority of Muslims are peaceful. Otherwise we'd have some real problems!

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Very short memory my friend. Probably not much foresight either...

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Not still, but when the religion was around 1400 years old, yes, it certainly did.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Do/Did, it is all a matter of historical perspective. Luckily, Christianity has adapted pretty well after 2000 years.

[quidnunc]

ItisaReligionofPeace wrote: I've already told you, the Spanish inquisition for starters. It was very clear that you were tortured if you were a non-believer. The Crusades at varying points of time. My point to you is that right now it is Islam. Not long ago it was Christianity. Anytime you can convince people to do XYZ in the name of religion, you have a probelm...

The Inquisition, the Thirty Years War, the Salem witch trials and the like took place centuries ago — CENTURIES!

Jihad took place TODAY, and will take place again tomorrow, or the next day at the latest.

And the two principal Hajj sermons preached at Mecca in the last few days specifically sanctified jihad.

You got that?

Jihad was preached at Islam's holiest place during Islam's holiest event by Islam's two most influential clerics.

[freebilly]

Not still, but when the religion was around 1400 years old, yes, it certainly did.

Yeah, a couple of things have changed with Christianity over the past 1400 years. A lot has changed in 1400 years with Islam, too.

You mean it hasn't...?

[freebilly]

Do/Did, it is all a matter of historical perspective.

No, it's a matter of current facts.

[EGPWS]

It was the duty of the West to not just help resolve these political issues fairly but also help solve some of the socio-economic problems of the Islamic world. Then, the world would be at peace once more and we could live without the threat of suicide bombers.

However, with recent events, we can no longer put forth an agenda that is in sync with your train of thought for WE ARE BUSY DEFENDING OUR WAY OF LIFE BECAUSE OF THE THREAT OF FANATICAL PEOPLE THAT YOU APPEAR TO WANT TO DEFEND YOU PUTZ!!

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

How old was Christianity back in the centuries that you mentioned? How old is Islam?

[freebilly]

How old was Christianity back in the centuries that you mentioned? How old is Islam?

Guess we'll have to wait another 400-500 years before Islam reforms itself. Thanks for enlightening us all.

[ItisaReligionofPeace]

Well, the non-believers back when Christianity was being abusive had to wait...

[freebilly]

Sell it somewhere else. You're not going to convince me, and I'll save my future comments for someone smart enough to distinguish between 2004 AD and 704 AD.