New Read on 'Rings,' Double Standard on Slurs (Lord of the Rings is Racist)

Fox News ^ | Dec. 29, 2003 | Scott Norvell

[MorningCoffee]

The deep thinkers at Indymedia have come to the conclusion that the "Lord of the Rings" trilogy paints a "racist stereotypical tapestry" that does a disservice to young viewers everywhere.

Lloyd Hart says people of color are all associated with the Dark Lord Sauron in the movie and the elephant-riding mercenaries too closely resemble the cultures of Africa, Persia and East Asia. The Uruk-hai also too closely resemble Native Americans, which is sure to cause "a great deal of cultural and racial alienation."

[TheMilkMan]

Speaking of Bilbo, how is it he doesn't know what has happened at the end of the movie? I recall he asks for his ring and Frodo tells him he lost it. My wife has suggested it is because Bilbo is super old and has become senile.

[DManA]

Sounds right to me. Plus he spent most of his time sleeping towards the end.

[DManA]

Sounds right to me. Plus he spent most of his time sleeping towards the end.

[TheMilkMan]

I am surprised that Lloyd Hart wasn't offended that a person afflicted with Bipolar Disorder was immolated in a pool of lava.

[Cronos]

And if he WAS a Mexican, that should actually be a soruce of pride -- the Fetts, no Jedi powers, lone rangers yet Boba became a guy even Jedi feared.

[MrConfettiMan]

How dare you excite me during my breakfast, you foul temptress! :)

[Citizen of the Savage Nation]

What a moron. The story of Middle Earth and LOTR in particular, are in essence intended to be a fictionous account of the pre-history of England. So of course, the good guys are white guys and the bad guys are a mix of white and non-white.

With the logic of this idiot, then all the folk tales of the Arabians, Vikings, Chinese, Egyptians, etc are also 'racist' because they all portray themselves as the good guys and people different from themselves as the bad guys.

[Gothmog]

Damn it, I think you're right. It sounded (to me) like they were were chanting GOTH-mog, but it must have been GROND. I think Grond might have been Gothmog's hammer. Now, maybe if they had been chanting Gothmog they would've won.

By the way, Gothmog was not just 'some' Balrog -- he was Melkor's son, the heir apparent, Captain of Angband! Ha ha ha. Remember, Sauron was only Melkor's 'lieutenant.'

Anyway, I thought they were chanting Gothmog at the time and I thought it was pretty cool, so I'll remember it that way, ha ha ha. But thanks for the official correction.

[JenB]

It's been a while since I've read Silmarillion, but your Gothmog bits sound like what I remember... but you should know, it's your name. Interesting choice for a screen name, by the way.

I think Grond was Gothmog's hammer, yes. Certainly the battering ram was named after a famous hammer called Grond. I remember that much.

Heh, all those poor little hippie kids who got named "Galadriel" at least have their names in a movie.... those of us with normal names missed out. Except for the Sams.

[Gothmog]

Thanks, your version is much better.

"For a while she was silent, as if pondering what this might mean. Then suddenly she laid her hand on his arm. ‘You are a stern lord and resolute,’ she said; ‘and thus do men win renown.’ She paused. ‘Lord.’ she said, ‘if you must go, then let me ride in your following. For I am weary of skulking in the hills, and wish to face peril and battle.’"

This is my problem with ultra-socialist Vigo's portrayal of Aragorn. IMHO it was somewhat true to the books that Aragorn was comfortable allowing Gandalf to lead the company and somewhat distressed that his friend had supposedly fallen in Moira. But, Jackson's decision to highlight the Arwen/Aragorn relationship led to a much more wimpy portrayal of Aragorn.

The action scenes with Aragorn are quite good, but all the mooning about Arwen was disappointing. Viggo's wimpy portrayal is really the most significant problem with the 3 movies. But Liv Tyler as Arwen was great. She almost makes up for the loss.

[HairOfTheDog]

How dare you excite me during my breakfast, you foul temptress! :)

You will always read Tolkien a little differently now huh!

[HairOfTheDog]

The action scenes with Aragorn are quite good, but all the mooning about Arwen was disappointing. Viggo's wimpy portrayal is really the most significant problem with the 3 movies. But Liv Tyler as Arwen was great. She almost makes up for the loss.

I don't think showing a guy in love is wimpy.... I think it is sweet! ;~D Guys.... sheesh.

[HairOfTheDog]

Found another section I should have quoted, because PJ used this dialogue...

‘Shall I always be chosen?’ she said bitterly. ‘Shall I always be left behind when the Riders depart, to mind the house while they win renown, and find food and beds when they return?’

‘A time may come soon,’ said he, ‘when none will return. Then there will be need of valour without renown, for none shall remember the deeds that are done in the last defence of your homes. Yet the deeds will not be less valiant because they are unpraised.’

And she answered: ‘All your words are but to say: you are a woman, and your part is in the house. But when the men have died in battle and honour, you have leave to be burned in the house, for the men will need it no more. But I am of the House of Eorl and not a serving-woman. I can ride and wield blade, and I do not fear either pain or death.’

‘What do you fear, lady?’ he asked.

‘A cage,’ she said. ‘To stay behind bars, until use and old age accept them, and all chance of doing great deeds is gone beyond recall or desire.’

‘And yet you counselled me not to adventure on the road that I had chosen, because it is perilous?’

‘So may one counsel another,’ she said. ‘Yet I do not bid you flee from peril, but to ride to battle where your sword may win renown and victory. I would not see a thing that is high and excellent cast away needlessly.’

‘Nor would I,’ he said. ‘Therefore I say to you, lady: Stay! For you have no errand to the South.’

‘Neither have those others who go with thee. They go only because they would not be parted from thee - because they love thee.’ Then she turned and vanished into the night.

[Gothmog]

I don't think showing a guy in love is wimpy either. I thought the way Jackson arranged to have Arwen (in the place of Glorfindel) save Frodo from the wringraiths just before the ford in the first movie -- where she took over from Aragon -- was touching. He had a conflict -- she could complete the mission, but at the risk of her own life. They made a good team.

But in a good portion of the rest of the scenes of their relationship, Vigo portrayed Aragorn as a weepy-eyed, gape-mouthed, sofa-lounging cypher. What woman loves that sort of man?

IMHO the Aragorn-Arwen relationship was a reflection of the Luthien-Beren love story from the Silmarilion. While the L-B love story was touching, Luthien and Beren also teamed-up to enter Melkor's stronghold and regain one of the Silmarilions. That was a tough assignment.

Meanwhile, in the LOTR movies you've got Aragorn swooning all over the place. And the decision to 'go get the dead' in the movie was portrayed as a last minute desperation ploy. I think the passage you excerpted was more indicative of Tolkien's intention of the true character of Aragorn.

In short, he -- and Gandalf -- had known for some time that he would have to pursue this course. But in the movie it's a desperate move. IMHO, from the book Aragorn already knew he had to make that move, and was ready to do it. And that's why Eowyn was attracted to him.

And in the ROTK movie he can't even beat a large orc at the end. Some hero. Other than Vigo the dim-witted, weepy-eyed socialist, it was an admirable effort.

[keri]

Gothmog was *lord of the Balrogs* and was slain by Ecthelion the elf-lord during the sack of Gondolin, and Ecthelion was killed by Gothmog. "They slew each other." The Balrogs were Maiar - helpers and servants of the Valar in Valinor, until Melkor persuaded some to join him in evil.

Where did you find that Gothmog was Melkor's son? Melkor never had a son, that I remember. Maybe JenB can shed some light on this.

[P.O.E.]

Well, somebody's got to go after the bogeymen

[JenB]

It's in some of the older stories. Rough drafts, if you will. It did not get included in the "real" Silmarillion. Tolkien originally concieved of children for several of the Valar. That disappears... in fact, the only spirit-creature known to have a child is Melian the Maia, who wed Thingol and whose daughter was Luthien.

[Mike-o-Matic]

What I want to know is, what have THESE TWO been smoking??!?

[keri]

Thank you. I can see how the confusion would come about.

[JenB]

Yes, when one has read Silmarillion, and the Book of Lost Tales, and Unfinished Tales, and the "History of Middle Earth" series, it all tends to run together.

Heh. Tolkien is my one area of expertise. Does that make me racist?